"I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

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nick1218
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"I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby nick1218 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 12:13 pm

In the orig when Mike says "They live above a convenience store, I mean it like it sounds, like it is", the inference, to me anyway, was something along the following: Cooper, people are seeing things, having weird dreams, you are suspecting strange even supernatural things may be afoot and I am not saying you are wrong but on this particular point when I say convenience store I mean it (like it sounds) I mean a 711 for goodness sake. We are renting a second story room above a 711 type store.

Then in FWWM the scene with the formica table supported that, for me. They seemed to be in our realm and were "having a meeting" and were amazed by colors and textures (this is a formica table, he says as he feels it, green is its color). Then we have the extras and the fornication between two worlds or whatever they said.

My point is everything suggests that this was real as things are real to you and me. Then in The Return we have episode 8 and we see the convenience store (no seeming second floor). I assumed that this was some abandoned store near the crash site in New Mexico OR a prop store as atomic test areas are known to have buildings set up to be destroyed.

Then later in the series it is shown to be in another realm. Coop goes there and then it vanishes into thin air. It isn't real after all. it isn't "like it sounds" it isn't "like it is" It's just another "red room" other-realm place like many others.

Seems like Lynch abandoned an idea he created. Any observations on this?
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Soolsma
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby Soolsma » Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:57 pm

Rule of thumb in Lynchology: two seemingly opposites don't necessarily exclude one or another. No matter how contrasting.

I'm also pretty sure Lynch had no idea were he was headed with that line from MIKE.
I believe all these phenomena that our putted-up egos and busy ant minds persist in trying to label, categorize, penetrate, and comphrehend, all spring from this same uncanny source. This is the mother of all "others".
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby Manwith » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:37 am

nick1218 wrote:In the orig when Mike says "They live above a convenience store, I mean it like it sounds, like it is", the inference, to me anyway, was something along the following: Cooper, people are seeing things, having weird dreams, you are suspecting strange even supernatural things may be afoot and I am not saying you are wrong but on this particular point when I say convenience store I mean it (like it sounds) I mean a 711 for goodness sake. We are renting a second story room above a 711 type store.

Then in FWWM the scene with the formica table supported that, for me. They seemed to be in our realm and were "having a meeting" and were amazed by colors and textures (this is a formica table, he says as he feels it, green is its color). Then we have the extras and the fornication between two worlds or whatever they said.

My point is everything suggests that this was real as things are real to you and me. Then in The Return we have episode 8 and we see the convenience store (no seeming second floor). I assumed that this was some abandoned store near the crash site in New Mexico OR a prop store as atomic test areas are known to have buildings set up to be destroyed.

Then later in the series it is shown to be in another realm. Coop goes there and then it vanishes into thin air. It isn't real after all. it isn't "like it sounds" it isn't "like it is" It's just another "red room" other-realm place like many others.

Seems like Lynch abandoned an idea he created. Any observations on this?


I agree. In the original show the spirits were just spirits and lack material form, so when they meet above a convenience store they mean spirits secretly meeting above a real convenience store. The writers sort of started moving away from this in the season 2 finale when Cooper's Doppleganger apparently has physical form. Up until that moment the spirits don't effect the real world or have physical form. The writing is inconsistent on that matter, but the writers were making the show up as they went along and started adding more supernatural elements besides spirits possessing people.
Cipher
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby Cipher » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:49 am

I mean, yeah. In the original run, it really does sound like Mike is talking about an ordinary room above a convenience store, and nothing in Fire Walk With Me contradicts this.

The presentation in season three may feel different from that implication, but it still involves an actual convenience store that normal people can see (it's not just another Red Room-type alternate reality, even if it shifts locations), so I'm going to cut it some slack. I think it's also a location the Lodge "picked up" after the atomic blast. It really doesn't matter in the grand scheme. Mike's words are vague enough to fit what we see.

Hey, remember when the Lodge entities used to travel as owls?*

*(I'm not bemoaning that element going away, as focusing on the electricity and fire connections make a lot more sense for the story. Point is the mythology was always pretty piecemeal stuff.)
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powerleftist
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby powerleftist » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:44 am

I'm amazed at people still trying to figure out these things. Lynch couldn't care less about these minor details.
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby BloodyHeartland » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:10 am

As far as the owls go, going off the dream motif, they are said to symbolize coming to self awareness, to realize secrets hidden away. Forests, being the unconscious, it makes sense for the owls to roam and find unfortunate truths. Thus their association with Bob, the suppressed feelings within everyone.

As for the convenience store, I don't have much of an idea...I don't think it's necessarily quite as symbolic. I like it to be a real place, and that it might have got caught up in some temporal existential crisis of its own and used as a meeting ground for said spirits.
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nick1218
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby nick1218 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:56 am

powerleftist wrote:I'm amazed at people still trying to figure out these things. Lynch couldn't care less about these minor details.

For what it is worth I am not trying to figure it out, I realize what he did. He wrote scenes for his new project using elements of old parts of the original without caring much about it's continuity. I know he doesnt care, thats my beef.
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Mr. Strawberry
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby Mr. Strawberry » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:42 am

The idea of BOB and MIKE living in a small, crappy apartment above some run down convenience store was very creepy and unsettling -- much scarier than the wandering, supernatural place that was revealed in season 3. Sometimes plain and simple is where it's at.

Just to elaborate a bit, I liked the convenience store that we saw in season 3, but would have preferred if that place had actually been "Judy's" or something, while the actual convenience store remained a real place.

The visuals that came when MIKE spoke about the room above the convenience store were strong, and his delivery really helped paint a picture. A bleak little studio apartment with blinds drawn, but they weren't blackout curtains, and you could tell that it was an overcast, rainy day outside. With all the lights off, the only thing illuminating the dismal space was the dim grey creeping in. Empty cabinets, empty fridge. Dead silence in a cluttered, messy room. Having nothing to do, BOB and MIKE were bored and arguing over something trivial. Drops of blood on a tattered, sagging couch and a smear on the wall hinted at something dreadful having taken place in there.
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Jasper
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby Jasper » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:51 am

I must say that never in a million years did I consider the above-the-convenience-store scene in FWWM to be taking place in our earthly realm. In fact, I'd assumed that the unearthly, non-literal reading was the standard interpretation among fans, based largely upon our discussions here on the forum.
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Nikki Grace
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby Nikki Grace » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:24 pm

Jasper wrote:I must say that never in a million years did I consider the above-the-convenience-store scene in FWWM to be taking place in our earthly realm. In fact, I'd assumed that the unearthly, non-literal reading was the standard interpretation among fans, based largely upon our discussions here on the forum.


Me too, 100% non literal.
Thpthpthpthpthp
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Re: "I mean it like it sounds, like it is."

Postby Thpthpthpthpthp » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:25 pm

nick1218 wrote:Seems like Lynch abandoned an idea he created. Any observations on this?

That's how I read it. The Lodge spirits "descended" to the room, a process Mike describes as "intercourse between two worlds." They are not in their native habitat--the place from which they descended--and since there are only two worlds in view, they must be in ours. Their fascination with formica, colors, and animal life also suggests they are experiencing our world for the first time. I guess one could argue the room(s) above the convenience store is still part of our world, just a little disconnected, but I don't think that was originally the case.

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