POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

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In your opinion, what is the nature of Audrey’s situation in Part 12?

Poll ended at Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:37 am

She is in the “real” world of Twin Peaks.
57
38%
She is in a coma, and the scene takes place in her head.
29
19%
She is not in a coma, but she is dreaming.
2
1%
She is not in a coma or dreaming, but experiencing a psychological delusion.
40
26%
She is trapped in the Black Lodge.
7
5%
Audrey and Charlie are acting in or rehearsing for a movie or play (not Twin Peaks)
5
3%
Other (please explain in thread)
12
8%
 
Total votes: 152
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Jasper
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POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Jasper » Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:37 am

Audrey-related discussion has gotten pretty wild, so it's time to have some fun and discover what most people on the forum are really thinking about Audrey's strange scene in Part 12 (EDIT: And ongoing scenes relating to Audrey).

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Last edited by Jasper on Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:43 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Cooperscoffeecup » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:23 am

It's a movie set and she is acting.
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wxray
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby wxray » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:31 am

Cooperscoffeecup wrote:It's a movie set and she is acting.

Good one! Did you just watch Mulholland Drive? :)
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby MoondogJR » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:32 am

Cooperscoffeecup wrote:It's a movie set and she is acting.


I like that idea.
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Jasper
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Jasper » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:33 am

Cooperscoffeecup wrote:It's a movie set and she is acting.


I'd forgotten about this one, though I'd seen it suggested in the Part 12 thread. I've added this as an option in the poll. You'll be able to switch your vote.

EDIT: Uh oh, looks like adding a new voting option erases existing votes. This is an unpleasant surprise. Sorry folks, please vote again. :(

(For the record, there were about five votes for "real world", and one that would have been for "movie".)
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Cooperscoffeecup » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:43 am

wxray wrote:
Cooperscoffeecup wrote:It's a movie set and she is acting.

Good one! Did you just watch Mulholland Drive? :)


I have not seen MD yet. :)

It just doesn't sit well with me that with the people she mentions, she is practically mirroring scenarios in TP proper. It would also explain why Truman went to Ben, if Audrey is Richard's mother, she doesn't live in Twin Peaks for Truman to call on her. She can't be still in a coma, didn't the Doc say she WAS in a coma?

The top she has on, has puzzled me since Sherilyn posted a photo of her on set. For a while I tried to work out what she would be doing now to be dressed like that. It seems a bit over the top for her to be in the town of TP's.
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Jonah » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:48 am

I love all these theories (and there's definitely a lot of strange stuff to notice in that scene, especially how they barely move) but I think she's just Audrey and in the "real" Twin Peaks. But I do think this entire series may turn out to be a dream, ala (possibly) "Mulholland Drive".
Actually, now that some time has passed, I like "The full blossom of the evening".
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Rami Airola » Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:51 am

Not sure if I mentioned it here or on another board but my first thought during watching the scene for the first time was that this has to be a scene where she's rehearsing for some theater play or movie. I didn't think of it as an actual movie set as some have suggested it could be but now as it's in the poll I think I'll double down on that!
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby waferwhitemilk » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:05 am

Metamorphia
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Metamorphia » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:26 am

I really like the rehearsal idea. It of course mirrors the scene in MD with Watts/Harring (and how we initially don't know until Lynch reveals the scripts), and the Panavision camera dispelling "reality" in Inland Empire at the end.

But does Charlie ever call her "Audrey"? I haven't seen the scene back so can't remember. If he does then it's probably not a scene from a movie.

Don't forget as well that MD was originally devised as Audrey Horne goes to Hollywood, so maybe Lynch still has the idea of Audrey being an aspiring actress.
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:37 am

Metamorphia wrote:But does Charlie ever call her "Audrey"? I haven't seen the scene back so can't remember. If he does then it's probably not a scene from a movie.


Yes, he says Audrey's name at least once (I think multiple times). The "movie scene" idea crossed my mind on initial viewing, but I abandoned it once he said her name. The coma theory has a lot more merit, but my issue is that L/F simply haven't been playing these sorts of narrative games. To date, this hasn't been Mr. Robot. The storytelling is very straightforward. But, if they were to do so, this would be the place to do it IMO -- not in the cliche "plot twist" alternate reality way that many were theorizing about Las Vegas, TSHoTP, etc., but in a context that says something about a character's journey a la MD.
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Metamorphia » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:39 am

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
Metamorphia wrote:But does Charlie ever call her "Audrey"? I haven't seen the scene back so can't remember. If he does then it's probably not a scene from a movie.


Yes, he says Audrey's name at least once (I think multiple times). The "movie scene" idea crossed my mind on initial viewing, but I abandoned it once he said her name. The coma theory has a lot more merit, but my issue is that L/F simply haven't been playing these sorts of narrative games. To date, this hasn't been Mr. Robot. The storytelling is very straightforward. But, if they were to do so, this would be the place to do it IMO -- not in the cliche "plot twist" alternate reality way that many were theorizing about Las Vegas, TSHoTP, etc., but in a context that says something about a character's journey a la MD.


Ah, OK. Probably not then. Neat idea though, liked the sound of it.
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby 4815162342 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 5:46 am

Anything but #1 seems like wishful thinking to me.
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Dreamy Audrey » Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:39 am

Metamorphia wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:
Metamorphia wrote:But does Charlie ever call her "Audrey"? I haven't seen the scene back so can't remember. If he does then it's probably not a scene from a movie.


Yes, he says Audrey's name at least once (I think multiple times). The "movie scene" idea crossed my mind on initial viewing, but I abandoned it once he said her name. The coma theory has a lot more merit, but my issue is that L/F simply haven't been playing these sorts of narrative games. To date, this hasn't been Mr. Robot. The storytelling is very straightforward. But, if they were to do so, this would be the place to do it IMO -- not in the cliche "plot twist" alternate reality way that many were theorizing about Las Vegas, TSHoTP, etc., but in a context that says something about a character's journey a la MD.


Ah, OK. Probably not then. Neat idea though, liked the sound of it.

The rehearsing/filming theory was my initial thought when I saw the scene because it seemed very soapy compared to the rest of this season. The name isn't really a problem - sometimes the character has the same name as the actor, sometimes that even happens with unusual names. But I think if they had been filming, it would have been revealed at the end of the scene. What would be the point of keeping that secret until the end of the series and revealing that Audrey hasn't anything to do with the story at all?

I think Audrey might be trapped in the Lodge/Convenience Store/a similar place, though I think the Coma/Dream theory is also very likely. If it turns out this scene is actually taking place in the real world, I'd be disappointed because there are so many interesting clues in this scene. It would be a waste, in my opinion, if they didn't lead to anything.
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Re: POLL: The Nature of Audrey's Situation (Spoilers)

Postby Novalis » Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:17 am

I've gone for 'Other' because I'm undecided. The Audrey-Charlie scene is certainly weird. Weirder than normal -- for a given value of normal of course.

It refers to characters that don't yet exist for us, and may never do. So maybe these names are wrong or dream-code, as others have suggested. The two figures on screen barely move, as if in sleep paralysis. They can operate their arms -- Audrey puts on a coat, Charlie uses the phone -- but apparently their feet are rooted (or Charlie's butt, since he is sitting). This immobility comes close to a scene featuring a man who appears to have had extensive hip surgery or a damaged hip (Kriscol). While infirmity is often used in Lynch's works to either raise tension (compare the Zimmer-frame user at the junction in FWWM) or slow down the action, here it had been used to highlight how self-sacrificing one of Carl's trailer tenants was. Still, thematically, at an unconscious level the idea of difficult mobility nonetheless struggling to get things done (and, notably, having to sell blood to make ends meet) is implanted in this scene. Back to Audrey-Charlie: the sand-timer apparently doesn't flow. Deadlines loom. Announcements of leaving take place but no-one manages to go anywhere. A phone-call is made to establish information, which is never shared. Every action is thwarted. Charlie doesn't have a crystal ball, yet also has one. (Strange that 'crystal ball' reminds me of Chrysta Bell, but never mind that.) The scene is one long series of thwarted actions, truncated desires, frustrated questions -- very much like an anxiety dream. The similarity of the room's decor to spirit world interiors has been noted; personally I don't think it's so striking, and the room is far more populated with bric-a-brac than the sparsely ornamented lodge worlds. The woodiness of the room is continuous with other Twin Peaks locales, if that is where we are.

So I'm not decided. If this is a dream, and the stone-like, impassive Charlie is just the manifest dream content standing in for a very difficult relationship (which would be the latent content) then the scene works very well. On the other hand, there are also signals that events mentioned in the dream also occurred outside the dream: the RR diner scene in which Bing asks if anyone has seen Billy. But, again, this is not so clearly an objective third-person POV scene either, since the diner customers play quantum musical chairs in that scene. It's almost as if an objective POV was suddenly overlaid with Audrey's dream. I can't help feeling this may be overcomplicating things: is the direction really this deep? I can't say.

One other possibility I considered is that we are not witnessing either a dream or a straightforward interaction, but a distorted recollection. That is to say, the events have already happened, but this is the way Audrey remembers them.

Finally, it's just possible that this is a very expressionistic scene. In which case it is objective insofar as it references a wider plot and the actions of people outside of it, but deeply subjective as to the way in which elements appear within it. Emotions distort the representations; the argument felt like it went on forever, and so the sand-timer doesn't move; Audrey felt immobilised by frustration, and so this is expressed as a generalised immobility suffusing the whole scene and everyone in it. Given the profoundly Kafkaesque figure of Charlie at his desk inundated with paperwork and a pressing deadline, committed absolutely to it irrespective of hell or high water, this is also a pleasing interpretation.

And perhaps we'll never know.
As a matter of fact, 'Chalfont' was the name of the people that rented this space before. Two Chalfonts. Weird, huh?

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