Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

[AhmedKhalifa]

Finally, an article that DARES to propose that THE RETURN might be a self-indulgent disaster; and, apparently, the ratings stink as well: http://www.showbiz411.com/2017/08/15/ra ... nday-night

[mtwentz]

Finally, an article that DARES to propose that THE RETURN might be a self-indulgent disaster; and, apparently, the ratings stink as well: http://www.showbiz411.com/2017/08/15/ra ... nday-night

Not a very good source.

Roger Friedman was fired from Fox News for ethical lapses as a critic. Whether you agree with him or not, no one who loves film or T.V. should patronize this guy's website.

Edit: Friedman has had it in for Twin Peaks from the beginning. I'm not saying he's not entitled to his point of view, but he's generally considered pretty sleazy.

[AhmedKhalifa]

Finally, an article that DARES to propose that THE RETURN might be a self-indulgent disaster; and, apparently, the ratings stink as well: http://www.showbiz411.com/2017/08/15/ra ... nday-night

Not a very good source.

Roger Friedman was fired from Fox News for ethical lapses as a critic. Whether you agree with him or not, no one who loves film or T.V. should patronize this guy's website.

Edit: Friedman has had it in for Twin Peaks from the beginning. I'm not saying he's not entitled to his point of view, but he's generally considered pretty sleazy.

Another source, VANITY FAIR, confirms the weak ratings of THE RETURN: https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/20 ... ext-season

[crazyscottishguy]

Ratings? I thought that whore died!

Seriously, Showtime cares more for the number of subscriptions that TP generated. They were aware from the start that it's no GoT or Walking Dead, so I think they knew what they were getting into when green lighting the Return.

[Aqwell]

I really hope someone will make a good spoof or a skit of season 3, like this scene in Living in Oblivion:

[Mr. Reindeer]

I never thought I'd hear the arm wrestling scene referred to as cliche! Of course I know what you're saying, but since I can't think of another scene like it in a "serious" film and since an arm wrestling match was the last and most ridiculous thing I'd expect to happen at this point in this film, I'd say it's more about subverting or parodying a cliche.

Agreed -- as I said, I found the concept of the gang fun. But in terms of the actual story progression and execution, it was one of the few instances I can think of watching a Lynch-directed scene, ever, where I thought "I know exactly where this scene is going," and I was more or less right.

[boske]

Yes, I too have heard that season three is about Cooper's return to TP. Now, let's scrutinize that statement a little bit.

Having been let go from the lodge, Cooper has been since stuck in Vegas for what, twelve parts now (that's two thirds, mind you), with virtually no progress. If that counts as a return trip, it would mean that (thus far) he has spent two thirds of the return trip in a middle of desert, out of gas and with a flat tire, simply watching the tumbleweed fly by him. I do believe the nights are very starry in the desert, so that may have been worth it at least.

The main reason we have had him in this state was to tease the audience with various gimmicks so that we believe that this is, or will be the second last thing leading to his awakening. For example:

• Dougie sees a gunslinger statue. Oh yes, he's read such a novel in his childhood, that'll wake him up;
• Dougie sees a police badge, yes, that's it, he is waking up;
• Dougie sees himself in the mirror, he has to be checking if Bob is there [this scene though was quite powerful IMO];
• Dougie smells and tastes coffee, he is right here folks!
• Dougie hears of "case files", yes that'll do it;
• Edit: Dougie goes for his doctor's stethoscope. So it was not the badge, he'll go after anything shiny. How is this not a mockery of this iconic character and the audience?
• Dougie eats a cherry pie, look at him, he's here isn't he;
• Dougie "sleeps" with this wife, yes, some people say, we all knew he was supposed to do that before he wakes up; not sure about that, but whatever;

What is next? Instead of showing us some genuine progress or real struggle to wake up, they have used Dougie as a middle-finger device, Dr. Amp-style. I mean, maybe he finally wakes up soon (well part 15 is coming, and there was that socket with #15 in the purple world, etc.), but I honestly no longer care. A month or so ago when I still somewhat cared, I thought that the whole thing reminded me of the Sleeping Beauty-like fable where Coop is under a spell and needs a kiss to wake up, where it would be Laura, Audrey or Annie that would be the one (and Candie/Mandie/Sandie be like the fairy trio), but even if that happens I really do not care anymore. Horse has bolted the barn, forget about the door.

[mlsstwrt]

Finally, an article that DARES to propose that THE RETURN might be a self-indulgent disaster; and, apparently, the ratings stink as well: http://www.showbiz411.com/2017/08/15/ra ... nday-night

Wow. At last. Couldn't disagree with anything. Self indulgent disaster perfectly sums it up. Didn't realise Lynch had been sticking other family members in this.

I think those people who say Lynch has been living in this bubble where he can do no wrong for the last 25 years is about right. He pals around with all these celebs, was recognised as greatest director of all time in some important 'poll', seems to spend most of his time on random projects and the last thing of note he made was IE, a good while back now. It's not that surprising that he's nowhere near the top of his game.

I guess now I'll wait for Needleman to come along and tell me off for 'attacking' Lynch on a personal level.

[mlsstwrt]

Finally, an article that DARES to propose that THE RETURN might be a self-indulgent disaster; and, apparently, the ratings stink as well: http://www.showbiz411.com/2017/08/15/ra ... nday-night

Not a very good source.

Roger Friedman was fired from Fox News for ethical lapses as a critic. Whether you agree with him or not, no one who loves film or T.V. should patronize this guy's website.

Edit: Friedman has had it in for Twin Peaks from the beginning. I'm not saying he's not entitled to his point of view, but he's generally considered pretty sleazy.

Not a good source for what exactly? The information that The Return is terrible? Sleazy or not everything he wrote is true and makes a nice change from the ridiculously over the top fawning over Lynch. It's actually kind of patronising as well. They know Lynch is old and isn't going to be making much more stuff after this. It's like giving Al Pacino the Oscar for Scent of a Woman when they know they screwed up not giving it to him for his far better, earlier films.

Edit: Well said Boske. I no longer care at this point either. I'll watch the last four episodes because why not (it's still better than Ray Donovan or most of the other utter garbage on TV).

[Aqwell]

I think those people who say Lynch has been living in this bubble where he can do no wrong for the last 25 years is about right.

As in, this wellknown FBI agent stuck in a paralel dimension for 25 years or so that came out as the village fool?

[Mr. Reindeer]

It's disingenuous of Friedman to say the move to 8pm was meant to help ratings, implying that it was some desperate Hail Mary play. The schedule change was planned before TP even debuted -- it's simply part of Showtime's overall programming strategy (and, IMO, a decision that benefits other series to the detriment of TP). Also, what family members has DKL cast? Emily Stofle in one scene, his son Riley in the band Trouble and the random one-line "Where's Billy" cameo, and (presumably) some relation of his wife, Mary Stofle, as Ruth Davenport's corpse. That's hardly nepotism -- just a few personal cameos. Honestly, it's less egregious than casting Austin as the Tremond grandson in Episode 9, or letting Jennifer write the Secret Diary. (Also worth nothing that Mark's kid was in Part 11, also in a small cameo...and why not?)

[sylvia_north]

Aqwell that was awesome lol

Here's another one linked from Rotten Tomatoes :

" And now, reluctantly – drag me to it, as if to a soft-play area or Debenham’s at sales time – we arrive at Twin Peaks: the Return (launched 22 May, 2am). Watching four episodes has been the endurance test of my middle years, harder than taking up running, and ten times more tedious. It . . . is . . . unbearable. Doubtless you already know that almost all the original cast are present and correct, from Catherine E Coulson as the Log Lady to David Duchovny as Dennis/Denise Bryson; you will also be aware that the preternaturally youthful Kyle MacLachlan is currently playing two versions of Agent Cooper, one with short hair, who is good, and one with long, who is bad. But what you may not know, if you have read only – how to put this? – the more respectful reviews, is just how far Showtime, which commissioned the series, has indulged David Lynch.

A collection of rambling and samey set pieces amateurishly glued together by a frankly adolescent conviction that weirdness in any form – hey, let’s not bother with a plot – can pass for clever and interesting, it should never have been made (and, having poked about online, I detect weariness setting in even among those who hailed its promise at the start). People love to talk – The X-Files blah, True Detective blah – of the influence Twin Peaks has had on television in the years since it first screened (1990-91). But this is silly, overstated. Television changes for myriad reasons, and is changing still, thanks to Netflix. That Lynch seems neither to know of these changes nor to care does not make him a hero, or even an auteur. It makes him a fool, and a dinosaur." - Rachel Cooke, New Statesman "Casting Brexit Movie Real etc" JUNE 2 2017

Emphasis mine. What's Cooke implying with that wordage there, hmm? https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/twin_ ... ort=rotten

[mlsstwrt]

I don't give a damn about the Ratings. I just agreed with what the reviewer was saying about the show.

Reindeer - my respectful retort would be that nepotism does not just include family (although to be fair I think in my post I did refer to family only so I do take your point) but friends also. I'm not sure whether they're friends but I do maintain that Lynch has shoehorned a bunch of musicians he admires into The Return for the sake of it. They add absolutely nothing.

Sylvia - the review you posted is even better. I'm just glad to see that there are some critics who haven't been drinking the Kool-Aid and are seeing this mess for what it is.

[The Gazebo]

We all know journalists and critics work in packs. It would take a brave one to risk his/her cultural capital by swimming against the tide and pointing out flaws in the work of the Maestro. Some have given small hints in their choice of words, though, echoing our own experiences, like "hard work", "Lynch doesn't make it easy", etc. I suspect a few more will appear once the dust has settled on Season 3.

[judasbooth]

Aqwell that was awesome lol

Here's another one linked from Rotten Tomatoes :

" And now, reluctantly – drag me to it, as if to a soft-play area or Debenham’s at sales time – we arrive at Twin Peaks: the Return (launched 22 May, 2am). Watching four episodes has been the endurance test of my middle years, harder than taking up running, and ten times more tedious. It . . . is . . . unbearable. Doubtless you already know that almost all the original cast are present and correct, from Catherine E Coulson as the Log Lady to David Duchovny as Dennis/Denise Bryson; you will also be aware that the preternaturally youthful Kyle MacLachlan is currently playing two versions of Agent Cooper, one with short hair, who is good, and one with long, who is bad. But what you may not know, if you have read only – how to put this? – the more respectful reviews, is just how far Showtime, which commissioned the series, has indulged David Lynch.

A collection of rambling and samey set pieces amateurishly glued together by a frankly adolescent conviction that weirdness in any form – hey, let’s not bother with a plot – can pass for clever and interesting, it should never have been made (and, having poked about online, I detect weariness setting in even among those who hailed its promise at the start). People love to talk – The X-Files blah, True Detective blah – of the influence Twin Peaks has had on television in the years since it first screened (1990-91). But this is silly, overstated. Television changes for myriad reasons, and is changing still, thanks to Netflix. That Lynch seems neither to know of these changes nor to care does not make him a hero, or even an auteur. It makes him a fool, and a dinosaur." - Rachel Cooke, New Statesman "Casting Brexit Movie Real etc" JUNE 2 2017

Emphasis mine. What's Cooke implying with that wordage there, hmm? https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/twin_ ... ort=rotten

I have the awful feeling it may actually get even worse. What I have noticed is that more and more people are coming out of the woodwork and saying, y'know, the show isn't actually any good. In the comments section on the tvline.com review, a couple of posters made reference to a blind item on the site which stated that a nameless cable TV network desperately tried to offload a newly-completed show onto an online streaming service, but was blocked by the creators of said show. Showtime have been noncommittal about renewing the show (i.e. they won't). My guess is that the blood drained from their collective face when they realised just what Lynch had produced and, in a panic, tried to dump the whole thing before it aired. David Nevins must feel like Lynch has taken him for a ride, especially galling considering that he gave him creative carte blanche and acceded to his demands to double the number of episodes. Some way to repay someone's faith in you. This kind of shit usually costs people their jobs.

Of course, over on places like Reddit, the true believers are unswayed. But as I said before, it seems more and more like they're actually trying to convince themselves that the new series is good. Seriously, I could paraphrase a lot of the comments like this: "it's suppposed to be tedious and pointless and nonsensical and crappy - that's the whole point" and "I find it tiresome and unwatchable, but that's why I enjoy it" and "it's made in an artistic language that only people like me understand, it's over the head of the normals". Even the biggest fans of the original series knew that all the weirdness and oddity was largely just for decoration - Lynch and Frost as much as admitted that there was no "key" to the clues and symbols - only the truly obsessive would try to find meaning where there wasn't any, or, even worse, claim that they understood the meaning even if the creators themselves said there was none.

I get it, it's human nature to impart significance to, and spot patterns in, random, unrelated things. It's how we've evolved to think. But when this instinct is misdirected, it lapses into superstitious thinking, and in extreme cases, delusional thinking (and, no, I'm not calling fans of the new show delusional). The wikipedia entry for apophenia is instructive in this case. The human capacity for self-deception is great, and I'm in no way immune to this, but sometimes you've got to take a step back, take a deep breath and trust your gut feelings. After all, the Emperor wasn't really the butt of the joke - it was all the others who willingly deceived themselves, ironically because they were afraid of looking unsophisticated or foolish.