Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

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vicksvapor77
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby vicksvapor77 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:07 am

Mr. Reindeer wrote:None of us knows for sure, but I could certainly envision Donna/LFB in the “rhinocerus/turquoise” scene with Steven. I wouldn’t put it past L/F to conceive that scene as a loving tour de force comeback for LFB, if she felt she was up to it. Again, I’ll note that DKL is no stranger to redeeming pariah/washed-up actors (Dennis Hopper), and also frequently seems to rejoice in getting incredible performances from actors (and musicians) widely viewed as incapable of delivering “serious” acting. Ultimately, I’m glad Alicia Witt got to do it—I’ve been a little bit in love with her since seeing the “Blackout” episode of Hotel Room, and she completely kills it on TP:TR. But I think in terms of obvious character progression and narrative/thematic significance, the damaged and Laura-obsessed Donna probably would have slotted into that role in a more meaningful fashion than Gersten. I don’t have any idea if the role was actually written for LFB, but I can envision her doing it, and the thought of her popping up unexpectedly and actually pulling it off gives me chills.


This is all very well said! Thank you for the post. :) You're making me want to see Donna do the scene now, damn you! Those good old Twin Peaks regrets.

I forgot about David Lynch's comments on Lara Flynn Boyle's absence. The way he answers it, particularly "you can go talk to [her]," indicates to me Sabrina was telling the truth and that Lara was approached (not that Sabrina would have any reason to lie or ever given the impression that she is someone who lies regularly):
https://tvline.com/2017/05/19/twin-peaks-revival-lara-flynn-boyle-donna-showtime-david-lynch/
TVLINE | One thing you did release ahead of time was a very lengthy list of all the cast members participating in the revival. Of course, my eyes immediately focused on the names that were missing, like Lara Flynn Boyle. I was a big fan of the Donna character and was disappointed to see that she wouldn’t be in it. Why isn’t she in it?
These days people love strange Hollywood side stories that have nothing to do with the film. You can go talk to Lara Flynn Boyle. This is a story that takes place without her.
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N. Needleman
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby N. Needleman » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:45 am

I didn't take that response that way - I think it can be read many ways - but YMMV.
AnotherBlueRoseCase wrote:The Return is clearly guaranteed a future audience among stoners and other drug users.
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Jonah
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Jonah » Thu Oct 03, 2019 2:29 pm

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
N. Needleman wrote:


Been reading through this thread.

Why do you think Heather Graham didn't get at least one scene/cameo as Annie?

And why wasn't Joan Chen as Josie in the Red Room?
Last edited by Jonah on Thu Oct 03, 2019 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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N. Needleman
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby N. Needleman » Thu Oct 03, 2019 2:40 pm

Jonah wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:Also, why do you think Heather Graham didn't get at least one scene/cameo as Annie?

And why wasn't Joan Chen as Josie in the Red Room?


Just what L/F said when asked about them in 2017 - they couldn't find anything they wanted to do with them at that time. I hope this changes for Josie in future, but I also always took the ringing noise in the Great Northern to be linked to Josie's presence in the walls as well as the Lodge.
AnotherBlueRoseCase wrote:The Return is clearly guaranteed a future audience among stoners and other drug users.
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Jonah
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Jonah » Thu Oct 03, 2019 2:55 pm

N. Needleman wrote:I hope this changes for Josie in future, but I also always took the ringing noise in the Great Northern to be linked to Josie's presence in the walls as well as the Lodge.


Oooohhhh, yes. I loved that part. Had almost forgotten it.

I also loved those Richard Beymer photos from Episode 29 that indicate she was supposed to be shown partially in the Red Room, her head sticking out through the curtains. Everything about Josie's fate intrigues me. Trapped in wood. All of it. Love it.
vicksvapor77
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby vicksvapor77 » Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:38 am

An incredibly fascinating tidbit from the newly published Twin Peaks Unwrapped book. Please go buy this book! The authors are such good guys and it's very thoughtfully put together. Link to purchase: https://www.bluerosemag.com/?product=tw ... apped-book

This seems to be an inquiry about Kyle's original comments referenced here:
https://welcometotwinpeaks.com/actors/k ... er-script/

Kyle MacLachlan on Cooper being a little more present in the script: During the filming, there were moments where [Cooper] had some lucidity, primarily when he was communicating with the one-armed man when he had connected to that world. We shot those and ultimately, I think, David decided that wasn't part of the story that he wanted to expose. It just didn't make it into the series. But there were moments. There weren't a lot, but there were a couple where you did get a taste of that. For whatever his reasons, I think the despair that people felt and it grew over time, that Cooper might not actually ever return was much more powerful. And to be honest, the reveal at the end when he does finally wake up was a moment that people really responded to.

I am so curious to see these scenes, although I think the film was probably better served without these interludes of lucidity. I am having a hard time picturing Dougie having interjecting moments of Cooper lucidity when talking to Gerard but then slipping back into Dougie mode with Janey-E and Sonny Jim.
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bowisneski
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby bowisneski » Tue Mar 10, 2020 1:17 pm

There is just so much in Conversations with Mark Frost,available now, worth discussing but this stood out to me. David Bushman asks about Carrie and Richard, and Linda and Frost's response surprised me
I'd seen the pages they were mentioned in, and we had talked about Carrie-that part we'd mapped out-but he added the Richard and Linda references later and never explained his reasoning to me

There's so much more in there, but I don't want to post a whole lot before people have a chance to buy and read it.
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bowisneski
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby bowisneski » Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:07 pm

LateReg wrote:Interesting about Carrie being scripted all along but not Richard and Linda, and that Frost may not actually know what Richard and Linda mean. Cooper must have been written either as Cooper, or a slippery, edgier, fully integrated version of Cooper still known only as Cooper.

I thought the same thing, but I'm glad it was presented in the way it was because it connected me more viscerally to Cooper's feelings of confusion because it's how I felt. Genre fans basically know how time travel shenanigans can work, so a letter saying essentially "I'm leaving you Cooper - Diane" would've made what was going on feel more concrete, at least to me because time travel you undertake after you're born shouldn't create a ripple effect that changes your name. Reading it in the way it was apparently scripted makes everything much simpler and more straightforward.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby LateReg » Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:17 pm

bowisneski wrote:
LateReg wrote:Interesting about Carrie being scripted all along but not Richard and Linda, and that Frost may not actually know what Richard and Linda mean. Cooper must have been written either as Cooper, or a slippery, edgier, fully integrated version of Cooper still known only as Cooper.

I thought the same thing, but I'm glad it was presented in the way it was because it connected me more viscerally to Cooper's feelings of confusion because it's how I felt. Genre fans basically know how time travel shenanigans can work, so a letter saying essentially "I'm leaving you Cooper - Diane" would've made what was going on feel more concrete, at least to me because time travel you undertake after you're born shouldn't create a ripple effect that changes your name. Reading it in the way it was apparently scripted makes everything much simpler and more straightforward.


Yeah, I totally agree. It's hard to imagine the letter reading that way and holding nearly as much...everything.
enumbs
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby enumbs » Sat Mar 14, 2020 4:35 am

I just finished reading David Bushman’s book. Amongst all kinds of interesting material (including the aforementioned Richard and Linda info), I was particularly struck by these tidbits regarding season 3:

    Lynch didn’t pursue Chester Desmond’s return despite Frost mentioning the idea in the writing process. I think this contradicts some of the rumours on this forum but there you go.

    Lynch didn’t know who Judy was when Frost asked. The idea of bringing in Sumerian mythology and “Joudy” came after an inter-dimensional demon in box was already in play.

    On a similar note, Frost states that the caller pretending to be Jeffries was trying to access information about someone else’s location. Presumably this is Sarah/Judy playing a part in the plan to suck Mr C back into the Lodge?

    The possibility of Sarah being inhabited by a spirit was apparently something to do with the fact Lynch couldn’t let go off Laura as a character - this had become more his obsession than Frost’s. No surprise to hear Lynch wanted to bring Twin Peaks back to Laura, but does this mean it was also his insistence to make Sarah a vessel for Judy? This could be his way of tying Frost’s supernatural ideas into the trauma at the heart of the series.

    Bushman asks if Lynch and Frost were on the same page. Frost replies “there were times I began to wonder about that”. Ha!

    Frost responds to criticism of season 3’s darkness by saying he put as much humanity and warmth in as he could, but the season was ultimately more Lynch’s rodeo than his. Agrees the Return was harder, colder, angrier, and had less humour. This is due to things Lynch added after Frost stepped away, and were a result of his temperament and interests.

Lots to talk about but this is just the tip of the iceberg. The book is an excellent read for anyone interested in the creative process, and an absolute essential purchase for anyone on Dugpa.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Agent Earle » Tue Mar 17, 2020 6:07 am

enumbs wrote:I just finished reading David Bushman’s book. Amongst all kinds of interesting material (including the aforementioned Richard and Linda info), I was particularly struck by these tidbits regarding season 3:

    Lynch didn’t pursue Chester Desmond’s return despite Frost mentioning the idea in the writing process. I think this contradicts some of the rumours on this forum but there you go.

    Lynch didn’t know who Judy was when Frost asked. The idea of bringing in Sumerian mythology and “Joudy” came after an inter-dimensional demon in box was already in play.

    On a similar note, Frost states that the caller pretending to be Jeffries was trying to access information about someone else’s location. Presumably this is Sarah/Judy playing a part in the plan to suck Mr C back into the Lodge?

    The possibility of Sarah being inhabited by a spirit was apparently something to do with the fact Lynch couldn’t let go off Laura as a character - this had become more his obsession than Frost’s. No surprise to hear Lynch wanted to bring Twin Peaks back to Laura, but does this mean it was also his insistence to make Sarah a vessel for Judy? This could be his way of tying Frost’s supernatural ideas into the trauma at the heart of the series.

    Bushman asks if Lynch and Frost were on the same page. Frost replies “there were times I began to wonder about that”. Ha!

    Frost responds to criticism of season 3’s darkness by saying he put as much humanity and warmth in as he could, but the season was ultimately more Lynch’s rodeo than his. Agrees the Return was harder, colder, angrier, and had less humour. This is due to things Lynch added after Frost stepped away, and were a result of his temperament and interests.

Lots to talk about but this is just the tip of the iceberg. The book is an excellent read for anyone interested in the creative process, and an absolute essential purchase for anyone on Dugpa.


Since I'm not getting the Frost book due to current coronavirus crisis any time soon (the fact that frustrates me immensely), would you be so kind to share the information about Frost's possible elaborations about the characters of Windom Earle and Annie Blackburn? Does he even mention them, or go into details about why they got the short shrift in S3? Also, any mention of the reasons behind the absences of Michael Ontkean, Piper Laurie, Ray Wise (well, he was practically missing in S3!)? Any talk about MJA and Sherilyn Fenn dramas? Feel free to PM me if you want to avoid sharing spoilers with the rest of the board, I'll be infinitely grateful :)
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby eyeboogers » Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:16 am

Agent Earle wrote:Since I'm not getting the Frost book due to current coronavirus crisis any time soon (the fact that frustrates me immensely), would you be so kind to share the information about Frost's possible elaborations about the characters of Windom Earle and Annie Blackburn? Does he even mention them, or go into details about why they got the short shrift in S3? Also, any mention of the reasons behind the absences of Michael Ontkean, Piper Laurie, Ray Wise (well, he was practically missing in S3!)? Any talk about MJA and Sherilyn Fenn dramas? Feel free to PM me if you want to avoid sharing spoilers with the rest of the board, I'll be infinitely grateful :)


I completely understand if you prefer getting the book in paperform, but still wanted to mention that it is out as an ebook (that is how I am currently reading it).
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:27 am

eyeboogers wrote:
Agent Earle wrote:Since I'm not getting the Frost book due to current coronavirus crisis any time soon (the fact that frustrates me immensely), would you be so kind to share the information about Frost's possible elaborations about the characters of Windom Earle and Annie Blackburn? Does he even mention them, or go into details about why they got the short shrift in S3? Also, any mention of the reasons behind the absences of Michael Ontkean, Piper Laurie, Ray Wise (well, he was practically missing in S3!)? Any talk about MJA and Sherilyn Fenn dramas? Feel free to PM me if you want to avoid sharing spoilers with the rest of the board, I'll be infinitely grateful :)


I completely understand if you prefer getting the book in paperform, but still wanted to mention that it is out as an ebook (that is how I am currently reading it).


He might also be having pandemic-related financial issues, as many are. It’s a strange and trying time.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby Agent Earle » Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:02 pm

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
eyeboogers wrote:
Agent Earle wrote:Since I'm not getting the Frost book due to current coronavirus crisis any time soon (the fact that frustrates me immensely), would you be so kind to share the information about Frost's possible elaborations about the characters of Windom Earle and Annie Blackburn? Does he even mention them, or go into details about why they got the short shrift in S3? Also, any mention of the reasons behind the absences of Michael Ontkean, Piper Laurie, Ray Wise (well, he was practically missing in S3!)? Any talk about MJA and Sherilyn Fenn dramas? Feel free to PM me if you want to avoid sharing spoilers with the rest of the board, I'll be infinitely grateful :)


I completely understand if you prefer getting the book in paperform, but still wanted to mention that it is out as an ebook (that is how I am currently reading it).


He might also be having pandemic-related financial issues, as many are. It’s a strange and trying time.


As of yet, there's none of those issues for me, but that may change soon, since in my European country, crypto-fascists have come into power just prior to the pandemic being declared, and it's expected they will use the crisis to implement total deconstruction of society as we know it, so there's no telling where we'll be even a month from now. It's no time to be alive in my corner of the world, but what can you do.
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Re: Season 3, The First Draft - Speculation etc.

Postby LateReg » Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:05 pm

Agent Earle wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:
eyeboogers wrote:
I completely understand if you prefer getting the book in paperform, but still wanted to mention that it is out as an ebook (that is how I am currently reading it).


He might also be having pandemic-related financial issues, as many are. It’s a strange and trying time.


As of yet, there's none of those issues for me, but that may change soon, since in my European country, crypto-fascists have come into power just prior to the pandemic being declared, and it's expected they will use the crisis to implement total deconstruction of society as we know it, so there's no telling where we'll be even a month from now. It's no time to be alive in my corner of the world, but what can you do.


Shit. I'm sorry to hear that. Hang in there is all I can say, I suppose. I'm really sorry to hear that.

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