Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby sylvia_north » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:13 pm

"Night Electricity" Dean Hurley was the Mr C driving music- I was listening to that album last night. My favorite song from it along with One Chord Blues. I don't think there's much place for Angelo in this dark realm, but the oldie's appearance goodie struck all the chords.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Candie » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:14 pm

mtsi wrote:I don't get the hate. THIS episode was fantastic. Loved it all. Loved the Audrey ending completely. Can't wait for next week....mostly because someone I know is in the episode. Can you imagine??

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1. Richard's character did nothing other than establish what a bad guy he is for several episodes and then died for no apparent reason.
2. "I am 25 years your senior" This line is so badly written that it either is trying to imply something that it doesn't (that Richard is 25 years old; Dooper escaped 25 years agol! Did we hit you over the head with the fact that he's his son enough yet?), or is trying to imply something seemingly irrelevant (that Dooper was 25 years old at the time that Richard was born)
3. "Goodbye, son" Yes, I gathered. Thank you for the exposition spoken to absolutely no one. No one - incidentally, the same group of people who hadn't already figured that out.
4. Did Chantelle and the other dude drive from South Dakota to New York back to Los Vegas in the span of a few episodes? I mean they have those fancy extradimensional guns or whatever but must we really take this to a place of time travel/portals? I mean, why didn't they just teleport themselves out of the shootout if they're really that magical? I'm aware that you can impose time travel/portal limitations that make this not a plot hole but you're getting into real "convenient for the writers" territory there.
5. Speaking of which, I appreciated the shootout scene for its humor, but that renders Chantelle and the dude also totally pointless. As far as I can remember (to be fair, due to the pacing of the show I really might be forgetting something important) all they really do is kill the warden, the glass box guy, and then try to kill cooper. The warden being dead didn't really change anything did it? And the glass box guys being dead might be important, but it's not like it made any more sense for Chantelle to do it than any other random hit man. And the guy who kills them is hilarious and all, but it kind of feels like Deus Ex Insurance Guy when Cooper wouldn't have even been around for them to shoot him anyway. All three of them could have been removed from the plot and nothing would have really changed much.
6. Diane's rape being used as a shallow plot device is insulting compared to the nuance and depth Laura's rape got in FWWM. Sure, what do you expect from a rape demon (if that really is bob, though at this point I massively doubt even that) but there was still no need to take it to a place like that.
7. As I already mentioned, Cooper coming out of his coma totally cured is beyond cliche and one of the biggest writing sins I can think of, and undermines a lot of what Stooper Coop's story had to say about mental disabilities, since disabled people don't suddenly "snap out of it" as such, even with everyone around them expecting them to/hoping for it.
8. Audrey dancing to her old song... wasn't that exactly what some hater-haters in this thread were mockingly accusing us of wanting in this thread earlier? I won't rip this scene too hard, since I can see redeemable qualities in it, especially taking the very ending into consideration, but it did feel like pretty blatantly out of place fanservice, at least at the beginning.

This is all only what I can come up with off the top of my head... due to the disconnected pacing I find I consistently forget about half the scenes pretty much instantaneously, so I'm sure there's something I'm leaving out.

In addition, anywhere outside of this thread I'm seeing nothing but "HOLY SHIT THAT WAS THE BEST HOUR OF TELEVISION". Nearly everyone else is too blindly excited by Coop's return to criticize at all... so don't worry, you're not going against the grain by "not understanding the hate". There's really very little hate to understand.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby mtsi » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:37 pm

No judgement. Just that I personally loved this part. Looking forward.


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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby John Justice Wheeler » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:37 pm

Candie wrote:In addition, anywhere outside of this thread I'm seeing nothing but "HOLY SHIT THAT WAS THE BEST HOUR OF TELEVISION". Nearly everyone else is too blindly excited by Coop's return to criticize at all... so don't worry, you're not going against the grain by "not understanding the hate". There's really very little hate to understand.

LOL. Well, I'm with you at least. The excessive praise seems utterly ludicrous to me.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby sylvia_north » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:42 pm

I wanted to be grumpy about Diane saying fuck you to OAM. I wanted to be grumpy about the theme song in a Vegas hospital. Candie saying the gangsters had hearts of gold. Jerry being a moron. I just can't, I accept the goofiness like Dick Tremayne and the ferret. Won over at last. Deepest sorrow for those who have been profoundly disappointed. :cry:
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby mtsi » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:44 pm

Same.


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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby mlsstwrt » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:57 pm

John Justice Wheeler wrote:
Candie wrote:In addition, anywhere outside of this thread I'm seeing nothing but "HOLY SHIT THAT WAS THE BEST HOUR OF TELEVISION". Nearly everyone else is too blindly excited by Coop's return to criticize at all... so don't worry, you're not going against the grain by "not understanding the hate". There's really very little hate to understand.

LOL. Well, I'm with you at least. The excessive praise seems utterly ludicrous to me.


They say, 'Best hour of TV' every week.

That said I haven't seen the latest episode yet so withholding judgement. One thing that does bother me is the hypocrisy - 'Oh you disappointed people just want the same old thing.'

'Oh the old Cooper is back!!! This is incredible!'
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby nimeoa » Sun Aug 27, 2017 11:59 pm

All the Cooper stuff was cool. It was extremely lame how he just snapped back and rendered the last 15 hours of Dougie kinda pointless, but whatever. Everything else was just... Eh... definitely not the worst. But boy, this close to the end, it makes you wish there had been a bit (a lot) more substance to tie all this together.

It's genuinely exciting that we have Coop back... But then you remember there are only 2 episodes left, and it dampens it quite a bit.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby John Justice Wheeler » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:03 am

I've gone back and forth on the show all summer. It's been a profoundly complicated and disquieting experience for me.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby referendum » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:24 am

7. As I already mentioned, Cooper coming out of his coma totally cured is beyond cliche and one of the biggest writing sins I can think of, and undermines a lot of what Stooper Coop's story had to say about mental disabilities, since disabled people don't suddenly "snap out of it" as such, even with everyone around them expecting them to/hoping for it.


Then I think you are projecting something on this storyline that was not there. Cooper was not 'mentally disabled' while he was Dougie - he was stuck in a psychic limbo, trapped in the shell of Dougie's life, aware of everything that was going on ( eg Mullin's gun), unable to break out of the trap that Bad Coop set for him , but still able to be an influence for good in the lives of the people around him, recognise their qualities, and exercise moral judgements.
It would have made no sense for him to gradually regain his faculties. He either returns as Dale Cooper, or he is stuck as Dougie. It is exactly that the people have been complaining about for the last 13 weeks :D
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby squealy » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:42 am

Candie wrote:4. Did Chantelle and the other dude drive from South Dakota to New York back to Los Vegas in the span of a few episodes?

They were never in New York. Duncan Todd's office is also in Vegas.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Candie » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:11 am

referendum wrote:Then I think you are projecting something on this storyline that was not there. Cooper was not 'mentally disabled' while he was Dougie - he was stuck in a psychic limbo, trapped in the shell of Dougie's life, aware of everything that was going on ( eg Mullin's gun), unable to break out of the trap that Bad Coop set for him , but still able to be an influence for good in the lives of the people around him, recognise their qualities, and exercise moral judgements.
It would have made no sense for him to gradually regain his faculties. He either returns as Dale Cooper, or he is stuck as Dougie. It is exactly that the people have been complaining about for the last 13 weeks :D

Because people with mental handicaps are never aware of their surroundings or their situation, riiight. Lots of people have been drawing parallels to Alzheimers and other things, it's not really that unexpected.


squealy wrote:
Candie wrote:4. Did Chantelle and the other dude drive from South Dakota to New York back to Los Vegas in the span of a few episodes?

They were never in New York. Duncan Todd's office is also in Vegas.

Someone else corrected me on that recently. Sure would have been nice if we'd ever seen them interacting with the rest of the Vegas cast, outside their office, or had any indication through set design that their offices were in fact in Vegas. :roll: We all assumed they were in NY because the set design was most similar to the glass box room in NY and I feel like they were even connected to the glass box... though to be honest they're such badly written characters that I've totally forgotten how they were supposed to be relevant at this point... and now they're dead, so....
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby dronerstone » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:17 am

LOVED Part 16 apart from the Audrey/Charlie scenes. If this isn't wrapped up properly I consider TPTR's Audrey arc useless. I strongly hope for the opposite, because it would be the only thing that I don't like about the new season thus far.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Candie » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:23 am

dronerstone wrote:LOVED Part 16 apart from the Audrey/Charlie scenes. If this isn't wrapped up properly I consider TPTR's Audrey arc useless. I strongly hope for the opposite, because it would be the only thing that I don't like about the new season thus far.

I guess if not she'll be in good company with Shelley and her daughter and her boyfriend; Dr. Jacoby, Nadine, Ed, and Norma; Richard and the rest of the Hornes.... honestly most of the rest of the cast.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby dronerstone » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:27 am

Candie wrote:
dronerstone wrote:LOVED Part 16 apart from the Audrey/Charlie scenes. If this isn't wrapped up properly I consider TPTR's Audrey arc useless. I strongly hope for the opposite, because it would be the only thing that I don't like about the new season thus far.

I guess if not she'll be in good company with Shelley and her daughter and her boyfriend; Dr. Jacoby, Nadine, Ed, and Norma; Richard and the rest of the Hornes.... honestly most of the rest of the cast.


Nah, I guess the rest is fine, they're just living their daily life in a weird 2017-Lynchian way, but in Audrey's case it kinda seems deeper - I'd just want to be able to understand it through context, that's all.

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