No Ray Wise?

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Soolsma
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Soolsma » Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:55 pm

This article about the absence of Chen and Laurie states:

Though Chen’s character died near the end of the series’ second season, a source close to the actress tells EW Lynch and co-creator Mark Frost tried to find a way to bring the 55-year-old back for the 2017 limited series. “She was not asked to return. Lynch couldn’t find something for her or Piper Laurie that would make sense,” the source says. “They had conversations, but couldn’t find a way for her to return… She’s not upset about it. If she was involved, she would comment on it.”
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Mordeen » Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:03 pm

bosguy1981 wrote:
Mordeen wrote:“I made it very clear to David and the team that I would be delighted to come back. I had a fantastic time on the original and won lots of awards. I’m surprised and I have no idea why I haven’t been called back."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/ew.com/article/2016/05/03/piper-laurie-joan-chen-twin-peaks-revival/amp/

Bear in mind, The Return wasn't really about Twin Peaks. It's was about Dale Cooper, and of course, Laura's role in his fate. Peripheral characters had to be considered and many were ultimately discarded during the script writing process.

I feel the most notable absence was Annie, and her intentional omission screams of what Lynch/Frost were portraying to us.

- Mordeen


Gotcha! For some reason, I thought people alluded to a more elaborate behind-the-scenes situation as to why Piper wasn't onscreen that differed from her public comments about it. But if so, like so many things about this production, might be a story that stays secret forever!


I think the most glaring behind-the-scenes situation involved a certain actress that portrayed Audrey Horne. The truth of that scenario will likely never see the light of day, out of professional courtesy and Hollywood's obsession with keeping that kind of drama secret.

I'm still digging to find out what went down with Chris Isaak. That's a tough nut to crack.

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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Mordeen » Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:12 pm

Soolsma wrote:This article about the absence of Chen and Laurie states:

Though Chen’s character died near the end of the series’ second season, a source close to the actress tells EW Lynch and co-creator Mark Frost tried to find a way to bring the 55-year-old back for the 2017 limited series. “She was not asked to return. Lynch couldn’t find something for her or Piper Laurie that would make sense,” the source says. “They had conversations, but couldn’t find a way for her to return… She’s not upset about it. If she was involved, she would comment on it.”


Plenty of people who didn't appear in the show were contacted. The most educated guess is that the story developed and had some twist and turns during that process as a result of who was or wasn't available. The script would have been very different if Ontkean was available, for example.

- Mordeen
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby bosguy1981 » Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:22 pm

Mordeen wrote:Plenty of people who didn't appear in the show were contacted. The most educated guess is that the story developed and had some twist and turns during that process as a result of who was or wasn't available. The script would have been very different if Ontkean was available, for example.

- Mordeen


I'm pretty sure Ian Buchanan (Dick) confirmed that Sabrina Sutherland reached out to him about his availability early in the process, but unfortunately he never heard from her again. I think this was when he talked to a TP podcaster but I can't remember exactly who or when now.
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby eyeboogers » Mon Feb 04, 2019 1:51 pm

bosguy1981 wrote:
I'm pretty sure Ian Buchanan (Dick) confirmed that Sabrina Sutherland reached out to him about his availability early in the process, but unfortunately he never heard from her again. I think this was when he talked to a TP podcaster but I can't remember exactly who or when now.


Buchanan said this to 25YL "I was gone while they were shooting it and I kind of was part of the conversation and it would have been very nice to do. I had talked to Joanna about it and I believe at one point it was under serious discussion. Then things changed at some point. If there’s more I would love to do it."

https://25yearslatersite.com/2017/08/14/my-interview-with-ian-buchanan/
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Mr. Strawberry » Mon Feb 04, 2019 2:03 pm

I don't care if there's no story for Dick Tremayne, I don't even care if he actively gets in the way of the main storyline, bring him back god damnit.
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Cappy » Mon Feb 04, 2019 2:49 pm

Re: Piper Laurie in Season 3

I really can't imagine where Lynch/Frost would've slotted Piper Laurie into S3, even if they really wanted to. Frost's mention of Catherine Martell in Secret History leaves her shrouded behind a bit of a question mark.

I don't know, maybe Piper Laurie could've played the "Mr. Jackpots" woman from the casino. The frazzled, down-on-her-luck and likely homeless character sort of lines up with Secret History's suggestion that Catherine fell into a deep depression after losing Pete/Andrew/Ghostwood/The Mill/everything. Perhaps it would have be a waste of Laurie's talents to cast her in such a small part, but at the same time she might have elevated it into something more.

But also at the same time, having Cooper confronted with a sort of familiar face right after arriving in Las Vegas might have been weird. Like, the show would've have had to have Cooper making some sort of passing acknowledgement of her, much like he responds positively to coffee and pie. And he almost never interacted with Catherine, so it would've been odd for her to have any sort of significance in his stunted Dougie state.

Still, it would've been neat to see Catherine Martell even in that capacity -- Her story sort of fell apart in S2, but she was a boss in S1. The role reversal of her turning into a haggard soul being kept alive solely for a slot machine fantasy would be a form a of narrative comeuppance for her greed and evil deeds, and the fortune and subsequent new life that Dougie gives her could be her salvation/second chance.
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Cappy » Mon Feb 04, 2019 2:54 pm

Mr. Strawberry wrote:I don't care if there's no story for Dick Tremayne, I don't even care if he actively gets in the way of the main storyline, bring him back god damnit.


Yeah I don't think there was much story for Dick in S3, but at the very least they could've put his grinning face on some real estate yard signs in that abandoned neighborhood DougieCoop first appears in.
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby mtwentz » Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:14 pm

Cappy wrote:Re: Piper Laurie in Season 3

I really can't imagine where Lynch/Frost would've slotted Piper Laurie into S3, even if they really wanted to. Frost's mention of Catherine Martell in Secret History leaves her shrouded behind a bit of a question mark.

I don't know, maybe Piper Laurie could've played the "Mr. Jackpots" woman from the casino. The frazzled, down-on-her-luck and likely homeless character sort of lines up with Secret History's suggestion that Catherine fell into a deep depression after losing Pete/Andrew/Ghostwood/The Mill/everything. Perhaps it would have be a waste of Laurie's talents to cast her in such a small part, but at the same time she might have elevated it into something more.

But also at the same time, having Cooper confronted with a sort of familiar face right after arriving in Las Vegas might have been weird. Like, the show would've have had to have Cooper making some sort of passing acknowledgement of her, much like he responds positively to coffee and pie. And he almost never interacted with Catherine, so it would've been odd for her to have any sort of significance in his stunted Dougie state.

Still, it would've been neat to see Catherine Martell even in that capacity -- Her story sort of fell apart in S2, but she was a boss in S1. The role reversal of her turning into a haggard soul being kept alive solely for a slot machine fantasy would be a form a of narrative comeuppance for her greed and evil deeds, and the fortune and subsequent new life that Dougie gives her could be her salvation/second chance.


I don't think Frost/Lynch wanted to mix the Vegas world with the Twin Peaks world, so her character could have shown up briefly in Twin Peaks. The easiest way I can think of is having her show up at the RR Diner (even though she was never at the diner in the original series) during one of the scenes with Shelly or Norma.

But that would be a cameo for cameo's sake, pretty much what Mike Nelson got (though his scene did establish Steven's character, or lack thereof). Having a useless cameo would have provided little satisfaction to the fans.
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Mon Feb 04, 2019 7:29 pm

The idea of a privatized prison taking over from the Mill as the town’s major economic driver is obviously an idea that has interested Mark since at least the Access Guide in 1991. If it had made the show, it could have been fun to see Catherine as the warden.
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby naked bat » Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:03 am

Mordeen wrote:
bosguy1981 wrote:
Mordeen wrote:“I made it very clear to David and the team that I would be delighted to come back. I had a fantastic time on the original and won lots of awards. I’m surprised and I have no idea why I haven’t been called back."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/ew.com/article/2016/05/03/piper-laurie-joan-chen-twin-peaks-revival/amp/

Bear in mind, The Return wasn't really about Twin Peaks. It's was about Dale Cooper, and of course, Laura's role in his fate. Peripheral characters had to be considered and many were ultimately discarded during the script writing process.

I feel the most notable absence was Annie, and her intentional omission screams of what Lynch/Frost were portraying to us.

- Mordeen


Gotcha! For some reason, I thought people alluded to a more elaborate behind-the-scenes situation as to why Piper wasn't onscreen that differed from her public comments about it. But if so, like so many things about this production, might be a story that stays secret forever!


I think the most glaring behind-the-scenes situation involved a certain actress that portrayed Audrey Horne. The truth of that scenario will likely never see the light of day, out of professional courtesy and Hollywood's obsession with keeping that kind of drama secret.

I'm still digging to find out what went down with Chris Isaak. That's a tough nut to crack.

- Mordeen


Hi!

Frost said in his Reddit Ama that it would have been hard to bring back Desmond, if I remember correctly. But you seem to imply there was some BTS drama as well?

Damn, I would have been thrilled to get some more Desmond in this universe!

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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Mordeen » Tue Feb 05, 2019 7:04 am

Not drama. I just have info from someone very reliable that Chet was on the table and something stopped it from happening. I just want to know what happened.

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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Cappy » Tue Feb 05, 2019 7:04 am

Mr. Reindeer wrote:The idea of a privatized prison taking over from the Mill as the town’s major economic driver is obviously an idea that has interested Mark since at least the Access Guide in 1991. If it had made the show, it could have been fun to see Catherine as the warden.


I remember that from the Access Guide too. It's fascinating how Frost (I assume it was Frost) has clung to the notion of incorporating a prison into TP ever since then, as it becomes a big part of the town in Final Dossier.

I suspect that all of the stuff in S3 with Mr. C in prison in South Dakota might have originally been set at the Twin Peaks privatized prison in an early draft. Final Dossier even establishes that the South Dakota warden had previously wardened at the TP prison, so maybe that's a nod to an earlier idea.
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Cappy » Tue Feb 05, 2019 7:55 am

Mr. Strawberry wrote:
Mordeen wrote:He had retired to Hawaii for health-related issues which prevented him from safely travelling to Washington. IIRC correctly this was uncovered very early on in production, but I may be mis-remembering and would be happy to be corrected.

-Mordeen

Would those factors have made his inclusion impossible though? For example, an ailing Harry's tenuous connection to the world might have resulted in visions or even his own trips into the Lodge. He could have helped Cooper any number of ways. A decent number of actors chose to participate in the face of very ill health, and measures were taken to make their appearances possible and plausible, which only serves to make his absence all the more mysterious.


Part of me would've loved for them to have gotten a crew down to Hawaii to film a few small scenes of Michael as former Sheriff Harry S. Truman. Even if it was just shots of him talking to Hawk or Lucy on the phone, a la The Log Lady's scenes. I don't know the specifics of Ontkean's health, but it seems like Lynch was able to film Catherine Coulson's scenes under far more dire circumstances. I wish they could've found a way to get Michael in S3, but considering how much of the original cast we did get to return, I am happy with what we got.

That being said... as much as I would've loved to see two or three small scenes of Harry milling around in Hawaii, it might have made the character look like some new version of old school Dr. Jacoby. But maybe it could've worked; Elvis Presley's "Blue Hawaii" plays in the background, with Hawaiian shirt clad Harry casually cracking open coconuts with the butt of his pistol while listening to Hawk read Annie's message to Laura, with Harry mishearing it as "The good Dale is still in the luau." He fiddles with the pink umbrella in his hollowed out pineapple cocktail, unable to get it to open up, eventually throwing the whole drink at the wall before discharging his pistol into it. Later at night he can wander out to a luau, maybe watch a 7 foot tall man win a limbo competition against a person under 4 feet, and stare into a fire and have a vision of, I don't know, The Experiment or the atomic bomb test.

It's hard to imagine Harry not rushing back to TP to help save the day, but still, it would've been cool to see him again.
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Soolsma
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Re: No Ray Wise?

Postby Soolsma » Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:20 am

I like to believe Chet was left out because the story didn't allow for another mystery agent gone lodgin'. Jeffries has that place. Frost indeed confirmed Chet was discussed.

I seem to vaguely remember something about Isaak expressing interest in returning and even reaching out to Lynch. Can't seem to find a source.
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