Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

[douglasb]

I think you're all (or is it y'all) missing the very point. Phillip Jeffries is now part of the Tin Machine.

Maybe he's The Tin Man to Andy's Cowardly Lion?

Now we just need to work out who the Wizard is?

[mlsstwrt]

Every episode feels like a sketch show, like the muppet show with special guests or something, in this case special guests who have cancelled at the last minute (zz top).

Couldn't agree more. The Green Glove scene in the Roadhouse. I mean I don't know what I'm watching anymore. Lynch has really lost it.

[Dreamy Audrey]

I loved Part 15 and hope Parts 16-18 will be good in a similar way, but I am still disappointed that I had to watch 14 Parts that I had mixed feelings about or even disliked completely to finally get an episode which I really liked or would recommend to other people. If this wasn't Twin Peaks, I would have given up after 1 or 2 episodes and never seen Part 15. And unfortunately, this one episode doesn't magically make me like some of the earlier episodes more than before, it just makes me wonder why they couldn't have been equally good.

Just saw the Norma/Ed scene. Can totally understand why somebody would be underwhelmed by such a trite resolution of the saga. I certainly was.

The Walter/"franchise" "storyline" was some of the laziest writing of The Return. Introduce an obstacle for one scene, just so Ed/Norma can easily overcome it. Other than that, I thought the performances, the delayed gratification in the pacing, and the use of Redding made the scene satisfying. Admittedly, I have a soft spot for these two, and their reunion was one of the only specific things I truly wanted from TP:TR.

I'm very happy that Ed and Norma are back together but the storyline was really dumb. There was no build-up to this "resolution", we barely saw anything of these two characters before and the Walter/franchise obstacle was only introduced one scene before this and not really an obstacle at all. The Ed/Norma resolution would have worked, if there had been some drama before. They could have introduced this storyline early on in the season, they could have shown us how Ed and Norma struggle because they can't be together, how Nadine is still an obstacle, how Norma distracts herself with Walter/the franchises even though it doesn't make her happy because she thinks there is no chance for her and Ed, how she might struggle with feelings for both Ed and Walter or has to choose between love and career, how this threatens a potential happy ending for Ed and Norma and so on. The Norma/Ed scene made me feel like I had just caught the last scene of a romance movie and missed the whole preceding movie Would anyone who hasn't seen the original series even care about their relationship or understand that scene?

I was also disappointed by the new Phillip Jeffries, but I don't know if there could have been a better alternative or of I would have liked any of the alternatives, considering we knew this should have been Bowie, had he been able to shoot a scene

[mlsstwrt]

I'm actually very surprised by the disappointed camp who weren't disappointed by Ep 15. To me it's just awful, as bad as anything that's gone before. I think maybe expectations are so low now that this is being judged by different standards. Did anybody else feel that Ep 15 was terrible?

The Tim Roth scenes..... as someone said it's a bit reminiscent of Natural Born Killers. But much worse. The dialogue is poverty Quentin Tarantino (who I never liked all that much anyway).

Far from being pure heroin Lynch, this actually feels like Twin Peaks lite to me. There's so little gravitas to this. Maybe they meant you need to be on pure heroin to get through this.

[sylvia_north]

A Twin Peaks fan walks into a bar

because it was set so low.

Who says we aren't light-hearted?

[Jonah]

I have to get this off my chest - I hate Chantal and Hutch! I love Jennifer Jason Leigh and Tim Roth, but I hate their characters. And I'm mixed on Bad Coop - I think Kyle's doing a great job and found him chilly at the end of Episode 4, but I also think he's a bit Randall Flagg-ish from The Stand, ditto Chantal and Hutch. I think they're very meh villians overall.

I'm still mixed on the series overall. I liked the latest installment for the most part, but I don't know, it's very mixed. The Alicia Witt scene in the forest could have been so much better. I just feel there's so many missed opportunities (particularly in exploring more complex stories and there's a really noticeable lack of decent characterisation in my opinion), but overall I'm still trying to make the best of it. I kind of appreciate it as its own thing. But I don't know, it's been exhausting to watch lately. I can see everyone's point of view - those who like it, those who hate it - and I think everyone should be able to express their views or vent their frustrations, but I haven't been posting on this thread lately as there seems to be a lot of vehement bickering. No offense to anyone, and definitely not singling anyone out, but there seems to be a lot of that on this board lately. I get it, but I think everyone needs to chill a bit. Who cares if someone thinks it's garbage and who cares if someone else think it's genius, let everyone have their view!

[Doppler]

A Twin Peaks fan walks into a bar

because it was set so low.

Who says we aren't light-hearted?

A Twin Peaks fan got hit in the face with a bar.

Lynch did it. Why did you do that to me, David?

[cgs027]

I'm very happy that Ed and Norma are back together but the storyline was really dumb. There was no build-up to this "resolution", we barely saw anything of these two characters before and the Walter/franchise obstacle was only introduced one scene before this and not really an obstacle at all. The Ed/Norma resolution would have worked, if there had been some drama before. They could have introduced this storyline early on in the season, they could have shown us how Ed and Norma struggle because they can't be together, how Nadine is still an obstacle, how Norma distracts herself with Walter/the franchises even though it doesn't make her happy because she thinks there is no chance for her and Ed, how she might struggle with feelings for both Ed and Walter or has to choose between love and career, how this threatens a potential happy ending for Ed and Norma and so on. The Norma/Ed scene made me feel like I had just caught the last scene of a romance movie and missed the whole preceding movie Would anyone who hasn't seen the original series even care about their relationship or understand that scene?
(

Totally agree. Sh*t, we didn't even know Ed and Nadine were still married, so we had no reason to be excited when she finally had this "revelation".

[Dreamy Audrey]

I'm actually very surprised by the disappointed camp who weren't disappointed by Ep 15. To me it's just awful, as bad as anything that's gone before. I think maybe expectations are so low now that this is being judged by different standards. Did anybody else feel that Ep 15 was terrible?

The Tim Roth scenes..... as someone said it's a bit reminiscent of Natural Born Killers. But much worse. The dialogue is poverty Quentin Tarantino (who I never liked all that much anyway).

Far from being pure heroin Lynch, this actually feels like Twin Peaks lite to me. There's so little gravitas to this. Maybe they meant you need to be on pure heroin to get through this.

I had the same expectations like every week, but this episode had a lot of scenes that I liked compared to previous ones and a better flow of scenes. But maybe my reaction to Part 15 is different because my feelings about the return have always been mixed but not completely negative? Or maybe this episode is for some who dislike it what Part 8 is to me, because I don't understand why Part 8 seems to be generally liked among people in the mixed or disappointed camp.

I agree on the Tim Roth scenes. It's the only scene I skipped on my rewatch of Part 15 because I think all the Chantal/Hutch scenes are painful to watch and both characters are unbearable. I hope Mr. C. hates them as much as I do and "rewards" them by killing them

[LateReg]

Here you lost all credibility. At this point you want to be disappointed, and you want to not care.
The rest of your point is just bitching about nothing.

Do I have to justify my feelings ? Very Well. If it is about Ed I was ok with him being a lonely bachelor, it felt real, sad but that's life. This episode told us that in fact he went back with Nadine after season 2 and stayed 25 more years with her. Now after she gave him back his freedom (so to speak) he goes right back at Norma hoping it's not too late... Well I think 25 years is a bit too late and he should have had the courage to ask for divorce a very long time ago. Ed is a coward and a selfish man, thinking Norma didn't move on. But hey, he's a lucky guy and they end up together again, yippee!

The convenience store scenes were ok I suppose? Not sure about Jeffries though...
As for the rest I agree with you, I'm bitching about nothing, because it's what it is for me, nothing, nada, zip.

Fortunately for you and others I don't plan to discuss how shitty that season is on any other thread than this one. And even if I wanted to, my english is not good enough to do so. But it seems some people have no problem with that in the other way round.

I am so glad you're not the writer/director.

Nice to meet you too.

First of all, I apologize if I sounded offensive. That was not my intent. Re-reading what I wrote I sound more Dr. Amp than the more meditative Dr. Jacoby. In my defense, first day of school for my kids... and I also blame the great American Solar Eclipse for my tone.
I am still glad you're not the writer, lol. The thing is that what I read on both the "extremely insanely happy whatever Lynch does" and the "extremely disappointed whatever Lynch does" threads proves what I said for a while, probably since episode 3 or 4 of S3. That is, L/F found themselves in a very paradoxical situation. It is impossible, in my humble opinion, to create meaningful backstories to the old characters without going into the grotesque, in a soap opera way. That is, with 25 years delay the risk was to do a "Norma married Ed because this is what happened, and Bobby became a cop because this is what happened." 25 years is a long time, so the choice was between continuously mentioning the past hoping to create strong stories, or simply let it be, giving some clues, and start from where they are at. L/F chose the latter.

I just want to say that I agree with this. We're plopped into these people's lives, 25 years later. We gain impressions of them in their current moment. That's the style. Unorthodox to be sure, but that is the style.

[cgs027]

I'm actually very surprised by the disappointed camp who weren't disappointed by Ep 15. To me it's just awful, as bad as anything that's gone before. I think maybe expectations are so low now that this is being judged by different standards. Did anybody else feel that Ep 15 was terrible?

Me, too. I'm shocked at some of the praise being thrown at this one. And I have been enjoying the series for the most part...

Seems like they seriously hit the brakes on this one, which would be fine if we weren't in the last act here.

[referendum]

Totally agree. Sh*t

well, hell, i like it. So shucks. I guess i don't know shit from shinola

[cgs027]

Totally agree. Sh*t

well, hell, i like it. So shucks. I guess i don't know shit from shinola

HA! Trust me, I like that they are finally able to live out their lives together (and we definitely need some moments of lightness/happiness amongst the darkness, so that was a welcomed reprieve). Just the way we ended up here felt a little flat to me.

[yaxomoxay]

I will watch some hula dancers dance for me... you know, it's a relaxation technique.

I watch ASMR videos on youtube with my headphones, it's nice.

Me too, ASMR is awesome.

Haven't seen the latest episode yet but (kind of) looking forward to.

Yaxomoxay - that was an unusual spurt of aggression from you! Very out of character. Honestly I think at this point I'm going to find it hard to care much about Ed and Norma for the reasons others have stated. I cared about them a LOT in the original but at this point one or two scenes aren't necessarily going to immediately rekindle those old feelings. I would hope none of us are so attached to being disappointed that we're going to criticise no matter what but I think at this point it's going to be very difficult or impossible to salvage this as a whole. Still hoping for a great finale though.

Just one point I wanted to address which is that Lynch & Frost aren't making this with fans' reaction in mind. I think that isn't completely the case, the James 'Just You' performance was an absolutely undeniable 'nod' (or middle finger up) to the fans? I think it at least shows an awareness of how fans have reacted to certain characters or scenes. I'm not suggesting they're reading Dugpa but I think they probably have a pretty good grasp of how fans reacted to and are reacting to TP.

I usually use white noise, possibly deep sounds. I like the electrical sounds in "Anthology Resouce vol 1" but unfortunately the sounds are often "interrupted" and not continuous. The youtube channel "Relaxing White Noise" has some incredible stuff.
As for my tone, it didn't feel aggressive when I wrote the post. Only a re-reading after two cups of coffee revealed to me the tone.

As for the "fans in mind", I agree. I don't think that L/F are either doing everything for fans' sake or just to troll. They have a story they want to say, and they added some elements for the fans, something that was possible probably by the fact that they had 18 hours to toy with.


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[yaxomoxay]

It had a few decent moments, and mostly sucked.

I pretty much loved the whole episode, except I was underwhelmed by the Jeffries/Teapot. But can I really fault Lynch for that? Not really, since it was better than a Bowie recast.

Yeah the teapot was weird, but in a saga with dopplegangers and lookalikes a re-cast of such an important character would've added another unpredictable element.


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