What we learned about the Twin Peaks mythology in part 8 (SPOILERS)

[Mr. Reindeer]

One more landmark in Part 8: I think this is the first time in TP history that it becomes 100% hard canon that the real-life Roadhouse performers are playing themselves. (The Access Guide and trading cards referred to Julee Cruise by name as a character, but the series credits always left it ambiguous whether she was playing herself, a spirit, or a generic human singer).

[sylviecerise]

One more landmark in Part 8: I think this is the first time in TP history that it becomes 100% hard canon that the real-life Roadhouse performers are playing themselves. (The Access Guide and trading cards referred to Julee Cruise by name as a character, but the series credits always left it ambiguous whether she was playing herself, a spirit, or a generic human singer).

But Nine Inch Nails was playing "The Nine Inch Nails". Different name.

[Mr. Reindeer]

I'm guessing one of those Woodsman is Mike/the Arm/MfAP).

I posted this in the episode mega thread, but I feel pretty sure the bug is the first stage of the MfAP/arm/tree/whatever's evolution. Listen to the sounds! Just before it climbs into its host's mouth (aided by the woodsman's radio skillz) it makes the same sound as the tree does in episode 1 or 2 ("I am the arm and I sound like this"). Plus, what other so-called lodge spirit evolves to and from strange forms like that?

I love this idea, and I want to believe you, but I've watched the scene multiple times and I'm not hearing it. Where exactly do you hear this?

[alreadygoneplaces]

I'm guessing one of those Woodsman is Mike/the Arm/MfAP).

I posted this in the episode mega thread, but I feel pretty sure the bug is the first stage of the MfAP/arm/tree/whatever's evolution. Listen to the sounds! Just before it climbs into its host's mouth (aided by the woodsman's radio skillz) it makes the same sound as the tree does in episode 1 or 2 ("I am the arm and I sound like this"). Plus, what other so-called lodge spirit evolves to and from strange forms like that?

I love this idea, and I want to believe you, but I've watched the scene multiple times and I'm not hearing it. Where exactly do you hear this?

My mistake, I rewatched the arm scene in E1 and my memory of that sound was wrong. It was the wing flutter sound the bug makes which reminded me of it, and I remembered the arm's sound being more fluttery and less elongated and wind-like. It could still be suggestive of it, if the bug turned out to be the arm, but I probably jumped the gun here. I stick by the prediction, sound or no sound, it feels right!

[BigEd]

Do we think there was just one moth/frog, or that we just saw one of many eggs that hatched and spawned a throat seeking creature?

[DoppelBocker]

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[DoppelBocker]

Mr. Reindeer wrote: While the "Woodsman" image obviously has a lot of resonance for the Washington setting, it's kind of funny that they "come through" in New Mexico, a state not exactly known for its logging industry. For that reason, I do tend to assume they're Lodge spirits and not, say, the resurrected dead (as much as the idea of a Logger's Graveyard in the New Mexico desert amuses me).

They appear in New Mexico due to this particular explosion seen in this episode being in same location as the hellgate Mark Frost describes in Secret History of Twin Peaks. Furthermore, the book exposits the desert here as translating to "journey of the dead man" and I think this fits the narrative of this episode quite well. The book also exposits on real life stories concerning Parson's doing Babylon Working here year after this Trinity explosion took place (both location as well as fact detonation took place here year before inspired him to do this). Seems odd if Mark Frost went through chapters picking points within these conspiracy theries to weave into the "Secret History of Twin Peaks" for no reason at all.

Also, I think these charcoal covered people referred to as woodsmen for narrative expository purposes on Lynch's part. I see them as sort of the stage crew for the black lodge or the spirits that are bound to our physical plane perhaps wandering about like mindless ghosts fullfilling their purpose when drawn out by something that triggers them to appear. Perhaps they were once pioneer explorers (some part of Lois and Clark's team as described in book?) becoming entrapped in their ways continuing their life of drudgery into the afterlife. It appears outside entites certainly seem to use them for particular purposes whether this be the black lodge or some end of days scenario (could be either) where rise up and at beck and call to go through the scenario laying out the traintracks kind of thing.

BigEd Wrote: Do we think there was just one moth/frog, or that we just saw one of many eggs that hatched and spawned a throat seeking creature?

I would infer since many eggs shown that multiple went through. Unlike the Bob egg (guessing more of a vessel than an egg for him to crossover and shephard these in a way), these eggs seem to have crossed over in a physical sense. I say this cause we see the Bob egg beginning of episode being taken out of Dopplecoop is immaterial like Bob and still looks same so most likely is a vessel (Dopplecoop flickers in and out showing his contact with Woodsmen have this effect as they're triggered to perform whatever task it is they're supposed to perform). My guess is the woodsmen perhaps could've spread these around from the convenience store (cuts to black as creature appears spewing them out from other plane or dimension of darkness or perhaps just fell down from explosion all over.




As far as the Bob egg, I wonder if anyone has insight supposed origins of Bob before this episode? I remember season 2 Leland mentioning a summer home where he first met Bob as well as a character named Bob getting lost near owl cave in 1800's in Secret History Book. How does this compare to the new information given in this episode?

[PsychoFox]

- When ??? sees the movie we just watched and sees Bob, he seems to give birth to a golden orb that contains the spirit of Laura Palmer... is "spirit" too on point? Essence maybe. Whatever her face was in the golden orb. This orb is sent down to earth. The next shot is the bug hatching. Is what happened to the orb? If we follow what happens linearly, it should be. So is the spirit of Laura Palmer in the bug? And is the girl Sarah Palmer? She is a curly haired brunette, the young actress bears some resemblance to Grace Zabriskie. Why were the ashen figures who helped Bob/Cooper also interested in this bug finding a host if it was connected to Laura Palmer? Maybe they have more neutral intentions? I guess I haven't got a handle on that yet.

For me, the bug hatching is the Bob egg, not the Laura orb. And Sarah Palmer was born in 1945. The actress swallowing the bug is too old to have 11 years old.

Are we sure about the birth year of Dale Cooper ? 1954 or 1956 ?

[sackboy97]

I think it's more likely that the bug is from one of the other eggs, rather than the BOB "orb". They made them different in the previous scene, I don't see why they would change it later.

[Panapaok]

The mother (?) clearly vomits many eggs along with BOB. The froglike bug is some manifestation of evil. Now the identity of the girl is obviously a mystery but the most probable scenario is that she's just a random girl (first victim?), that represents humanity/innocence. The evil seeds are starting being planted within humanity.

[Firewalkwithme91]

I don´t know if we should have a seperate thread for re-evaluating the original series with these new explanations and backstory but right now as I´m re-watching the whole show a lot of scenes have an entirely different meaning to me. Like f.e. did the Giant intervene when Cooper was shot, making sure he gets enough clues to solve this crime before another would happen? Or is he ready to sacrifice Cooper for the sake of having him go into the lodge to save Laura because she´s more important? I mean part 8 of the Return makes the Giant seem like an benevolent creature but maybe the lodges simply want to achieve their goals by sacrificing people on the chess board.

[Ragnell]

I don´t know if we should have a seperate thread for re-evaluating the original series with these new explanations and backstory but right now as I´m re-watching the whole show a lot of scenes have an entirely different meaning to me. Like f.e. did the Giant intervene when Cooper was shot, making sure he gets enough clues to solve this crime before another would happen? Or is he ready to sacrifice Cooper for the sake of having him go into the lodge to save Laura because she´s more important? I mean part 8 of the Return makes the Giant seem like an benevolent creature but maybe the lodges simply want to achieve their goals by sacrificing people on the chess board.

Depends on what you mean by sacrifice. Cooper's not placed in danger by following the Giant's clues anymore than he'd choose to be. Cooper still makes the choices to place himself in danger, to sacrifice himself. The reaction of the Giant when Maddy died was mournful, as if he was informing Cooper of a failure not as if things were going according to plan. His reaction when Cooper took up with Annie wasn't the reaction of someone who's sacrificing Cooper to the Lodge to save Laura.

I mean, Cooper's clearly expendable to the Lodges but I wouldn't call him the Giant's pawn. He's an agent, and the Giant so far has been playing straight with him.

Now, MIKE/The Arm/TOAM seem to be willing to achieve a goal by sacrificing pieces on a chessboard. This spirit (or group of spirits) seem to be on Laura and Cooper's sides in most actions, but its like this is only so far as they can screw over BOB somehow.

The spirits the Return has me rethinking are the Tremonds and the White Horse.

[4815162342]

Generally the Giant seems like a benevolent figure, but, no matter what they say now, if he knew Leland was Bob (and I think he did), he is complicit at least in Maddie's murder, if not Laura's and Teresa's. "It is happening again" - WHAT IS? mr giant? what is? Tell me so I can do something instead of sitting here twiddling my thumbs....

[Mr. Reindeer]

I've seen some speculation that ??????? is God. I doubt L/F will go that route. But in light of this theory (and assuming Giant and ??????? are the same character -- a big assumption), it's interesting that the Giant in the original show talks about all he is "permitted" to say.

[KyleRickards]

Generally the Giant seems like a benevolent figure, but, no matter what they say now, if he knew Leland was Bob (and I think he did), he is complicit at least in Maddie's murder, if not Laura's and Teresa's. "It is happening again" - WHAT IS? mr giant? what is? Tell me so I can do something instead of sitting here twiddling my thumbs....

Good point. Mind you, does he ever say something directly? It's always some clue or riddle!


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