The use of music in TPTR - yay or nay?

[claaa7]

I'm sure one of the big thing with the original series for most of us was its excellent use of music that often hovered in the background throughout entire scenes. Angelo Badalamenti and Lynched filled the series with brilliant original compositions and, imo, Fire Walk With Me took things even further by producing one of the best soundtracks of all time. the sound design of that film and certain episodes like ep. 14 and 29 was also on some real next level brilliance. with these things in mind it was quite jarring for most of us when the first four episodes of The Return rolled out and revealed that music was used very sparingly - especially considering that there was no new compositions at all by Angelo Badalamenti during these initial hours. many tried to make their own fanedits with new scenes using old Twin Peaks themes while others pointed out that the effective, creepy silence enhanced the often dark and moody visuals.

as we have moved along through the season more music has crept in and enriched many of the scenes. the use of silence to either enhance or counterpoint the visuals are still much a part of the seasons tactic (in fact episode 14 has the least credited music since the two part premier) but there's also been some stunningly gorgeous new Badalamenti compositions that really tug on your heartstrings. in contrast to the original Peaks which was all Angelo, however, the Return packs an eclectic mix of old and new instrumentals, Roadhouse live performances by a wide variety of artists (from Hudson Mohawke to the Cactus Blossoms, from Nine inch Nails to Lissie, etc.), synthesizer based compositions by Chromatics' Johnny Jewel, oldies but goodies (Santo & Johnny, Dave Brubeck, Booker T.) and the work of Dean Hurley and Lynch himself.

i've seen posters here commenting both positively and negatively on the use of music in the new series, so here goes a poll but please also write a few notes on why you voted as you did. if Mods feel that this discussion would be better in the Music sub-forum then please move it, but i think there is a much better chance for discussion here, plus it's mroe specificially on how the music is actually used in the series - together with the visuals, and what emotional impact they create together.

[claaa7]

personally i really like it a lot. i think it's effective the way there's so much silence so that each musical cue makes a scene stand out like crazy.. just look at the Accident scene which was the first time we heard a new Angelo compositions, such a stunning scene. had we had music constantly throughout the series up to that point i don't think it would have had quite the same emotional impact. plus the composition is gorgeous... actually i think all of Angelo's new compositions are heartbreakingly beautiful and really helps sell the scenes they accompany - the use of "Heartbreaking" being played over the Ms. Jackpot / Cooper and the Mitchum's scene was genial.

i also think it's great how they have incorporated the original soundtrack, especially "Laura Palmer's theme" and the opening theme song as well as cues from "FWWM". it brings back a sense of twisted nostalgia and makes your ears perk up and your heart beat a little faster every time something like that is used - hence it really enhances the scenes it does accompany. while i love the soundtrack to the original series and have them on CD/LP i think there was a tendency to overuse music at many times to the point where it loses any impact. especially if you're binge watching you might get a little sick of hearing the repetition of some of these themes.

the Roadhouse performances are very hit or miss for me. at its high point it flows into the scene and blends seamlessly with the visuals and the story being told, other times they feel like jarring interludes that you'd wish would be excised from the future Blu Ray and DVDs. its interesting that to me the scenes that best blend with the storytelling are the ones that i find myself listening to outside of watching the series. Chromatics (the first performance), Trouble, Nine Inch Nails and Rebekah Del Rio are the ones I feel are homeruns. i really liked the nostalgia of James Hurley's song as well... any of the others i could just as well seen let go and a couple has been pretty damn horrendous and while be very dated within a few years.

Johnny Jewel's "Windswept" album is a great disc that I strongly recommend any fan of the new series to seek out.. i've played it front-to-back countless times without tiring and every time a composition has been used in the series its been put to great effect.

last but not least, a big up for the sound design of Dean Hurley. even in the four initial episodes there's loads of interesting sound work being used and watching the series with headphones certainly enhances many scenes a whole lot.


Overall - i answer the poll with a big YES!!!

[dronerstone]

Definitely YAY.

When the first episodes started to come out, a lot of people were like "THERE'S NO MUSIC!!!!"
The came the music and they're like "IT'S NOT THE MUSIC THAT I WANT!!!!!!"

wtf, sit back and enjoy the ride instead. Puh-lease.

EDIT: And yup, Johnny's work is great. I bought that album and a few Chromatics records in digital form because they were for sale. Really liking those. The first few listens to "Windswept" I spent sitting still on my train to work looking out of the window feeling like our beloved DougieCoop. Haha!

[Trudy Chelgren]

I don't know. I feel it's so different sometimes. Some uses have felt beautiful, cinematic and appropriate. But I can't help feeling a lack of cohesion sometimes.

The best uses have been the Chromatics in Parts 1 & 2, which was as beautiful as 'The World Spins' or 'Questions in a World of Blue'. They were so chilling and exhilarating. I haven't felt as strongly about any of the other acts really. I might have enjoyed some, like Trouble. They brought a lot to that scene. All the other songs didn't feel as related to the events for me. Lissie's song could have had some momentous power, but it was coming off the back of some slow, disquieting scenes. It's pacing just didn't add up. I was also really distracted by a God-awful extra at the bottom of the frame in one shot. Don't know if anyone else saw him.

The soundtrack itself has been remarkable for the most part. I've loved the use of 'Windswept'. One of my favorite scenes in the whole of The Return was Cooper drawing on the case files, with 'Windswept' hanging subtly in the air. There was something so innocent and lonely about it. 'Heartbreaking' was incredible, a perfect marriage of action and score. The way the events intertwined with the music was astonishing. I loved the brazenness of 'I Am', it really took me by surprise and gave it's scenes a real rhythm.
'The Chair' is a beautiful piece, but I just haven't felt the scenes it's used in as deeply as some; I should have felt the weight of Garland's emotional legacy in Betty Briggs' scene, but something felt a little cloying. Maybe it was that Betty felt like she was being used as a mouthpiece for the advancement of the 'plot', with Bobby's emotions as window dressing for authenticity. I don't feel like I know Tammy well enough to feel moved when 'The Chair' was used when she was inducted into the 'Blue Rose Task Force', (I want to vomit every time I say that phrase) it felt too obviously plugged, like "you're supposed to feel the weight of her calling now".

Penderecki was great too. I read a post somewhere about imagining 'Television Snow' off of Windswept being used when Naido is found. Listening to the song, it felt perfect for me. So, very conflicting. But definitely some Twin Peaks-best uses of music.

[Mr. Strawberry]

Voted "really like". Also want to specify that I absolutely cannot stand the Roadhouse appearances. Good grief, what a disaster. However, those are more of an aside to the story.

The music used as soundtrack to the parts themselves is great. I'm all for the minimal use of music and am really appreciating the wide range of moody droning and low key soundscapes. They add to the scenes and enhance the feeling rather than drowning the viewer or overloading the delivery. The use of background music was excessive in the original two seasons, but there's a very good balance this time around.

[alreadygoneplaces]

Hate to be pedantic, and I do know what you mean when you say 'silence', but it still has to be said- there is pretty much no actual silence at any point in the whole series. Countless hours of painstaking work has gone into sculpting these 'silences'. To just look at it as 'music' vs 'silence' does a huge disservice to the rest of the sound work throughout, which has been excellent.

Overall, I rate the use of sound extremely highly- as for the portion of that sound that's unarguably musical, I've found it somewhat hit or miss. The amount of the old music they've used feels just right. Generally not a fan of the roadhouse performances with a couple of exceptions. Regardless of what I thought of the performances from The Chromatics, Rebekah Del Rio and Lissie (didn't like any of them, FWIW), I found it frustrating that they didn't go for more of a live sound with the production of these tracks. No matter how hard I tried, I couldn't fool my brain into believing I was watching a live performance at the Roadhouse, and therefore with each of these I felt like we'd just cut to a fairly unambitious music video. Trouble, Sharon Von Etten and NIN were much better integrated (although I have issues with NIN's inclusion for different reasons). Badalmenti's new pieces aren't doing it for me in this series- his synth sounds are certainly dated and have a certain timbral naivety which can work in some contexts but didn't feel like they were doing justice to the gravity of the scenes they were soundtracking here. I know others disagree here.

My sound highlights, not limited to music (sorry, I know that's not strictly what the thread's about, but I'm personally very interested and involved in this stuff, and there's no thread for sound in TP in a broader sense. Here goes:

- The breakfast scene with Take Five, which is really something special. It's a sorely overused classic, but it felt like the entirety of that scene was written to the piece. mirroring its rhythms and ebbs and flows in intensity. It's subtle, but I'd actually be surprised if it wasn't written this way. It's like a reversal of tired old John Williams style imitative/representative synchronism.

- All of episode 8. Such a bold choice to take such liberties with Penderecki's Threnody..., and I can't speak highly enough of that whole sequence audiovisually. They took what was already an almost overwhelmingly powerful and emotional piece of music and pumped it full of steroids. The role of sound in making the explosion scenes so physical and sublime has been roundly praised, but in my opinion, still hugely undervalued*. The Slow 30s room was just perfect. The slowed down Moonlight Sonata was also wonderfully creepy, and Ray's slowed down, muffled screams were really expressive. The use of 'My Prayer' was also a perfect Lynchian recontextualisation (those lyrics!) a-la 'In Dreams' in Blue Velvet.

* "By means of some mysterious perceptual alchemy, whatever virtues sound brings to the film are largely perceived and appreciated by the audience in visual terms- the better the sound, the better the image." - Michel Chion, Audio-Vision

- Sound design in Naido and American Girl's exit rooms; and Bobby's bad night with the gun-firing kid and horn-honking woman. The door-banging and horn-honking was so direct and relentless. I was going to say it reinforces the feeling of panic in these scenes, but I'd actually go as far as saying the sound generates it almost entirely here. Re: American Girl/Naido's exit rooms- I'm not saying that who/whatever was banging door won't be significant to the plot (it probably will, because of the repeated door shots and Augustine's line), but I also wouldn't be totally surprised if it doesn't figure at all. The door banging sound as an affective device is powerful enough to justify its inclusion, in the same way that there were strobe lights in the control room of the prison when the doppelgänger made his phonecall.

- The Sarah Palmer boxing match scene felt like a miniature self-contained sonic set piece. It's the second time we've checked in her at home and the black hole of her current existence, but this longer scene really allowed time to let the sound sink in, making us really feel the oppressiveness of the Palmer house...

- Harry Dean Stanton's song was a beautiful moment, sadly interrupted... It's a fuckin' nightmare.

- The processing on the Woodsman's voice. It's a fine line, getting the balance right on that one. Too natural and it doesn't work, but if we hear the technology any more, it also loses its otherworldliness

Finally... I'm still in utter disbelief at how few people there are receiving sound credits for such a mammoth project. These folks have been working seriously, seriously hard (and efficiently!).

[Panapaok]

It's fine. A little bit more new Badalamenti would be great but alas. Dean Hurley's ambient music is excellent.

[claaa7]

Hate to be pedantic, and I do know what you mean when you say 'silence', but it still has to be said- there is pretty much no actual silence at any point in the whole series. Countless hours of painstaking work has gone into sculpting these 'silences'. To just look at it as 'music' vs 'silence' does a huge disservice to the rest of the sound work throughout, which has been excellent.

Overall, I rate the use of sound extremely highly- as for the portion of that sound that's unarguably musical, I've found it somewhat hit or miss. The amount of the old music they've used feels just right. Generally not a fan of the roadhouse performances with a couple of exceptions. Regardless of what I thought of the performances from The Chromatics, Rebekah Del Rio and Lissie (didn't like any of them, FWIW), I found it frustrating that they didn't go for more of a live sound with the production of these tracks. No matter how hard I tried, I couldn't fool my brain into believing I was watching a live performance at the Roadhouse, and therefore with each of these I felt like we'd just cut to a fairly unambitious music video. Trouble, Sharon Von Etten and NIN were much better integrated (although I have issues with NIN's inclusion for different reasons). Badalmenti's new pieces aren't doing it for me in this series- his synth sounds are certainly dated and have a certain timbral naivety which can work in some contexts but didn't feel like they were doing justice to the gravity of the scenes they were soundtracking here. I know others disagree here.

My sound highlights, not limited to music (sorry, I know that's not strictly what the thread's about, but I'm personally very interested and involved in this stuff, and there's no thread for sound in TP in a broader sense. Here goes:

- The breakfast scene with Take Five, which is really something special. It's a sorely overused classic, but it felt like the entirety of that scene was written to the piece. mirroring its rhythms and ebbs and flows in intensity. It's subtle, but I'd actually be surprised if it wasn't written this way. It's like a reversal of tired old John Williams style imitative/representative synchronism.

- All of episode 8. Such a bold choice to take such liberties with Penderecki's Threnody..., and I can't speak highly enough of that whole sequence audiovisually. They took what was already an almost overwhelmingly powerful and emotional piece of music and pumped it full of steroids. The role of sound in making the explosion scenes so physical and sublime has been roundly praised, but in my opinion, still hugely undervalued*. The Slow 30s room was just perfect. The slowed down Moonlight Sonata was also wonderfully creepy, and Ray's slowed down, muffled screams were really expressive. The use of 'My Prayer' was also a perfect Lynchian recontextualisation (those lyrics!) a-la 'In Dreams' in Blue Velvet.

* "By means of some mysterious perceptual alchemy, whatever virtues sound brings to the film are largely perceived and appreciated by the audience in visual terms- the better the sound, the better the image." - Michel Chion, Audio-Vision

- Sound design in Naido and American Girl's exit rooms; and Bobby's bad night with the gun-firing kid and horn-honking woman. The door-banging and horn-honking was so direct and relentless. I was going to say it reinforces the feeling of panic in these scenes, but I'd actually go as far as saying the sound generates it almost entirely here. Re: American Girl/Naido's exit rooms- I'm not saying that who/whatever was banging door won't be significant to the plot (it probably will, because of the repeated door shots and Augustine's line), but I also wouldn't be totally surprised if it doesn't figure at all. The door banging sound as an affective device is powerful enough to justify its inclusion, in the same way that there were strobe lights in the control room of the prison when the doppelgänger made his phonecall.

- The Sarah Palmer boxing match scene felt like a miniature self-contained sonic set piece. It's the second time we've checked in her at home and the black hole of her current existence, but this longer scene really allowed time to let the sound sink in, making us really feel the oppressiveness of the Palmer house...

- Harry Dean Stanton's song was a beautiful moment, sadly interrupted... It's a fuckin' nightmare.

- The processing on the Woodsman's voice. It's a fine line, getting the balance right on that one. Too natural and it doesn't work, but if we hear the technology any more, it also loses its otherworldliness

Finally... I'm still in utter disbelief at how few people there are receiving sound credits for such a mammoth project. These folks have been working seriously, seriously hard (and efficiently!).

very good post.. and for the record i didn't mean to short change the sound design at all, like you i find it to be extremely well put together and i like to view each episode once on my larger TV screen (where I can't use headphones) and once on my laptop with a good set of headphones to really explore that aspect of the show. there's plenty of instances where the sound work really brings out the visuals, like you mention episode 8 was exceptionally well crafted in regards to the audio/visual elements for example... the use of Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata and the mufled screams of Ray truly made that moment frightening. the sound design of the Lincoln smoker crushing the radio DJ's heads was really brought out by the sounds as well. etc.

check this that was just posted on WelcomeToTwinPeaks.com - apparantly Lynch has hidden clips from his song "Last Call" in the sounds of the documentary Sarah Palmer is watching in ep. 2. i bet there's a lot of these crazy type of easter eggs to be found for years to come.

[BlueLodge]

Regarding the banging on Naido's door, it's heavily implied to be the 'Mother' of BOB. As the Fireman states - "It is in our house now".

[alreadygoneplaces]

and for the record i didn't mean to short change the sound design at all, like you i find it to be extremely well put together and i like to view each episode once on my larger TV screen (where I can't use headphones) and once on my laptop with a good set of headphones to really explore that aspect of the show.

Sorry to seem like I was attacking on that. I was really railing against one of my bugbears- a general dismissive attitude towards non-musical sound, which you didn't display at all personally. That's why I apologised for pedantry, since my issues with the use of the word 'silence' are largely semantic here! This is especially since you spoke of the 'silences' in a positive light. What really bothers me (something different to what you were saying, but still a view that's popped up from time to time) is when the comparative lack of an overtly 'musical' soundtrack is criticised as 'just silence' or similar.

Regarding the banging on Naido's door, it's heavily implied to be the 'Mother' of BOB. As the Fireman states - "It is in our house now".

If I was forced to commit to one interpretation at this stage, I'd probably go with that too, but I'm not jumping to conclusions here and would rather stay mindful of how much we don't actually know. I think what you've said is a justifiable assumption, but I also disagree that it's heavily implied- it remains a collection of assumptions- i.e. it assumes that the 'it' is Experiment, it assumes that 'our house' is the Fireman's 'lodge', it assumes that the Naido/American Girl exit rooms are part of that lodge (this is particularly debatable), none of which are knowable. Lots of people are calling Experiment 'mother' not just because of being a mother of BOB, but because of American Girl's "my mother is coming" remark- though the idea that American Girl (Ronette?) could herself be an offspring of such a thing (literal of otherwise) seems unlikely to me, but if true would raise a whole new set of questions. Once theories gain enough momentum, they can affect how other forthcoming events are perceived in a way that might inhibit interpretation and enjoyment if that theory turns out to be off the mark, so I try to stay open. The more the show has gone on and continuously confounded expectations and layered mystery upon mystery, I've felt less inclined to make predictions and get too deep into theorising it all while its still running- at least, any further than considering ideas and possibilities.

[Mr. Jackpots]

I had to vote in the middle on this one.

Although the music when used is used fantastically. I just wished there was more music in general. We've all heard the complaints about the lack of the original themes. But I'm very cool hearing new material. The song that plays during the Dougie Mitchum Bros conga line and episode 8 stand out for me as great use of music.

I think FWWM had better use of "music".

All that said. The sound design in the Return is the best in television maybe ever. The Ambient noise and sound effects are really original and engaging.

[TheAlien]

I really love and admire that this season doesn't use music to fill in the blanks. The sound design is also used to great effect.

Music is not obligatory and often music gets in the way and/or use to compensate for bad acting or the build up in a scene. Using music as an obligation, is not a good learned habit that has sadly been passed down since the blockbuster.
When music IS used in this season, it is often either contrasting, overwhelming or simply perfectly suited.

I am more than happy with these decisions.

Badalamenti is a favorite of mine for many of his works (outside of TP too) but it wouldn't feel right just putting his music in to simply tell the audience how to feel to certain scenes. You feel me?