What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Moderators: Annie, BookhouseBoyBob, Ross, Jerry Horne, Brad D

User avatar
NormoftheAndes
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 4:00 am

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby NormoftheAndes » Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:20 am

TwistedFate_L4 wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:
TwistedFate_L4 wrote:Outside of critics and the Twin Peaks/Lynch fandom, Twin Peaks The Return really didn't make a huge impact so I'm not surprised not many big named actors or directors have yet to chime in because they probably haven't even seen it. I would love to know what Tarantino thought of it as well as what he thinks of Lynch in general- but he definitely doesn't seem like much of a TV person.



I imagine a lot of people in the industry watched it and just haven’t had occasion to publicly talk about it (or maybe they hated it and are too tactful to speak out). It’s hard to imagine people working in the film, and particularly television, industries not wanting to be able to converse about a work that, love it or hate it, is being pretty universally called “unique.”


Perhaps they have conversed amongst themselves but I don't think the reason why many have yet to talk publicly has anything to do with anyone being too tactful or not finding the right time to talk about it- many are on social media and converse about what they just had for snack. I think it all boils down to my original point which was outside of the Twin Peaks/Lynch fandom and critics- The new season was nothing but a blip on the radar to every one else. So I think most people in the industry just haven't felt a "need" or urge to publicize their feelings if they had indeed seen it because it wasn't a bona fide sensation that has swept the nation as some of us like to believe. The ratings were dismal despite the adoration it received from critics.


This isn't a knock at Twin Peaks- I'm just stating to many, even those in the industry, The Return came and went and that was that. It didn't ignite a spark outside of the fandom enough for public declaration from industry elites.


Did you read up on the ratings? In total there were 2 million watching it streaming weekly on Showtime, which is pretty decent considering the nature of season 3 in my view. CBS/ Showtime had record profits due to people signing up for Twin Peaks. Outside of the US, I am sure that the viewers were there for it. As a 'brand' in itself Twin Peaks would have generated interest internationally and on a far wider scale than most tv shows. Then there's the fact that Lynch directed it.
User avatar
NormoftheAndes
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 4:00 am

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby NormoftheAndes » Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:29 am

Gabriel wrote:
N. Needleman wrote:Those dudes whined a lot and I got a couple of my friends mad at me for saying I didn't care what they thought. #dontcare

My response to people using critics as their basis of an argument in favour or against something is to quote: ‘Howard Roark laughed.’ One has to make one’s own opinion based on objective reality. I consider TPTR a complete dead-loss and can (and frequently have) argue(d) its uselessness, based on value judgements, as a piece of cinematic ‘literature’ until the cows come home, but I accept the critical consensus is against me. I don’t care; I still loathe it.

Such is life.


Wow Gabriel, I've seen you on this forum for a long time now. So you liked the original Twin Peaks and FWWM? Did you like INLAND EMPIRE? Why did you 'loathe' season 3 then?

The way I view this season is it featured elements which were moderately entertaining but felt like Lynch in B-movie, straight-to-video mode - but then I felt like Lost Highway and Mulholland Dr. had quite a bit of that in them! I definitely feel like season 3 needed way more editing, but then it was set as 18 episodes. This meant we got the Mitchum brothers, we had Hutch and Chantel - yet why couldn't that time have been used to flesh out Shelly and Red or show more Steven and Becky in Twin Peaks? Steven was an idiotic character but very entertaining because Landry Jones is such a great actor.

Does it come down to Showtime wanting a few name actors? So we get Belushi, Knepper and Leigh in non-essential roles? That's a major complaint from me anyway.

In terms of industry types and directors giving their reaction to season 3, I think if the whole show had been tighter, more efficient and less bloated then we would have heard Scorcese giving plaudits!

Another facet of the whole thing was that Lynch had not directed for a good while, so I think it was like he ran through the whole gamut, the A to Z of genre film-making in The Return, perhaps over-compensating?
User avatar
Gabriel
Posts: 786
Joined: Thu May 03, 2007 12:53 pm

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby Gabriel » Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:24 pm

NormoftheAndes wrote:
Gabriel wrote:
N. Needleman wrote:Those dudes whined a lot and I got a couple of my friends mad at me for saying I didn't care what they thought. #dontcare

My response to people using critics as their basis of an argument in favour or against something is to quote: ‘Howard Roark laughed.’ One has to make one’s own opinion based on objective reality. I consider TPTR a complete dead-loss and can (and frequently have) argue(d) its uselessness, based on value judgements, as a piece of cinematic ‘literature’ until the cows come home, but I accept the critical consensus is against me. I don’t care; I still loathe it.

Such is life.


Wow Gabriel, I've seen you on this forum for a long time now. So you liked the original Twin Peaks and FWWM? Did you like INLAND EMPIRE? Why did you 'loathe' season 3 then?

The way I view this season is it featured elements which were moderately entertaining but felt like Lynch in B-movie, straight-to-video mode - but then I felt like Lost Highway and Mulholland Dr. had quite a bit of that in them! I definitely feel like season 3 needed way more editing, but then it was set as 18 episodes. This meant we got the Mitchum brothers, we had Hutch and Chantel - yet why couldn't that time have been used to flesh out Shelly and Red or show more Steven and Becky in Twin Peaks? Steven was an idiotic character but very entertaining because Landry Jones is such a great actor.

Does it come down to Showtime wanting a few name actors? So we get Belushi, Knepper and Leigh in non-essential roles? That's a major complaint from me anyway.

In terms of industry types and directors giving their reaction to season 3, I think if the whole show had been tighter, more efficient and less bloated then we would have heard Scorcese giving plaudits!

Another facet of the whole thing was that Lynch had not directed for a good while, so I think it was like he ran through the whole gamut, the A to Z of genre film-making in The Return, perhaps over-compensating?


Thing is, I’ve read lots of comments saying ‘I liked bits of it.’ But how many bits? So a couple of good bits justify 90 percent that a person finds horrible? If it’s not good, it’s not good, even if there are one or two decent moments. It’s like saying a golfer is a good golfer because he gets a birdie on one hole, even though he takes 97 shots on each of the other 17 holes!
LateReg
Posts: 646
Joined: Sun May 10, 2015 5:19 pm

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby LateReg » Thu Dec 14, 2017 1:28 pm

I can't believe we are still talking about what might have gone wrong re: the 18 hours and why there's not more time spent on the original characters and in Twin Peaks. Unless I missed something at some point, I believe all evidence points to Lynch wanting 18 hours to tell this exact story, and having other interests than delving into the old characters we already love. Maybe it was a mistake, but I hardly think it was the result of Showtime wanting big names or a result of needing to pad the story to fit 18 hours. It's just the story Lynch and Frost wanted to tell. And if the show were tighter it very well may have been better, or perhaps (more likely) less impactful as it relates to the passage of time and the wanting of a return, but one of the things that industry folk have commented on is how it feels like nothing else, which is in huge part due to the editing and pacing and the resultant diversions, and not just the obvious highlights. So that's a two way street. And for what it's worth, I think Lynch is in complete command and shows no signs of time spent away from filmmaking.
User avatar
laughingpinecone
Posts: 725
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2016 6:45 am
Location: D'ni
Contact:

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby laughingpinecone » Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:56 pm

Wasn't there one authoritative-but-not-L/F source that said that the original script they submitted had considerably less time dedicated to the townsfolk? Could be Sutherland, could be Dunham, I know I read it but I'm afraid I can't provide a source.
If someone else remembers it, it would be further proof that the out-of-town plots weren't padding, let alone executive meddling.

Also about padding: Showtime didn't order 18 hours. People who've hung around since early 2016 must remember all the educated guesses and the eventual announcement. So while the occasional weaker scene or two may have been included to pad out a single part, they could've stopped at 17 instead. There is no substantial amount of screentime added for contractual reasons. (At most, one might suspect DKL really wanted the number to add up to 9)

Of course we're all free to like or dislike these choices, but that's all they are, artistic choices.
] The gathered are known by their faces of stone.
User avatar
TwistedFate_L4
Posts: 39
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:36 pm

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby TwistedFate_L4 » Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:07 pm

LateReg wrote:I can't believe we are still talking about what might have gone wrong re: the 18 hours and why there's not more time spent on the original characters and in Twin Peaks. Unless I missed something at some point, I believe all evidence points to Lynch wanting 18 hours to tell this exact story, and having other interests than delving into the old characters we already love. Maybe it was a mistake, but I hardly think it was the result of Showtime wanting big names or a result of needing to pad the story to fit 18 hours. It's just the story Lynch and Frost wanted to tell.


Exactly. This is simply the story they wanted to tell but it's simply not the one every one wanted to hear- But that's life. This is where they wanted to go and what they wanted to do and finger pointing won't change that.

I always saw it as Lynch simply wanting to take this chance to not only bring Twin Peaks back but to also explore other ideas that he may wouldn't get a chance at doing and thus the show expanded into something beyond Cherry Pie and quirky residents. But it all goes back to what you said, this is the story they wanted to tell.
User avatar
N. Needleman
Posts: 1786
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:39 pm

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby N. Needleman » Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:32 am

TwistedFate_L4 wrote:A bit redundant pointing out what's already been noted, is it not? Yes, a few people have indeed commented as named earlier in the thread- I didn't think I needed to establish that. My point was highlighting why the OP most likely haven't been seeing a "huge number" of industry people coming out and talking about it left and right. Yes, some have, but The Return is hardly a hot topic that everyone is literally dying to chime in on.

Let's keep things in context.


AFAIC I am doing that. We have a decidedly different interpretation of how the industry has responded to Season 3. I've seen more than a few responses, both in press and on social media. You think if it isn't a mass influx where you yourself saw it then it "came and went". I think the year-end response tells a different story.
AnotherBlueRoseCase wrote:The Return is clearly guaranteed a future audience among stoners and other drug users.
User avatar
N. Needleman
Posts: 1786
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:39 pm

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby N. Needleman » Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:33 am

NormoftheAndes wrote:Does it come down to Showtime wanting a few name actors? So we get Belushi, Knepper and Leigh in non-essential roles? That's a major complaint from me anyway.


This is, of course, utterly false.
AnotherBlueRoseCase wrote:The Return is clearly guaranteed a future audience among stoners and other drug users.
User avatar
NormoftheAndes
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 4:00 am

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby NormoftheAndes » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:46 am

N. Needleman wrote:
NormoftheAndes wrote:Does it come down to Showtime wanting a few name actors? So we get Belushi, Knepper and Leigh in non-essential roles? That's a major complaint from me anyway.


This is, of course, utterly false.


Sorry I worded that badly. I meant to say that I would have preferred if those roles had gone to relative unknowns, that's all.

The script for the first two parts originally had barely any Twin Peaks in it. Twin Peaks was not all quirkiness and cherry pie. The Buckhorn and Las Vegas scenes in this were plenty quirky.

Some people think that Lynch was inspired by the director Neil Breen in terms of season 3 to a big extent. Check it out!
Poiuyt
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2017 3:26 am

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby Poiuyt » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:51 am

Some people think that Lynch was inspired by the director Neil Breen in terms of season 3 to a big extent. Check it out!

Lol, I highly doubt that, unless Lynch specifically said as much.
Are you upset with me, Diane?
BGate
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2017 11:15 am

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby BGate » Sat Dec 16, 2017 11:47 am

wonderful French director Bertrand Bonello is a big Lynch fan and has been a big Return advocate. This is in French but I'll link anyway: http://next.liberation.fr/images/2017/0 ... ch_1595046

a couple of translated excerpts:

Image

Image


love this thread idea btw.
LateReg
Posts: 646
Joined: Sun May 10, 2015 5:19 pm

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby LateReg » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:33 pm

BGate wrote:wonderful French director Bertrand Bonello is a big Lynch fan and has been a big Return advocate. This is in French but I'll link anyway: http://next.liberation.fr/images/2017/0 ... ch_1595046

a couple of translated excerpts:

Image

Image


love this thread idea btw.


Yes, thanks for those. Bonello is great (Nocturama is one of my films of the year, and I love his past work: On War, House of Pleasures, Saint Laurent), and he actually put out a list of the 10 best films of the past 10 years. He scratched off one of his choices to make room for The Return after it concluded.
User avatar
bowisneski
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2016 11:51 am

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby bowisneski » Tue Dec 19, 2017 3:17 pm

NormoftheAndes wrote:Some people think that Lynch was inspired by the director Neil Breen in terms of season 3 to a big extent. Check it out!

Apologies for taking the thread OT with this response, but I was discussing the relation of Breen and Lynch with a friend the other day.

I think people like Breen, Tommy Wiseau, and other egotistical bad movie directors are greatly inspired by Lynch. They have this idea that they feel the need to get across and is just stuck in their craw, so they keep on trying. It's why all of Breen's films are essentially the same, and you could make the argument that Lynch films all have that same sort of thing where he obviously has an idea that he wants to explore and he keeps on doing it. The problem you run in to is they don't have the talent or vision of Lynch, they just have the passion. I think that if Breen or Wiseau had the talent as filmmakers to get their ideas across, they could rival Lynch. Lynch reminds me of them, except he was a fine artist first and knows how to create mood, tone, and visuals.

I sometimes wonder if an alternate reality version of Lynch exists who has no artistic talent and is one of the celebrated "so bad it's good" movie directors.
pinballmars
Posts: 57
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:08 am

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby pinballmars » Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:09 pm

Panapaok wrote:Rian Johnson


Yes. He just retweeted something Season 3-related last week

Also, he dressed as Dougie for Halloween:
https://twitter.com/rianjohnson/status/ ... 9217643521
User avatar
Mr. Reindeer
Posts: 1939
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:09 pm

Re: What Other Directors/Actors Think of Season 3

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:40 pm

pinballmars wrote:
Panapaok wrote:Rian Johnson


Yes. He just retweeted something Season 3-related last week

Also, he dressed as Dougie for Halloween:
https://twitter.com/rianjohnson/status/ ... 9217643521


So his casting of Laura Dern in a brightly colored wig in the new Star Wars WAS a TP tribute. Knew it. ;)

(Kidding, I’m sure it was a coincidence. But it’s fun to contemplate the parallels between the TP and SW sequels. The Richard Horne/Kylo Renn similarity is especially eerie.)

Return to “Season 3 (2017) The Return (Spoilers)”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], LateReg and 11 guests