Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

[yaxomoxay]

I'm sorry, I don't see the fan community as all that divided, though a lot of folks here keep saying it. Among the real hard core, my sense is that approximately 70-90% are really digging the new season overall, though most everyone has a few things they criticize.

Fire Walk With Me felt much more divisive than The Return.

Agreed!


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[Mallard]

I'm not going to be able to get my co-hosts to rewatch this thing... Not even sure when I'll be up to doing it myself. I'm sure we'll do a series recap based on our memory/feelings though.

Interesting. Tell 'em they need to be martyrs in the name of complete reviews


Do you usually watch an episode multiple times before going on the air ?


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Yes. We all watch twice before review. Once on Sunday and then once more before podcasting where we take notes.

I'd just like to once more put forward my podcast as a beacon to all the folks out there who are disappointed in the new season. As far as I know we're the only podcast out there being overall negative about it. (And we're taking lots of shit for it every time we put out a new episode)

http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/
https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/the-tw ... 49455?mt=2

So I say to you in the Profoundly Disappointed Club, "You're among friends at the Twin Peaks Podcast"

I couldn't help but feel bad for your guest this week. It got the feeling that he really wanted you all to like this season, but this week more than any, it seems like you have resigned yourselves to disappointment (except Caitlin, who seems to enjoy it more than the rest of you).

I think Brad summed it up best: you guys just seem so down on it that you can't even enjoy the parts that you might normally find interesting. That's a bit of a shame, because I have a feeling the last 4-5 hrs of this thing may end up being pretty spectacular. Hope you guys can muster enough optimism to stick it out to the end.

And please, even if you hate it, I hope you can get some of the crew back for Bookhouse Noise Commentaries. They might be even better with you being providing a counter prospective to the other commentators who may have liked the series overall.

Yeah, the unfortunate thing is I booked all these guests before the season started and before I knew there was going to be a huge divide in the Twin Peaks fandom. I assumed we'd all be having a jolly good time together with all of our collective dreams coming true.

As for commentaries, what else should we commentate on?

Just suggestions: pilot and finale for this season, w/ maybe something like ep. 7 or 11 thrown in. I just think it would be interesting to see a live commentary of your prospective of the show, with some counterpoints from your usual group of guests. It's the sort of thing I don't think we'd get anywhere else. I mean, I've enjoyed the show, but I can go anywhere to hear people gush over it.

[RedRum]

I'd just like to once more put forward my podcast as a beacon to all the folks out there who are disappointed in the new season. As far as I know we're the only podcast out there being overall negative about it. (And we're taking lots of shit for it every time we put out a new episode)

http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/
https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/the-tw ... 49455?mt=2

So I say to you in the Profoundly Disappointed Club, "You're among friends at the Twin Peaks Podcast"

Thank you Thank you Thank you for this....

Your words... exactly how I feel about this... excellent scene by scene breakdown!

Thank you!!!!

[mtwentz]

I couldn't agree more with this. I guess I'm kind of disappointed in Lynch for doing what I'd probably want to do when an old man if I could which is hang out with young, beautiful, glamorous people. Especially women. I absolutely HATE that he is using TP to basically showcase bands that he obviously likes/admires. It's so jarring. And I've been listening to Chromatics and NIN for years. But keep them the f**k out of TP. I'm just seeing DKL more and more as a kind of dirty old man and it's disappointing to me because of the esteem I hold him in. But I suppose there's no reason why geniuses should be held up to higher 'moral' standards than anybody else. Focus on the art not the artist right? The problem is that this 'proclivity' of Lynch is spilling over into his work and it's not pretty.

Two issues here:
1. I thought Chromatics were captivating. Also, Trouble fit in very well in Ep 5 and Nine Inch Nails in Ep. 8. Some of the band have been 'meh' for me, but given it's the closing credits, I don't see the complaint. If they played the same old Laura Palmer theme song, it would seem really stale to me.

2. As far as Lynch being a 'dirty old man', not sure what you're saying there. Gordon Cole is a fictional character and he was shown to have a thing for pretty young girls with Shelly in the RR diner. I believe Season 3 is the attempt to build on this part of Gordon's character and to give him a 'storyline'. What the end point of that storyline will be, if any, is anybody's guess. Will he fall in love with Tammy? Will we find out he's really celibate or some other surprising fact? Who knows?

Probably the bigger accusation might be that it is indulgent for David Lynch to write a script and put himself so front and center of such a significant part of it. This is what the late Sam Shepard always thought, so he never wrote a part for himself. But it's a personal decision. I can tell you for me that Gordon, Tammy, Albert and Diane scenes work pretty well, but they are not my favorite parts of the show. I think Lynch is a decent actor, but I think the directing is better when he is behind the camera, not in front of it. That being said, with 18 hours of a show, having Gordon on camera for 3 or 4 of those hours is not something that will make me lose any sleep. That would mean we still get about 14 hours of film with Lynch completely behind the camera.

By the way, 70 is not really that old anymore. My father is 86 and in great shape and still flirts with younger women (as they flirt with him). I think the phrase 'dirty old man' should be reserved for those slime who target underage children. Consensual sex (or flirting) between adults is perfectly acceptable, regardless of age.

[RedRum]

I'd just like to once more put forward my podcast as a beacon to all the folks out there who are disappointed in the new season. As far as I know we're the only podcast out there being overall negative about it. (And we're taking lots of shit for it every time we put out a new episode)

http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/
https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/the-tw ... 49455?mt=2

So I say to you in the Profoundly Disappointed Club, "You're among friends at the Twin Peaks Podcast"

O.k. the Pie situation....

There is cocain in the pie..... Thats how you lose money on pie...

It started with Hank....

[AhmedKhalifa]

With only five more weeks to go before THE RETURN ends, I think it's safe to say that whatever takes place in the remaining parts will not undo the damage done by the past 13 parts. That doesn't mean TPTR is awful. Far from it. But it is indeed profoundly disappointing. I waited 20 years for this? A predominantly loveless handling of a beautiful creation by the creator himself? I think the best we can hope for is a superb finale, which, combined with the opener and a handful of episodes in between, would give us a flawed companion piece to place alongside the original series.

[kleio]

I'm sorry, I don't see the fan community as all that divided, though a lot of folks here keep saying it. Among the real hard core, my sense is that approximately 70-90% are really digging the new season overall, though most everyone has a few things they criticize.

Fire Walk With Me felt much more divisive than The Return.

You’re only seeing the people who are saying anything. I suspect a goodly number of those who are disappointed in the series can’t be bothered to discuss it or were shouted down (often quite rudely) by those who love the series. I wasn’t planning to post anything on this thread even though I’ve been reading it since around episode 3/4. I was only motivated to say something because I was tired of the extremely positive coming to the one thread where it is acceptable to be disappointed to accuse people of wanting a re-tread or of having a temper tantrum because they didn’t get the show exactly the way they had been imagining it for 25 years. I decided I should step up and add my voice in case the people posting here decided to give up and the thread died. I’m sure I’m not the only one out there who doesn’t feel comfortable going just anywhere on the internet to post a negative opinion of the series.

[Mallard]

I'm sorry, I don't see the fan community as all that divided, though a lot of folks here keep saying it. Among the real hard core, my sense is that approximately 70-90% are really digging the new season overall, though most everyone has a few things they criticize.

Fire Walk With Me felt much more divisive than The Return.

You’re only seeing the people who are saying anything. I suspect a goodly number of those who are disappointed in the series can’t be bothered to discuss it or were shouted down (often quite rudely) by those who love the series. I wasn’t planning to post anything on this thread even though I’ve been reading it since around episode 3/4. I was only motivated to say something because I was tired of the extremely positive coming to the one thread where it is acceptable to be disappointed to accuse people of wanting a re-tread or of having a temper tantrum because they didn’t get the show exactly the way they had been imagining it for 25 years. I decided I should step up and add my voice in case the people posting here decided to give up and the thread died. I’m sure I’m not the only one out there who doesn’t feel comfortable going just anywhere on the internet to post a negative opinion of the series.

I wouldn't worry too much about this thread dying.

[Twin Peaks Podcast]

Just suggestions: pilot and finale for this season, w/ maybe something like ep. 7 or 11 thrown in. I just think it would be interesting to see a live commentary of your prospective of the show, with some counterpoints from your usual group of guests. It's the sort of thing I don't think we'd get anywhere else. I mean, I've enjoyed the show, but I can go anywhere to hear people gush over it.

Ok, I will keep this in mind for sure.

I'd just like to once more put forward my podcast as a beacon to all the folks out there who are disappointed in the new season. As far as I know we're the only podcast out there being overall negative about it. (And we're taking lots of shit for it every time we put out a new episode)

http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/
https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/the-tw ... 49455?mt=2

So I say to you in the Profoundly Disappointed Club, "You're among friends at the Twin Peaks Podcast"

O.k. the Pie situation....

There is cocain in the pie..... Thats how you lose money on pie...

It started with Hank....

My God.... You cracked the code. I must go to the Facebook group to tell Brad immediately.

[RedRum]

Just suggestions: pilot and finale for this season, w/ maybe something like ep. 7 or 11 thrown in. I just think it would be interesting to see a live commentary of your prospective of the show, with some counterpoints from your usual group of guests. It's the sort of thing I don't think we'd get anywhere else. I mean, I've enjoyed the show, but I can go anywhere to hear people gush over it.

Ok, I will keep this in mind for sure.

I'd just like to once more put forward my podcast as a beacon to all the folks out there who are disappointed in the new season. As far as I know we're the only podcast out there being overall negative about it. (And we're taking lots of shit for it every time we put out a new episode)

http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/
https://itunes.apple.com/podcast/the-tw ... 49455?mt=2

So I say to you in the Profoundly Disappointed Club, "You're among friends at the Twin Peaks Podcast"

O.k. the Pie situation....

There is cocain in the pie..... Thats how you lose money on pie...

It started with Hank....

My God.... You cracked the code. I must go to the Facebook group to tell Brad immediately.

Crack Cocaine lol

[Venus]

Which brings us, finally, to the banality of Trois: While you may be a singularly unique and flash persona in your own mind, the fact is you are far from the first salt o' the earth just-tellin-it-like-it-is-mate rambling British proto-blogger we have had around of late. You are in fact perhaps at least the third or fourth, which is what makes you so rote to me. The manner in which this archetype has seemed to proliferate in number to validate fan anguish in broad and colorful terms bordering on toxic libel to the cast and crew (to say nothing of the rest of the message board) while consistently turning the forum discussion into a passive-aggressive trollfest has never astounded me, only bored me. Which is all florid prose in service of saying - if I wanted to read Irvine Welsh I'd read his books again, not your (or others') posts trying to be him. But since a diatribe is all you engage with, I shall attempt to communicate via your own secondhand language.

To your other point, I'm not hypersensitive - I'm simply increasingly disinterested in the fallacy that much of this thread is interested in earnest discussion and criticism vs. its venting of its rage and id about the show at anyone within range. It was clear some time ago that posts like yours and others' serve as a glorious primal scream statement for much of this thread; you take really ugly potshots at Lynch, or the cast or crew or even some of us, and too many other folks in the thread respond with delight to your evidently-still-novel-somewhere blunt talk

As to the thread at large: I won't pretend I don't see some of the obnoxious posts condescending to people who don't like The Return in this thread; in fact, I've called them out more than once. My mistake was assuming any of you would do the same on your side of the aisle. That said, you guys really want an ambassador for the critical thread, you can do better than Trainspotting Fan #12. Best of luck.

Gawd blimey guvna. Before I go up the apples and pears to my uncle ned, just a mention to N's post.

I can only speak from my own viewpoint on some of this but N I would like to say 'Welcome to our world'. I don't necessarily agree with any or all of what has been said and what precluded this but your thoughts above echo my thoughts from approximately 3 months ago. But it was the pro TP3 who made me feel as you do above. It's odd how things come full circle. The nasty nasty things said to me in other threads on here in the early days. So upsetting. Almost had me in tears. Just because I didn't like the new show. When mlsstwrt started this thread it was great to have a bit of a sanctuary for want of a better way of putting it. Somewhere we could air our thoughts on the show, just one thread out of all the many threads on this big board. Just one singular thread where we could share how we felt about the show but without upsetting those who love it (or without 'clogging up the boards' as someone who loved it wrote). You love the show yet you still post in this thread. That is your choice and you know you are welcome. I don't like the show and I don't post in the episode threads, even when I have seen derogatory remarks in them about people who aren't enjoying the show. It's too upsetting and time consuming to keep calling people out on it. I seldom post elsewhere now.

I think it is an insult to a lot of us on this thread to say it is a fallacy that much of this thread isn't interested in earnest discussion. Yeah we've had a moan about things (and why not? look at the thread title) but there has been some great discussions on here too. Not always of course, and I don't always agree with what is said in it, but show me any thread that is 100% without that. So please don't try and paint it as something else. I don't think that is fair on those that have taken the time and trouble to contribute in a constructive manner to put them down in this way. I'm surprised at you saying that as you are usually so considered. At the end of the day, if it is all about sides, as you mention in your last paragraph (though I don't see it as that - I think some people just like things and some don't and it really doesn't matter as it is literally just TV we are talking about) it's terribly sad if it is.

And to end on a good note for everyone out there, just remember some good advice from someone we all used to know and love - "Every day, once a day, give yourself a present. Don't plan it. Don't wait for it. Just let it happen. It could be a new shirt at the men's store, a catnap in your office chair, or two cups of good, hot black coffee."

[BMS242]

Popping in for the first time in a while.

I've actually been enjoying the show and look forward to the last few episodes, but I still count myself among the profoundly disappointed.

As others have said, it's very obvious that this is a 9 hour story blown out into 18 hours with some amazing stuff (I've rewatched episode 8 multiple times) and a lot of stuff that just falls completely flat.

For me, as someone who is a bigger Lynch fan than TP fan, I just feel like Lynch hasn't captured the atmosphere that so enthralled me in FWWM, Ep 14 and 29, Lost Highway, and MD. Episode 8 had it and some of the recent Sarah Palmer scenes are getting there, but it's been sparse. People can say it's purposeful or whatever, but it just hasnt gripped me like the aforementioned pieces did. I just can't help but think that the show should've been tightened up during the editing process. (I'm actually mildly enjoying Dougie's story now but Lynch took it way too far early on.)

It is very intriguing to think that for years I thought to myself what it would be like if Lynch and Frost had total control over so many episodes and they actually managed to churn out a flawed product with ups and downs just like Season 2 (definitely not as bad as the lows of Season 2, but an inconsistent product nonetheless).

Anyway, I have a suspicion that the last few episodes could be great, but I really wonder if it'll be enough for me to consistently revisit all but a few episodes.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

[mtwentz]

For me, as someone who is a bigger Lynch fan than TP fan, I just feel like Lynch hasn't captured the atmosphere that so enthralled me in FWWM, Ep 14 and 29, Lost Highway, and MD. Episode 8 had it and some of the recent Sarah Palmer scenes are getting there, but it's been sparse. People can say it's purposeful or whatever, but it just hasnt gripped me like the aforementioned pieces did. I just can't help but think that the show should've been tightened up during the editing process. (I'm actually mildly enjoying Dougie's story now but Lynch took it way too far early on.) Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

By the episodes and movies you mention, am I right to assume you like the darker stuff?

I am actually surprised that the new Twin Peaks is not darker. On the old spoiler thread, there were all kinds of hints of how dark the new season was going to be. And it did feel that was the direction things were going: in episode 1, we have the black and white world with the Giant, New York Scenes and Ruth Davenport's body, then in Part II we have the Black Lodge scenes, non-existent, Darya and Phyllis's brutal deaths etc. In Part 3 we start off really dark with Cooper in the purple room, and then...

Dougie comes along, which pretty much lightened everything up.

I still think we are going to have some really dark moments, I mean Richard and Doppelcoop are still around, but I think this new Twin Peaks is much lighter, much more optimistic than many of us thought it would be.

[sylvia_north]

.

(...)
As for that tiny minority of Lynch Ultras raving about The Return’s explorations of the mysteries of electricity and other ‘deep patternings’, it’s fascinating -- and yes, funny -- to watch people bite into their congel eel wrapped in peat and then try to convince themselves and others that it's not just delicious but one of the tastiest meals ever served. I love deep patterning in TV drama and lapped up The Sopranos, Mad Men, and the like. But deep patterning lying beneath 0.5D characters, appalling acting, virtually no suspension of disbelief, multilayered ugliness, misanthropy/misogyny, and absurdly eccentric editing? Like specks of gold dust floating by as you're drowning in a slurry pit.
(...)

Personally, I'm honing in on those things because those are the parts that feels, for me, like the original. When you got some unexpected season 2 windfall stroke of otherwordliness in the middle of banal fluff, and I think that's David Foster Wallace's definition of Lynchian. And it's also intermittent reinforcement, why Stockholm Syndrome works (just call me Patty ) And the speculative puzzling with others can be half the pleasure, or all of it when the onscreen business is leaving you unfulfilled, also feels like the fan engagement of the first run. The frustration with the form and throwaway characters, the inter-fan bickering, the cow eyed gushing and all. In the text, these elements, the book, the spectrum of interpretations and reactions, paint the lead with gold. I also like mead, mmm. It's a moment in history I don't want to miss even if I'm cynical and easily underwhelmed these days. 90% of the what's onscreen is my least favorite part of the show coming back. I perked right up at the RR customers switching, Dian'se reverse POV, Sarah, Ed's reflection.


ps The irony of RedRum's rant against imagined LFB transgressions and basically blaming her for coping with, if any of it is true or 'he's just reading her life in her face' (judging a book by its cover) and benefiting from a system where she was positioned to use her sexuality for personal gain (it's called being an actress) and then posting a Last Sitting shot of MM, someone who it's confirmed actually did do all those things and then literally self destructed and now gets all the rewards and reverence, was not lost on me.

[Mr. Jackpots]

For me, as someone who is a bigger Lynch fan than TP fan, I just feel like Lynch hasn't captured the atmosphere that so enthralled me in FWWM, Ep 14 and 29, Lost Highway, and MD. Episode 8 had it and some of the recent Sarah Palmer scenes are getting there, but it's been sparse. People can say it's purposeful or whatever, but it just hasnt gripped me like the aforementioned pieces did. I just can't help but think that the show should've been tightened up during the editing process. (I'm actually mildly enjoying Dougie's story now but Lynch took it way too far early on.) Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

.

I'm loving The Return. And feel it's delivering on the 18 hours of "pure heroine lynch" we were promised. But what you say about atmosphere, I do feel more of a MD atmosphere than a Peaks and FWWM vibe.

At times The Return really does feel like Twin Peaks. But overall im not feeling like I'm in the world of Twin Peaks. It does feel different. Like Las Vegas or North Dakota. Or somewhere.