DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Discussion of INLAND EMPIRE

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applesnoranges
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Re: re

Postby applesnoranges » Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:10 am

TheMysteryMan wrote:The story is something that filters through multiple characters and identities. The person we perceive as Sue, once Nikki enters the Axxonn door, is literally and figuratively a world apart from the Sue we saw portrayed in the OHIBT scenes. And when we return to behind the scenes of OHIBT, after the screwdriver scene, the film has completely changed as well. It began as a southern gothic melodrama and ends as this urban tragedy. Sue is different from the OHIBT Sue right from the point she enters the Axxonn door, and then we meet the woman talking to Mr. K, who through a nonlinear chronology we learn went through another Axxonn door before she met Mr. K, which could account for this seeming other switch in identity.

What I've been thinking for a while is that, in a way, Sue can be seen as played by two people, Nikki and the woman in the monolog. (And we see both on the street for a while, which is what MichaelPW is taking apart in another thread.)

But (and I said this on another of these threads but can't find it right now), what has recently caught my attention is about "it had to do with the telling of time". It seems the woman on the street can't get into the club until it is the right time for her to be let in (Mr. K. etc. are waiting for Piotrek to get the gun and make it back to the US story). Then, Mr. K. says, "Yeah ... still here." They are checking to see how much time they have.

So, Piotrek gets the gun and is sent back into the story in California "” but now I see that he is sent as Nikki's husband, the most powerful guy around, who pulled some strings and got her the part. But how does a simple person like the guy we saw at the séance become a big shot like Nikki's husband? He is not the one who was sent back: Peter Lucas was and he is an actor. That's why he's introducing Dern to Mr. and Mrs. Zydowicz; he's playing himself and Dern is playing herself, meeting some relatives of Marek Zydowicz in Poland. I've gone back and forth about this, but I think this is the view that MPW was leaning toward (yes?) and it makes sense to me now. So he becomes the man in the green coat who scares Nikki into the house and traps her there as Sue.

As for the monolog woman, it seems they were just waiting for someone almost at the end of her life to come along and they could take a few things out of what she said and build the story they needed out of it for Nikki to play.
When she returns to OHIBT shortly after leaving Mr. K, the film is different. Has Axxonn really brought her back to her original life as Nikki, or is that not cemented until she frees the Lost Girl?

I stopped rambling above where I did because this is what puzzles me too. If Dern turned her head at the end and saw herself getting the part again on the couch, the movie would be a simple loop. But she turns her head and sees something else, a contented version of herself. The only thing that comes to mind about this right now is what Lynch said about Fred in LH: Sometimes people get caught in a vicious circle, but it's possible to get out of that circle. So in his mind there is hope for Fred, even though we don't see it. (btw Barry Gifford saw it opposite. At the west coast premier he held a Q&A and someone asked where is the redemption. Gifford said, "Sometimes there is no redemption." Just a titbit.)

By that point, though, isn't he already part of the Hollywood story? I'm fairly convinced that the Phantom has already possessed her by then (by the scene where she walks on the path in that spotlight with the Phantom grin on her face) and she doesn't need to lure him.

I guess I don't have the order of events as presented memorized yet. I thought the path scene came later, right after the phantom showed up missing in the scene at the shed in the woods. Gordy says he mumbled something about Inland Empire, and then we see the face on the path.
Perhaps she only did it because he made her, and his intention was to plant the knowledge in Doris Side's head that this is the woman she was previously instructed to kill. If this is so, he seems to have been around from the time the project got underway, as we see the interrogation scene with her before Nikki goes through Axxonn the first time. Perhaps he knew to go as soon as he heard about the remake.

Yes, the interrogation scene just busts its way into the movie with no warning. So I've thought that the phantom made it happen. I guess I meant that even though it appeared earlier, what we see in the confrontation is how it happened. Going by: that is how Bob got into Twin Peaks, through people's fear etc. In that way, the phantom could be a name for what happens when people break down, when their human relationships don't hold everything together. So, that confrontation scene illustrates what she said in the station. Yes, everything seems out of order. If we see Devon dead in MTTH (or Billy, whoever it is), who's playing Billy in the Sides' home or how did Billy come back to life? As you say, this is what a different Sue sees. Looking at it from the beginning, I don't think any of this can ever be completely untangled because every effort has been made to be sure that won't happen. That way, the story, as a kind of dream, is an object in itself that never opens to reveal anything behind itself.
You probably just answered your own question, haha--he doesn't sit in Mr. K's chair because it would make the movie somewhat easier to explain. It almost seems like Lynch did his best to construct this Rubik's cube of a movie where you can never quite get all the colors to line up on each side. One theory gives you four sides that match, but the other two won't line up and never will.

Touché. But if he sits in the interviewee's chair, then he is telling Mr. K. about the séance and hearing the details of the story that will come from what the monolog woman says, what his and the other rabbits' missions will be, etc.
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Postby MichaelPW » Sun Apr 06, 2008 9:00 am

It seems that Piotrek somehow assumes that it is not Nicki who is invited to the older persons, but someone like Lost Girl. I don`t think that he`s in the pattern "Oh, for my parents there has to be the appearance that she can Polish at least a little bit". Rather he seems to be convinced that she can that language. Maybe we don`t see Mr. Grace in the whole movie. Maybe that`s why the ninety years old niece wants to know who Smithie plays. But otherwise I assume (at least somewhat) that the ninety years old niece is woman in white after some decades.
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Postby applesnoranges » Tue Apr 08, 2008 8:23 am

MichaelPW wrote:It seems that Piotrek somehow assumes that it is not Nicki who is invited to the older persons, but someone like Lost Girl. I don`t think that he`s in the pattern "Oh, for my parents there has to be the appearance that she can Polish at least a little bit". Rather he seems to be convinced that she can that language.

I am starting to put some of the things we and others have talked about into a bigger picture. Now I am fairly convinced that what we are seeing here is a portrayal of Mr. and Mrs. Zydowicz by other actors and a portrayal by Lucas and Dern of themselves. I know I argued against this before, but now it makes sense. This now seems to me to be a scene of Laura Dern arriving in Poland and being introduced to some Polish people in the building where Nikki will perform. I'll go into it below.
Maybe we don`t see Mr. Grace in the whole movie.

There wouldn't be a Mr. Grace because there wouldn't be a Nikki Grace. It is such a stylized name that it could only be a stage name. Nikki only has that name inside Visitor #1's story. As if V1 were saying to her, "Let's imagine that tomorrow you become a famous actress named ... Nikki Grace." She must be named that in IE because that is her function, to find grace for LG through Sue Blue, another fantasy sounding name. Blue is an old expression for sad, so their names describe what they are to represent.
Maybe that`s why the ninety years old niece wants to know who Smithie plays. But otherwise I assume (at least somewhat) that the ninety years old niece is woman in white after some decades.

I'm not following what you say in either case, not only because I don't know why you say she is the woman in white (an interesting idea) but because I don't understand that line at all anyway. Why is she a niece? Whose niece? And why 90? So, what are you seeing here?

:arrow: Now, back to the first point, the introduction to Mr. and Mrs. Zydowicz:

Adding to what I was saying a few days ago: When Piotrek picks up the gun, he is brought back into the story at the beginning. First I noticed that he brought the gun into the bedroom and placed it in the drawer, then I read that Nikki's husband may have got her the part so that is why he is on the stairs: he was brought from one upstairs room to another. So, he gets Nikki the part, then scares her on the set in the green coat, which traps her in Smithy's house as Sue so that he can enter and plant the gun. Sue's story is being created for Nikki out of the things the monolog woman said and one of the things she said was that he took something out of the drawer; in the story, she is mistaken because he was putting something in the drawer.

So next I asked myself: How can this simple, sweet man that we saw at the séance become Piotrek Król, "the most powerful guy around"? He doesn't. It was not him who was brought into the American story but Peter Lucas, who is an actor! (When he said, "the one I work for", he did not mean only Gordy, but Marek Zydowicz who played his part and was the real one he, Lucas, worked for in Poland, part of the management of the film.)

So this scene is where he shows up in the movie again, at the beginning. We don't know who "Mr. and Mrs. Zydowicz" are, and it doesn't matter: what matters is that they have the same last name as a real person in our world (the one Lucas works for). They are played by other actors. This identifies the level of reality of the scene: This is a fictionalized portrayal of some real people (Marek's parents perhaps, or aunt and uncle or someone else). Therefore, the characters portrayed by Lucas and Dern in this scene are also fictionalized representations of real people: themselves!
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby MichaelPW » Fri Apr 11, 2008 9:39 am

applesnoranges wrote:This now seems to me to be a scene of Laura Dern arriving in Poland and being introduced to some Polish people in the building where Nikki will perform.


I don`t know whether they are in Poland or in California. Somehow Mr. and Mrs. Zydowicz seem to have a travel behind them. But, yes, maybe they are in Poland. Still wonder why Piotrek seems so convinced that she can Polish. As the most powerful man who knows everything he should know to what extent she can Polish. But it can be that he`s not Piotrek here, but fictionalized Peter Lucas. Peter Lucas should know to what extent Laura Dern can Polish, but as a fictionalized one he could wonder about it.

It is such a stylized name that it could only be a stage name.


Thank you for that hint. Think that I looked what Grace means, but it seems that I didn`t think about it enough. Very good point. So we have a "Dern"-dimension here reaching from Sue Blue to Nikki Grace. But within in this dimension somehow the middle field is lost ( :idea: ). What is in this middle field? Maybe Lost Girl? Maybe someone who regards herself as halfborn?! But we know that we have reality in this middle field - normality. And who knows that, too? Maybe the woman who sits besides Kinski in the end?!

And what is outside of such a dimension (playing off the board)? Probably the monolog woman. Maybe Mr. K wonders where she`s within the dimension and discovers that she isn`t.

Nikki only has that name inside Visitor #1's story.


I don`t think that Visitor 1 has a story. It seems that Visitor 1 is a dimension-free rabbit. Also a dimension-free rabbit takes place in the room where Mr. K is. Monolog woman seems to be a dimension-free person, too. Or, let`s say, that she`s in another dimension than Nikki Grace and Sue Blue are. Obviously she`s in a dimension reaching from pschological disorder to seeing things very clearly. In the middle field we can assume "normality".

As if V1 were saying to her, "Let's imagine that tomorrow you become a famous actress named ... Nikki Grace."


The "problem" with that is that we already have a "Grace-environment" before Visitor 1 enters the house. It seems that Visitor 1 continues that pole of a dimension with the help of magic.

She must be named that in IE because that is her function, to find grace for LG through Sue Blue, another fantasy sounding name.


Probably there is no grace for Lost Girl, but wonderful reality. I assume that Nikki Grace, Sue Blue and Lost Girl are one identity in one dimension. Reality is missing within that dimension.

I'm not following what you say in either case, not only because I don't know why you say she is the woman in white (an interesting idea) but because I don't understand that line at all anyway. Why is she a niece? Whose niece? And why 90? So, what are you seeing here?


Those are more intuitive ideas. We have one unknown variable asking about another unknown variable when we here that "the ninety year old niece wants to know who Smithy plays". I like that "Dern" opens her eyes during "ancient" and "Smithy". It seems that the Polish scenes come from a time some decades ago (cars). It seems that the making of 4 7 are some decades ago. So we could easily assume that one who`s very interested in who`s playing Smithy in OHIBT is one who has an important "role" within the circumstances of 4 7. The two leads are dead, lost girl isn`t in the position to ask. So the murderer could have a "flashback" of those times, feeling guilty maybe. Otherwise the ninety year old niece seems to be someone similar to the one in MD who said that someone is in trouble. btw - I opened a thread here within the MD thread. Maybe you can answer me there where aunt Ruth lived - or give me a hint :) . I discovered the ten hints by David Lynch, after I watched MD again. Will look it again with those hints. But first I will look MTTH.

he was brought from one upstairs room to another.


They seem to be very different. One as the mighties man of the town and one who was given the pistol. Think that the costumes are different.

So, he gets Nikki the part, then scares her on the set in the green coat, which traps her in Smithy's house as Sue so that he can enter and plant the gun.


He seems to hold to lost girl. He seems to do nothing against the bonds of marriage. Also Janek has a green coat I think.

Sue's story is being created for Nikki out of the things the monolog woman said and one of the things she said was that he took something out of the drawer; in the story, she is mistaken because he was putting something in the drawer.


I have to watch MTTH to have all informations about that drawer. Will do that in the very near future.
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby applesnoranges » Fri Apr 11, 2008 1:33 pm

MichaelPW wrote:I don`t know whether they are in Poland or in California. Somehow Mr. and Mrs. Zydowicz seem to have a travel behind them. But, yes, maybe they are in Poland. Still wonder why Piotrek seems so convinced that she can Polish. As the most powerful man who knows everything he should know to what extent she can Polish. But it can be that he`s not Piotrek here, but fictionalized Peter Lucas. Peter Lucas should know to what extent Laura Dern can Polish, but as a fictionalized one he could wonder about it.

I don't know if it is Poland or California either; I should have said only that she is being introduced to someone from Poland. I think the scene can be seen both ways; as Nikki and Piotrek and as Dern and Lucas. The name Zydowicz is there to demonstrate the Dern and Lucas possibility. And ... I still don't see why you think Piotrek has doubt about how much Polish she speaks. When he says, "I think she understands more than she lets on.", That "I think" does not seem to be to indicate doubt; it is just a polite and affectionate way of saying that she does understand some Polish. That is viewing the scene as Nikki and Piotrek.

Thank you for that hint. Think that I looked what Grace means, but it seems that I didn`t think about it enough. Very good point. So we have a "Dern"-dimension here reaching from Sue Blue to Nikki Grace. But within in this dimension somehow the middle field is lost ( :idea: ). What is in this middle field? Maybe Lost Girl? Maybe someone who regards herself as halfborn?!

I see what you are saying and that seems to be what the movie is about.
But we know that we have reality in this middle field - normality. And who knows that, too? Maybe the woman who sits besides Kinski in the end?!

Not sure I understand this. Something is resolved for all the characters. There are two Dern characters at the end on opposite sides of the street and something happens to each of them. One ends up in the rabbit room and the other dressed in blue on the couch. I'm not sure what either means or how to describe it.
And what is outside of such a dimension (playing off the board)? Probably the monolog woman. Maybe Mr. K wonders where she`s within the dimension and discovers that she isn`t.

If you mean the monolog woman herself and not Nikki's portrayal of her, then she would have to be dead to see Mr. K., if he is a divine personage. She's played all her cards and is at the mercy of whatever happens. She tells him about the past, which she can't understand, but doesn't know what is going on now. But it turns out that something is going on, as she overhears on his telephone conversation. I'm guessing that it was the Nikki version of her who overheard this and that she didn't run away because she was frightened of Crimp, but because she understood what was happening and was in a hurry to get to the death scene before it was too late.

As if V1 were saying to her, "Let's imagine that tomorrow you become a famous actress named ... Nikki Grace."

The "problem" with that is that we already have a "Grace-environment" before Visitor 1 enters the house. It seems that Visitor 1 continues that pole of a dimension with the help of magic.

I am assuming here that we don't have a Grace-envioronment, if you mean her name. Her name is not mentioned. Even Henry the Butler only calls her "Madam". Then when V1 points to the couch and she gets the part, the next scene is of Kingsley saying, "Nikki!" I think that when V1 is talking to her she has not yet been born, she is still looking forward to being born. I guess that embryonic state could be called grace, but I am talking about her name as an indicator of who she is. Then V1 "suggests" that she see herself on the couch getting the part and the rest of what we see is the imagined version of what might happen after she is born. When she is born she will be given a name, but it might be anything. Nikki seems to me only an "as if" name provided by V1.

Probably there is no grace for Lost Girl, but wonderful reality. I assume that Nikki Grace, Sue Blue and Lost Girl are one identity in one dimension. Reality is missing within that dimension.

I don't know technically what "grace" is; I have no religious background. But the ballerina at the end has grace in the normal use of the word. I guess the problem you are pointing to is that if Lost Girl's plight is resolved in V1's story with her family reunion, then how did LG see V1 on TV? It may not be a grace-environment but there does seem to be a LG-environment, though one without reality. It is a confusing loop of logic.
Otherwise the ninety year old niece seems to be someone similar to the one in MD who said that someone is in trouble.

Yes, very similar! We are given tempting hints though that we can identify her....
btw - I opened a thread here within the MD thread. Maybe you can answer me there where aunt Ruth lived - or give me a hint :)

I think the hint says: "Where is Aunt Ruth?" People answer this in different ways but for me, Aunt Ruth is in her apartment and has never gone anywhere. She is wearing the same outfit when she looks into the bedroom after the falling of the blue box that she was wearing when she picked up her keys. So it seems that for her no time has passed and there were never a Betty and Rita in her apartment. There is no robe on the bed with a note pinned to it, etc. I'll look at that board and see what is going on there.
he was brought from one upstairs room to another.

They seem to be very different. One as the mighties man of the town and one who was given the pistol. Think that the costumes are different.

Yes, they are different. That is why I am saying that it was not that man who was sent into the American story with the gun but Peter Lucas himself. He becomes the most powerful guy around because he is an actor and so he can become anyone! That is why I am saying that he "understands" that "the one I work for" is Marek Zydowicz, just as his Polish circus character worked for Zydowicz's character, Gordy. That is why the old couple are named Zydowicz.
So, he gets Nikki the part, then scares her on the set in the green coat, which traps her in Smithy's house as Sue so that he can enter and plant the gun.

He seems to hold to lost girl. He seems to do nothing against the bonds of marriage. Also Janek has a green coat I think.

I don't know. He's not married to Lost Girl, is he? Anyway, Piotrek Król, the most powerful guy around, is someone else. It is Peter Lucas who does the bidding of the Polish Piotrek by playing the part of the one in California. Janek's coat is ... maybe a little bit green, maybe not, but not much. The Man in the Green Coat is very definite. He's the guy in back of the window when Nikki/Sue is running. He puts that green coat in the drawer with the gun on it so Nikki can put the whole story together when she sees it at the end.

Sue's story is being created for Nikki out of the things the monolog woman said and one of the things she said was that he took something out of the drawer; in the story, she is mistaken because he was putting something in the drawer.

I have to watch MTTH to have all informations about that drawer. Will do that in the very near future.

I am only talking about things in the feature here. MTTH just shows a little more of it but it's the same. In the feature she says that her husband was planning something, something with her in mind. The only thing that is added in MTTH she says that he is hiding something and getting something out of the drawer. She talks about him turning off the light by the bed. This is more of what we see in the feature when Sue first enters Smithy's House. We see him turning out the light by the bed. Then there is a scene where she comes home with groceries and he is sneaking around in the hallway. He has just put the gun in the drawer and then he turns the corner into the main hall and enters the doorway on the right that we know from the end leads into the rabbit warren of the Inland Empire.
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby MichaelPW » Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:39 am

applesnoranges wrote:The name Zydowicz is there to demonstrate the Dern and Lucas possibility.


Or to have a connection to the making of 4 7 as an European movie. That would fit to Piotrek as the mightiest man who knows everything. Nikki could have told him that she makes a movie which is a remake. She could have told him that she didn`t understand some things. To help her he could have invited people who had something to do with the making of 4 7. He could think that when she makes a movie which once had something to do with Poland it would be probable that she is able to speak Polish a little bit.

When he says, "I think she understands more than she lets on.", That "I think" does not seem to be to indicate doubt; it is just a polite and affectionate way of saying that she does understand some Polish.


That`s one way of seeing it. But to me that "I think" seems to indicate doubt. Or at least - maybe a lighter form - to indicate that he really thinks that way. And maybe there are two possible reasons. One could be that he thinks that she knows about Polish things, another could be that he thinks that that would be a necessary condition for his own intentions.

One ends up in the rabbit room and the other dressed in blue on the couch.


I think that those are the same. The one in the rabbit room is at the "end of the fight". We have a black (end) screen. The one dressed in blue besides Kinski seems to be rewarded. They all seem to be in "Valhalla", where they raise their glasses again.

Still thinking about the meaning about the leaving of the Marine`s sister and then having Niko on her place. The asian woman suggested a bad hereafter for Niko, but here she looks quite ok. But maybe it is after the hereafter. Also we have no shit of the ape.

In Lynch 2 David Lynch gives concrete instructions for the way of dancing. So probably there`s also a "special meaning".

I'm guessing that it was the Nikki version of her who overheard this and that she didn't run away because she was frightened of Crimp, but because she understood what was happening and was in a hurry to get to the death scene before it was too late.


I don`t know what you exactly mean with "overhear". And I don`t know whether there`s a connection between her leaving and the telephone conversation. Could be or could be not. Also that we hear his telephone conversation and see two As could mean something special. No clear idea comes to mind why she is leaving at that point. Maybe because she is someone who doesn`t know exactly what she does. Another question is, if people usually are able to leave Mr. K when being with him. If not, magic could be a way to do something which usually isn`t possible.

I am assuming here that we don't have a Grace-envioronment, if you mean her name.


I mean things that could imply a name like "Grace" like living in a luxurious house, having an headwaiter, etc.

Then when V1 points to the couch and she gets the part, the next scene is of Kingsley saying, "Nikki!"


Yes, but the significant change I think is getting the part and not having a new name. It`s somehow strange that Kingsley says something like "What I said to Devon I meant righteous". Nikki could think: "So what you say to me is not righteous?"

I think that when V1 is talking to her she has not yet been born, she is still looking forward to being born.


Think now that the "halfborn" comes from "Axxon N.". A, on and N. are ready so far. But the question is what to fill in for the Xes. Bad luck or good luck? A life for Nikki with good luck or with bad luck. The phantom is "just" an appearance. He`s not the one who decides. The one who decides is oneself in the philosphy of David Lynch I think. So when she snaps and the crossed LB has changed, that could mean that she "turns the light on".

Thank you for that Lost Girl = opposite of good luck hint. Yes, the monolog woman was 20 years old in 1939. Where was she there? I assume on the street saying "Look at me and tell me if you`ve seen me before.".

Then V1 "suggests" that she see herself on the couch getting the part and the rest of what we see is the imagined version of what might happen after she is born.


I think that V1 has "constitutional might". Think that she not only shows her a possibility, but really changes the reality of her.

Yes, very similar!


Maybe the ninety year old niece is the one we see after the buying a lucky watch scene. Maybe she doesn`t say "Sieben", but Smithy. Another possibility is that the ninety year old niece is someone who isn`t 90, but 87.

I think the hint says: "Where is Aunt Ruth?" People answer this in different ways but for me, Aunt Ruth is in her apartment and has never gone anywhere.


Yes, that`s the hint. I don`t know, if there`s anywhere an information from which one can conclude that. There are interesting hints and I will examine them. In the past I thought from such scenes like in which the killer has a blue different key, that things cannot be "solved" in that movie to some degree. But the hints suggest a deeper possible understanding.

He becomes the most powerful guy around because he is an actor and so he can become anyone!


Yes, that could be a good possible explanation.

Janek's coat is ... maybe a little bit green, maybe not, but not much.


I would say that Janek`s coat is green. Not as full green as is the coat of Piotrek. There`s a probabilty that the rabbits mean Piotrek, but there`s also a probabilty that they mean Janek. They could ask: "Who let the phantom in?" Or: "Who showed Piotrek a solution-way?"
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby applesnoranges » Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:18 pm

MichaelPW wrote:Or to have a connection to the making of 4 7 as an European movie. That would fit to Piotrek as the mightiest man who knows everything. Nikki could have told him that she makes a movie which is a remake. She could have told him that she didn`t understand some things. To help her he could have invited people who had something to do with the making of 4 7. He could think that when she makes a movie which once had something to do with Poland it would be probable that she is able to speak Polish a little bit.

Those might be possible if it were any other name than Zydowicz. But it is specifically Zydowicsz for a reason.
That`s one way of seeing it. But to me that "I think" seems to indicate doubt. Or at least - maybe a lighter form - to indicate that he really thinks that way. And maybe there are two possible reasons. One could be that he thinks that she knows about Polish things, another could be that he thinks that that would be a necessary condition for his own intentions.

He smiles when he is saying it, almost teasing her, making a joke. Of course he doesn't know exactly how many words and phrases she knows, but the point is she knows a little Polish. Then she confirms it by adding to his sentence, "... but I don't speak it." It mirrors what Lost Girl said. That is the only meaning I see in it.
One ends up in the rabbit room and the other dressed in blue on the couch.

I think that those are the same. The one in the rabbit room is at the "end of the fight". We have a black (end) screen. The one dressed in blue besides Kinski seems to be rewarded. They all seem to be in "Valhalla", where they raise their glasses again.

That is not the scene I meant. I meant that in one Dern is in the rabbit room listening to the applause and not caring and in the other one is the one we see when she completes the turning of her head where Visitor #1 was pointing and sees herself sitting alone in a light blue dress on the couch in her palace.
Still thinking about the meaning about the leaving of the Marine`s sister and then having Niko on her place. The asian woman suggested a bad hereafter for Niko, but here she looks quite ok. But maybe it is after the hereafter. Also we have no shit of the ape.

Yes everyone seems to be celebrating here.
don`t know what you exactly mean with "overhear".

I think it means the same as belauschen http://dict.tu-chemnitz.de/dings.cgi?la ... =&comment=
And I don`t know whether there`s a connection between her leaving and the telephone conversation. Could be or could be not. Also that we hear his telephone conversation and see two As could mean something special. No clear idea comes to mind why she is leaving at that point. Maybe because she is someone who doesn`t know exactly what she does.

Maybe we never really know why anyone does anything, but when he says what he says, she decides to leave. It looks to me to be only one of two things: either she was frightened when he said Crimp was there or she knew that meant that it was time for her to play her part on the street. He says he doesn't think it will be much longer and she leaves.
Another question is, if people usually are able to leave Mr. K when being with him. If not, magic could be a way to do something which usually isn`t possible.

I don't know what you mean. Why wouldn't anyone be able to leave? I see no evidence of it.
Yes, but the significant change I think is getting the part and not having a new name. It`s somehow strange that Kingsley says something like "What I said to Devon I meant righteous". Nikki could think: "So what you say to me is not righteous?"

I have listened to that over and over and I have no idea what he is saying. I've read that on a Mac, as I have, it is possible to read the script; I'll have to see if I can see how it is done. He seems to be talking about something he just said in another room. There is a deleted scene before that; I saw the script for it somewhere on line. The producers and actors all meet in a room and introduce themselves so there is more conversation we don't know. If it had seemed important I think I would have remembered it but I should have bookmarked where I saw it.
IThink now that the "halfborn" comes from "Axxon N.". A, on and N. are ready so far. But the question is what to fill in for the Xes. Bad luck or good luck? A life for Nikki with good luck or with bad luck. The phantom is "just" an appearance. He`s not the one who decides. The one who decides is oneself in the philosphy of David Lynch I think. So when she snaps and the crossed LB has changed, that could mean that she "turns the light on".

Seems to be something like that. I've always thought that Axxon N doesn't mean anything at all though. We hear it pronounced at the beginning so those x's seem to be letters, not algebraic variables. Anyway, I can't guess what the completed word would be.
Thank you for that Lost Girl = opposite of good luck hint. Yes, the monolog woman was 20 years old in 1939. Where was she there? I assume on the street saying "Look at me and tell me if you`ve seen me before.".

That's something to think about. That scene seems very important to me because Lanni and Lori are there and the same age as in Hollywood in 2001. It seems that two people are dreaming of them. (And the curly haired one takes us from one place to the other. So in these dreams the times could be anything. But it does look like maybe 1939 (though I've never seen Poland).

Then V1 "suggests" that she see herself on the couch getting the part and the rest of what we see is the imagined version of what might happen after she is born.

I think that V1 has "constitutional might". Think that she not only shows her a possibility, but really changes the reality of her.

I don't know why you think that but I don't agree; I think the point is that Nikki has some free will to exercise. It is like a test to see if she can be like the dogs who "reason their way through the trickiest situations." (btw I feel more and more sure that Kingsley and Freddy are Suzie and Jane Rabbit and Visitor #1 is Jack. I'm not sure about V2, but whoever she is, she knows about the watch.

Maybe the ninety year old niece is the one we see after the buying a lucky watch scene. Maybe she doesn`t say "Sieben", but Smithy. Another possibility is that the ninety year old niece is someone who isn`t 90, but 87.

Yes, good chance. She says she may not be quite exact with the numbers but it is something close to what she says. Probably so. But why a niece? Whose niece? Who would her aunt or uncle be?

Yes, that`s the hint. I don`t know, if there`s anywhere an information from which one can conclude that. There are interesting hints and I will examine them. In the past I thought from such scenes like in which the killer has a blue different key, that things cannot be "solved" in that movie to some degree. But the hints suggest a deeper possible understanding.

People have different opinions. None of it can be "proved", but like IE, some assumptions lead to more story than others.
I would say that Janek`s coat is green. Not as full green as is the coat of Piotrek. There`s a probabilty that the rabbits mean Piotrek, but there`s also a probabilty that they mean Janek. They could ask: "Who let the phantom in?" Or: "Who showed Piotrek a solution-way?"

OK, but I don't care who let the phantom in. I don't see a reason to care very much. The green coat that is almost waved in our faces is the one Piotrek is wearing behind the window. That's the only reason he's wearing it. Then he leaves it with the gun. We and Lost Girl heard Jack say it was the man in the green coat so we know Jack's secret, but Sue doesn't until she sees it under the gun, then it all falls together for her (for Nikki who plays so, and therefore for Sue.
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby jina » Fri Apr 18, 2008 5:45 am

it's still my second time so i can't follow on the conversation, because i still don't understand a thing!
but about the Rabbit Room. don't you feel like you've seen it before somewhere?
i' m certain i have seen this scene somewhere, or it must be associated with something, i don't know.
and the colors and the lightning in this scene, amazing.
btw , what do you call this color in english?
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby applesnoranges » Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:54 am

jina: I love the confusion of the movie"”it's part of it's beauty. But at the same time, David Lynch has said things such as, "We are all detectives", so all this pondering just continues to be fascinating.

I can't remember seeing exactly that room before but it is certainly the kind of world David Lynch has created before, as in the red room of Twin Peaks. Both of those also remind me of worlds in Jean Cocteau films such as Blood of a Poet and Orpheus. The way they look, the mood of them, etc. If you remember where you saw it that will be interesting.

jina wrote:btw , what do you call this color in english?

It's generally called green.
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby jina » Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:08 am

yes, i love the confusion, too. i love the movie.

sorry, i didn't mean green! i mean the color which the walls are in the rabbit room! :D
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby applesnoranges » Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:39 pm

Then I don't know what you are asking. The exact name of the exact color would depend on the paint company, wouldn't it?

Now that I think about it, it seems like I used to work in that place or one very much like it. The boss rented four adjoining hotel rooms and had two phones installed in each one, then strung all eight wires through the walls so all eight phones were in one room where we called people to try to sell them carpeting. I don't know what all the other rooms were for, but he and one of the women who worked there were always in one of them doing something the rest of us didn't know about.
:lol:
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby MichaelPW » Sat Apr 19, 2008 5:07 pm

jina wrote:i mean the color which the walls are in the rabbit room!


maybe turquoise?
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby applesnoranges » Sat Apr 19, 2008 5:47 pm

Well, again, we only have names we all agree on for a few colors. I might call that color Emerald, but paint companies A, B, and C might call it different names. Here are some to think about: http://www.materials-world.com/paint-co ... lor-08.gif

What abut Meadlowlands or Teal Blast or Marina Bay. Return to Paradise? But that's only one paint company out of many. But I'll bet that since David Lynch came from a painting background he mixed his own. Also, what we see is different as the lights keep changing.
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby jina » Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:14 am

well, there are a lot of different shades, but i thought there was a specific name for this color but anyway, i don't think it matters so much :D
and it's not exactly turquoise 'cause turquoise is closer to blue.

and unfortunately i still can't remember what this reminds me of... but it's not a specific place like applesanorange's hotel job :lol:
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Re: DAVID LYNCH DECODED--INLAND EMPIRE

Postby applesnoranges » Mon Apr 21, 2008 6:22 pm

Personally I would call it Emerald. It's the same color of the hand rails of Winkies in Mulholland Dr. and Lynch is fond of the movie, Wizard of Oz. (i.e. The Emerald City is in Oz, and so are Winkies.)

Have you seen those Cocteau movies? That's what it reminds me of. Some of the red room in Twin Peaks comes straight from them, but the mood is here too. Also, somehow, R. Crumb cartoons. That big stuffed couch, the lamps, the old phone, etc.

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