Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

[mlsstwrt]

With the demise of Chantal and Hutch, I'm left wondering - has Lynch been waiting since 1994 to let us know he's not that keen on Tarantino?

Honestly, what was the point of these two except to carry out acts of pointless violence, bitch about fast food, then get dispatched in an over the top shower of bullets as a result of a banal road rage altercation, unconnected to the main plot (such as it is).

This really is Lynch's Love Actually - a rag bag of incomplete ideas stitched together under a nominally unifying banner.

You don't think they typify an underlying culture of ignorance/violence/hatred prevalent in America (and the world) today? They're only unconnected to the plot if you're totally incapable of reading anything vaguely thematic into what you're watching.

Hi. You're obviously lost. This is the disappointed thread. You're looking for the, 'Anything clearly irrelevant to the plot is still brilliant because it's a commentary on the state of America' thread.

[boske]

There is a story of certain Bonnie and Clyde, maybe some visiting posters should have read that first before painting with a wide brush. Why pile everything up on this generation? I have two kids, 15 and 9, I do not think they are at fault for what is going on in the world.

[mlsstwrt]

There is a story of certain Bonnie and Clyde, maybe some visiting posters should have read that first before painting with a wide brush. Why pile everything up on this generation? I have two kids, 15 and 9, I do not think they are at fault for what is going on in the world.

They're responsible for all of it Boske and you know it.

[boske]

Yeah, we went over that facet before. It is hard to find a decent person in the Return that is less than 60 years old. Try it. Maybe only that guy who brought DougieCoop his coffee. And Miriam the teacher, kind of. Remember that young woman that was Dougie's co-worker. How was she different from Tracey? Ah, she did not bring him any coffee.

[boske]

I just want to thanks you because it's what I feel exactly. You put it better than I would ever been able to. It was like watching a cruel parody of what was once a beautiful story. It's like watching a kid who don't like a toy anymore and just destroy it with a hammer. It was a beautiful and precious toy, and now it's just reduced to broken pieces scattered on the ground.

Thank you for these kind words, there are so many great people in this thread, I learn something new every day. I wish I could learn something from the Return.

[AnotherBlueRoseCase]

We really have to hope that The Return isn’t Audrey’s coma dream.

Audrey has no business having extended dreams about Gordon Cole, or having dreams about his dreams. Or having dreams about his dreams about Monica Bellucci, an actor whose career hadn’t begun when Audrey entered her coma. Or having dreams peppered with references to movies made by David Lynch in the late nineties and later.

The fact that this is all now a possibility, though, makes waiting for this ending even more like waiting for that box at the end of Se7en. Please no.

[Mr. Reindeer]

In regards to the attempts of some to drop in on this thread seemingly attempting to win converts, I'm reminded of a favorite piece of wisdom from a Mr. Donald Draper: "I'm not here to tell you about Jesus. Either he lives in your heart or he doesn't."

[referendum]

@boske

It is hard to find a decent person in the Return that is less than 60 years old.

ha. good one.

[Bookworm]

We really have to hope that The Return isn’t Audrey’s coma dream.

Audrey has no business having extended dreams about Gordon Cole, or having dreams about his dreams. Or having dreams about his dreams about Monica Bellucci, an actor whose career hadn’t begun when Audrey entered her coma. Or having dreams peppered with references to movies made by David Lynch in the late nineties and later.

The fact that this is all now a possibility, though, makes waiting for this ending even more like waiting for that box at the end of Se7en. Please no.

If this end up being the case, I would be in the same psychological state as Brad Pitt after he open that box.

[BOB1]

Oh dear. I hope it's NOT the case.

Good (and sad) point about these people under 60. I wanted to jump in and say: Naido, cause I kind of think she is really OK. But she might be something of a spirit from another world so she could as well be 560

Mike (lodge Mike) has become something of a bitch hasn't he?

Yeah, this is one is over 60 but he doesn't make a good impression at all. In fact this Returned Mike is one my bigger disappointments. He was so great in the original and even greater in FWWM (you stole the corn! give me all my garmonbozia!). He was SOMEONE. Now he looks kind of like a grumpy school caretaker who goes around trying to make himself look important but he is what he is and it shows. Anyway, pleasant or not, the character completely lost any feeling of power, didn't he? At best, he is a sort of an assistant in difficult otherwordly situations. He'll hand you the ring, he'll tell you a word of advice, I mean I can't really remember whatever he managed to do in those episodes where he turned up. Feels safe to say that he's been a useless character?
Yeah, like so many others. Dougie would have made it without him. Cause Dougie is the man!

What is the difference between declaring something an artistic failure and stating one simply does not like a piece of art? That's my issue with the term 'artistic failure'- it give the air of something that is a critical consensus but really it's a personal opinion.

I don't know that there is a difference. I was taught at some point that you never use the words "In my opinion..." when writing a critical analysis because it's implied in every single sentence. I understand why you think "artistic failure" sounds like a sweeping objective statement, but I don't take it that way. Like pretty much everything else in critical review, I think it's a deeply subjective phrase meant to convey a PERSONAL opinion that the artist has failed that particular viewer/patron/consumer. I might be wrong, and I'm sure a few users on here (both pro and con) feel their opinion is objective truth, but I truly believe that "in my opinion..." is implied in most of the posts in this thread.

Thanks a lot for saying that!
My take on this:
"Objective-objective" is saying that I am the owner of The Truth and I know better. Example: blue is an ugly colour so if you've got a new blue t-shirt, it's just a bad choice..
"Subjective-subjective" is saying that I like or dislike something because of some personal reason, perhaps for instance something touches a subject matter which is very important for me or an artist just works on the same wavelength as I do, or there is something in the style, aesthetics which particularly appeals to me. Example: I hate blue so sorry but I just don't like your new t-shirt.
"Subjective objective" is saying how some artistic choices resonate with my critical sense, how I place it in a context of other things which I like or dislike. I'm triyng to be objective there but it isn't some kind of universal objectivity but it is just my own objectivity. Example: I think blue is a bad choice for this design of t-shirt because a warmer colour would work better.

It's not Oriental philosophy, but it has a similar kind of logic that appeals to my spiritual nature

[mlsstwrt]

Exactly Bob-1. A grumpy old caretaker! Exactly right, that's what he is. He's like the Black Lodge whipping boy lol.

[AnotherBlueRoseCase]

We really have to hope that The Return isn’t Audrey’s coma dream.

Audrey has no business having extended dreams about Gordon Cole, or having dreams about his dreams. Or having dreams about his dreams about Monica Bellucci, an actor whose career hadn’t begun when Audrey entered her coma. Or having dreams peppered with references to movies made by David Lynch in the late nineties and later.

The fact that this is all now a possibility, though, makes waiting for this ending even more like waiting for that box at the end of Se7en. Please no.

If this end up being the case, I would be in the same psychological state as Brad Pitt after he open that box.

An ending that bad would be the artistic equivalent of John Doe's deathwish.

[douglasb]

Mike's lessened 'power' may simply be due to the the fact that Al Strobel is 78 years old. He's clearly a little frail and combined with the way Lynch has shot the Red Room, he sometimes looks a little diminished.

[boske]

Mike's lessened 'power' may simply be due to the the fact that Al Strobel is 78 years old. He's clearly a little frail and combined with the way Lynch has shot the Red Room, he sometimes looks a little diminished.

Yes. Let us not forget this is a fine actor and a gentleman. I wish I look that good when I am 78 if I get there.

[bowisneski]

Besides my thank you post a few pages back, I had planned on only reading this thread until the whole show was over because some of the later parts made me appreciate earlier parts more, but Part 16 has left me with a feeling that I want to put out there and I don't have anyone else to talk to this about until a friend gets back from vacation next week and has a chance to watch Part 16.

Part 16 was an unmitigated emotional success for me - I felt the tension as Mr. C and Richard approached the coordinates, dread and slight annoyance filled me as I saw Coop in a coma, Diane opening up touched me and made me feel for this woman who had been replaced, I smiled through the entire Cooper awakening, and the Eddie Vedder song brought tears to my eyes because it seemed like a tight focus on what this season has been about. However, as it stands pre-finale, the more I think about it the more it feels as if it has failed me from a story/character perspective. Despite being only 27, so much of this season that has resonated with me was about loss and the inability to return to comfort or real familiarity from the past, hence the Vedder song connecting with me. I thought that Dougie encapsulated that loss and frustration wonderfully, with only the occasional falter. Yet, in Part 16, there is the Dale Cooper we all missed back at 100%. While it made me grin from ear to ear and feel that wonderful joy and comfort, I feel he should have never been back to 100% after what he has experienced and the true loss of 25 years of his life, especially with the themes the season has seemed to be built around. Maybe we'll get to deal with that next week and I'll be satisfied by both the plot and emotion, but I just needed to vent that this week.