Episode 27

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LostInTheMovies
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Re: Episode 27

Postby LostInTheMovies » Sun Nov 16, 2014 8:43 pm

Here's one last question that Stephen probably can't answer, but which maybe someone eventually can:

Was there an unwritten (or written?) rule that Laura Palmer's portrait/theme had to end every episode?

I've noticed that the only person (other than Lynch himself) to violate this is Duwayne Dunham in episode 19. Of course he was closer to Lynch than most other directors, so maybe that's why (if it was an actual rule, and not just an "ain't broke, don't fix"/bigger-fish-to-fry convention). Notably - or perhaps just coincidentally - #19 is the ONLY post-mystery episode to feature Laura's image during the episode itself, when Ben holds her portrait up to Hank.
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Re: Episode 27

Postby MoondogJR » Mon Nov 17, 2014 1:26 am

Thanks for all the great feedback! Really interesting.

Brad D wrote:Steve just gave this a fresh watch and we are discussing it tomorrow for "something"... Throw out any other questions and I will make sure they are covered.


Can't wait! :D

Ross wrote: - I've always wondered at what point the red curtains were added? We know the red room only became the Lodge when Lynch directed the finale, so did they go back?
- A shot of Josie during the ending sequence was in the original script.


- Red curtains: I also asked myself this question when I watched it, knowing that the red room wasn't in the original script by Frost for the last episode...
- Shot of Josie in original script. This would support the theory that Ben saw Josie when he looked over his shoulder.
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Brad D
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Re: Episode 27

Postby Brad D » Mon Nov 17, 2014 8:25 am

could have sworn the red room was in the original script for ep 29, but only for one scene. Will have to go back and look.
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Re: Episode 27

Postby BOB1 » Mon Nov 17, 2014 3:14 pm

LostInTheMovies wrote:despite the infamous horse suit

I adore his horsesuit!! That is: their horsesuit. Leo, looks like you finally found your calling! :lol: The forest scene is top. And even better is the insane scene with Major's interrogation when Windom sings about Jupiter and Saturn. And even better is the Project Blue Book video tape (yes, the close-up is unusual, good observation!). Now I know why I like this episode so much -- it's Windom Earle's best episode!
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LostInTheMovies
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Re: Episode 27

Postby LostInTheMovies » Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:28 pm

Brad D wrote:could have sworn the red room was in the original script for ep 29, but only for one scene. Will have to go back and look.


Just read it last night - Coop appears there briefly and a sign pops down from the sky (like a Looney Tunes cartoon kind of thing, I guess?) when he asks where he is, saying "Pittsburgh, dummy!" Then he sees Annie-as-Caroline in a kitchen area and I'm not sure if that was supposed to be a kitchen area in the Red Room or what. Before long it doesn't seem like they're in there anymore but the scene descriptions are kind of vague so it's hard to say.

The whole thing is written without much concern for location or budget so I guess they really didn't have much planned logistically at all and just felt they had to have something on the page for Lynch to spring off from?

That said, I recently read that around '93/'94 or so Frost expressed frustration with Lynch's improvisations (saying it would have taken a lot of work to get the storyline back on track in a third season) even though today he refers to the teleplay as a blueprint with which Lynch could do whatever he wanted.
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Re: Episode 27

Postby MoondogJR » Fri Nov 21, 2014 5:01 am

Brad D wrote:Steve just gave this a fresh watch and we are discussing it tomorrow for "something"... Throw out any other questions and I will make sure they are covered.


Any word on this? :)
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Re: Episode 27

Postby Jonah » Wed Jan 28, 2015 1:59 pm

Just coming to the end of a rewatch. On Episode 27 now! It's always been one of my favourites, and one that is very underrated, so delighted to see a thread about it.

If I didn't know better, I would've thought Lynch directed some scenes, particularly the hand shaking bits, the Giant appearing on the stage, and those closing moments of eerie, desolate shots of Twin Peaks locations, before the camera pans from Bob emerging in the sycamore trees down to the puddle on the ground and we hear the first strains of jazz on the soundtrack and see the red curtains reflected in the oil/water. Absolutely stunning sequence there at the end.

Also love the eerie scene when the camera slowly pan backs as Cooper and Annie talk in the diner, culminating in the shattered plates and that close-up shot of syrup or coffee (or syrup-like coffee) dripping like blood.

I was actually surprised to hear in this thread that Stephen Gyllenhaal came up with the idea of the shaking hands - even though I know it wasn't Lynch who directed - always assumed the concept came from him. (I've always thought it was Bob, too, dipping his soul into Twin Peaks, trying on various hosts to see if anyone fit, planning to possess someone else post-Leland.)

Like others here, I've often wondered how this episode's closing scenes featuring the red room syncs up so well with the final episode, as that was scripted to originally take place in a sort of broken down version of the Great Northern hotel, right? Did they go back and reshoot once Lynch changed the script of 29?

Anyway, great episode, and great thread. Did anything ever come of the interview with Stephen Gyllenhaal in the end? Was it conducted?

J
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Re: Episode 27

Postby LostInTheMovies » Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:19 pm

There was some discussion previously of why the Red Room appears at the end of that episode, given that it wasn't intended to play much of a role in ep. 29. Sure enough, it isn't in the script:

"Suddenly: a series of IMAGES, fast-paced, accompanied by the appropriate music, the sounds of owls, raging wind.

JOSIE screams, trapped within the drawer pull.

CAMERA POV races madly through the woods, headed toward the Black Lodge.

Then, in an instant, quite jarringly - SILENCE, a grove of trees, the air still and calm. An eerie beat. An ARM coalesces in midair, inch by inch, now reaches about testing the cool night, fingers prodding. The wind begins to rise. Satisfied, the arm recedes, disappears.

A beat. BOB'S disembodied HEAD follows. Fierce winds blow, shaking the trees with mighty force. Bob's floating head peers about, now snaps back into a feral HOWL. Then Bob VANISHES in a BLINDING FLASH OF LIGHT.

The winds recede. All is calm again. Save for the patch of SCORCHED earth below."

And Josie was supposed to be in there!
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Re: Episode 27

Postby Brad D » Tue Mar 03, 2015 10:04 am

I did talk to Steve again under the presumption he was re-watching this, and he didnt, so frankly it was tough to get any substantial, uncovered info to share. :|
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Re: Episode 27

Postby Jasper » Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:01 am

Jonah wrote:If I didn't know better, I would've thought Lynch directed some scenes, particularly the hand shaking bits, the Giant appearing on the stage, and those closing moments of eerie, desolate shots of Twin Peaks locations, before the camera pans from Bob emerging in the sycamore trees down to the puddle on the ground and we hear the first strains of jazz on the soundtrack and see the red curtains reflected in the oil/water. Absolutely stunning sequence there at the end.

Also love the eerie scene when the camera slowly pan backs as Cooper and Annie talk in the diner, culminating in the shattered plates and that close-up shot of syrup or coffee (or syrup-like coffee) dripping like blood.


I couldn't agree more. I love all of these things. That slow crawl through different locations, culminating in BOB's arms emergence in Glastonbury Grove is among my favorite sequences in the entire series. It's not just that these moments are fantastic and Lynchian, it's that the suffering of the viewer is finally ending, and this stuff ultimately heralds the triumphant return of Lynch a couple of episodes later.

I happened to be looking at some gifs today . . .

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Imagine if the last six or so episodes never happened and Twin Peaks ended with the same level of quality as the infamous stretch of Garmonbozia-producing horror. Would we have seen a film? Surely not. Who would have funded such a thing? Would we be seeing Twin Peaks' glorious rebirth in 2016? Highly unlikely. Would there be anywhere close to the number of devoted fans? Probably not. The only good thing about that awful scenario would be that one could edit the Leland death episode into a finale and pretend that the rest never happened.

I'm also glad someone else is a fan of the smashing dishes and dripping syrup. I never see it mentioned. I consider it a premonition, along with the even more explicit part with the Giant waving his hands and shaking his head. What's remarkable is that Coop ignores both of these signs, both of which occur during tender moments with Annie. The idea seems to be that being in love has blinded Cooper and caused him to let his guard down. He swore he would never let that happen again after Caroline, but he does let it happen again (and everything will proceed cyclically), and it's part of his undoing in the lodge, where he does in fact see the identities of Caroline and Annie blur together. It gives fresh meaning to the Major's fear of the possibility that love is not enough.

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Re: Episode 27

Postby LostInTheMovies » Wed Mar 04, 2015 1:57 am

Jonah wrote:If I didn't know better, I would've thought Lynch directed some scenes, particularly the hand shaking bits, the Giant appearing on the stage, and those closing moments of eerie, desolate shots of Twin Peaks locations, before the camera pans from Bob emerging in the sycamore trees down to the puddle on the ground and we hear the first strains of jazz on the soundtrack and see the red curtains reflected in the oil/water. Absolutely stunning sequence there at the end.


Although I'd assume Gyllenhaal himself directed that sequence, it's worth noting that it was probably a later addition. Certainly the image of the red curtains appearing in the pool must have been added later (it's not in the script), because until Lynch improvised the finale the Red Room made only the briefest appearance in "the Black Lodge." And indeed, the whole idea of swooping through these familiar locations feels not only consistent with ep. 29 but also sets up the idea that "up next is the finale" which wasn't true until ep. 28 & 29 were squished together at the last minute and pushed back to June. So I guess what I'm saying is...it's hard to imagine this episode was executed the way it appears without any knowledge of a) Lynch's changes to the finale and b) the decision to combine the last two episodes into a two-part finale.

Either way, I'd really like to know more about the making of this episode.
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Re: Episode 27

Postby OK,Bob » Wed Mar 04, 2015 10:47 am

BOB1 wrote:I adore his horsesuit!! That is: their horsesuit. Leo, looks like you finally found your calling! :lol:

...and it nicely echoes, "Leo locked inside a hungry horse." :wink:
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Re: Episode 27

Postby OK,Bob » Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:35 pm

Jasper wrote:
Jonah wrote:Also love the eerie scene when the camera slowly pan backs as Cooper and Annie talk in the diner, culminating in the shattered plates and that close-up shot of syrup or coffee (or syrup-like coffee) dripping like blood.

I couldn't agree more. I love all of these things. That slow crawl through different locations, culminating in BOB's arms emergence in Glastonbury Grove is among my favorite sequences in the entire series.

The diner scene with Annie and Coop is spectacular.

I know there are solid non-Lynch episodes, especially in the first half of the series, but this one has always stood out as my non-Lynch favorite.
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Re: Episode 27

Postby p-air » Thu Mar 05, 2015 9:34 am

Brad D wrote:I did talk to Steve again under the presumption he was re-watching this, and he didnt, so frankly it was tough to get any substantial, uncovered info to share. :|


You should let Stevie G know Episode 27 has its own cult following (within a cult following) here on the message boards !
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Re: Episode 27

Postby LostInTheMovies » Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:13 pm

I was gonna ask for a call sheet/schedule including the final shot of this episode, but I realized it wouldn't reveal much. It's been a pet theory of mine for a while that the ending was re-shot following Lynch's changes to the finale but actually it wouldn't have needed to be since the red curtains only appear in the oil pool and thus could have been an optical (though if so, it's surprisingly good for a show that often has pretty bad optical effects). That also makes me wonder what Gyllenhaal DID intend for us to see in the pool, if not the red curtains? After all we pan/tilt down to it in one shot from Bob's appearance. So now that DOES bring me back to the idea that this was shot after the finale. Hmmm.

However this lead me to another question which perhaps (dugpa's) Audrey Horne could answer, or really anyone who has a sharp memory or press clippings from this period. When was it announced that ep. 28 & 29 were to be combined and postponed till June? The ending of ep. 27 seems shot & cut (vs. scripted) to feel like a tease before the big finale, even though originally it was scheduled to be the third-to-last episode. But I can't imagine there would be enough time to make those changes unless ABC announced the postponement immediately after the hiatus ended.

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