northwest passage: a fan edit.

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Brad D
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby Brad D » Thu Apr 05, 2012 8:31 pm

I do not get the intrigue about this, at all.
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garethw
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby garethw » Mon Apr 16, 2012 7:13 am

jlyon1515 wrote:And for those that think "remixing" old work into new content is something new, I would point out the following mini documentary:

I couldn't get past the first part, as it was so completely muddled. The documentarian doesn't seem to understand the difference between the rights associated with publishing a song (the music, lyrics) versus the copyright of a recording. And as such, he gets all confused between:

* Referencing a published work (e.g. "Lemon Song")
* Covering a published work (e.g. a zillion covers of "Hairway To Steven")
* Sampling an existing recording (e.g. "Rhymin' and Stealin'" sampling "When The Levee Breaks")
* Remixing a recording (e.g. U2's "New Year's Day [US remix]")

The punchline is that this documentary - ostensibly about remixing - does not present a single example of a remix - at least not in the first part.

But that documentary is a bit of a red-hearing, since "Northwest Passage" is none of those things anyway. It's more analogous to a radio edit of a particular song for length or content - but not authorized by the artist, not licensed by the publisher, and violating the copyright of the recording. Or perhaps it's like editing the Harry Potter books and removing all of the passages relating to certain characters.

jlyon1515 wrote:I mean, by that same logic any of the Twin Peaks artwork is inappropriate and arrogant because it's a "bad" derivitive of the original photos and doesn't capture Twin Peaks in the same way.

Not at all. The works that have been posted recently by TP20 are fine original works by talented artists, inspired by and referencing ideas and imagery Twin Peaks. I'd be reluctant to call "Northwest Passage" art at all. It's a piece of technical work (and a pretty good one - quality is not the essence of my argument. I've gone out of my way to make that point). It's just an unauthorized edit, and undertaking such a project implies that a) there is something wrong with the original that needs fixing, and that b) the editor thinks highly enough of himself to believe he is the right person to fix it.

PS. Since we're on the topic, I do have a problem with people who are happy to liberally lift material from others without permission, but then think that their work should be somehow protected. This has happened (at least) twice on this forum. It's unfortunate that the relevant posts have been deleted, as they made a fine case study in hypocrisy, and suggest that some people change their minds on copyright to suit their interests.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby qbin2001 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:23 pm

TheArm wrote:
Audrey Horne wrote:can someone explain exactly what this is? I saw the first two minutes of it a few months ago, and not sure what the intent is. Not knocking it, but not sure why someone is reediting the pilot or the series- the pilot and first season is already perfect.


I haven't watched it yet, but I believe the intent is to reedit the entire series into a movie, basically. To condense the essence of Twin Peaks into about 2 hours, right? Somehow I suspect that neither Little Nicky, Evelyn Marsh or Lana made the final cut...


It contains Laura Palmer case only. All scenes not connected directly to the case do not exist in this edit. Pretty interesting, to watch something you know so well in other form (and in 16:9). It gives you a little "new look" at Twin Peaks. But I cached myself that I think what scene is missing here and there.... but only on the beginning.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby Brad D » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:23 pm

qbin2001 wrote:
TheArm wrote:
Audrey Horne wrote:can someone explain exactly what this is? I saw the first two minutes of it a few months ago, and not sure what the intent is. Not knocking it, but not sure why someone is reediting the pilot or the series- the pilot and first season is already perfect.


I haven't watched it yet, but I believe the intent is to reedit the entire series into a movie, basically. To condense the essence of Twin Peaks into about 2 hours, right? Somehow I suspect that neither Little Nicky, Evelyn Marsh or Lana made the final cut...


It contains Laura Palmer case only. All scenes not connected directly to the case do not exist in this edit. Pretty interesting, to watch something you know so well in other form (and in 16:9). It gives you a little "new look" at Twin Peaks. But I cached myself that I think what scene is missing here and there.... but only on the beginning.


How can this be in 16:9? TP was not shot with that ratio, anything else is a neutered view.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby garethw » Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:12 am

Brad D wrote:How can this be in 16:9? TP was not shot with that ratio, anything else is a neutered view.


You're absolutely correct. I'm not sure why "It's in 16:9!" is supposed to be a selling point, since that really means "Now with 25% less frame!". That being said, it was less noticeable than I expected.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby Roger » Fri Jul 06, 2012 12:59 pm

Well it was shot on film.
If the director's had a different aspect ratio in mind while shooting is another matter.
I would think not though as it was shot for television.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby qbin2001 » Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:50 am

garethw wrote:
Brad D wrote:How can this be in 16:9? TP was not shot with that ratio, anything else is a neutered view.


You're absolutely correct. I'm not sure why "It's in 16:9!" is supposed to be a selling point, since that really means "Now with 25% less frame!". That being said, it was less noticeable than I expected.


I had similar doubts before I watched this edit. To my surprise 16:9 worked pretty well. I stopped noticing it quite fast. Different editing of the story AND 16:9 aspect ratio - that's what gives you that new different look into Twin Peaks world. It's a Fan-Edit - anything is possible. Watch first - judge later.


http://fanedit.org/wp/13619/
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby Hank_Jennings » Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:07 am

I really do not get how this is arrogant at all. I'd say its an experiment to see what would it be like if it was strictly a murder mystery.

Now, here's an example of arrogance. Some guy on IMDB re-edited Fire Walk with Me, claiming it is superior to Lynch's version. This guy even had the nerve to be condescending to anyone who prefers the film as is & wasn't interested. He was also trying to force people to prefer his version.

An example of what this "genius" changed was he made Maddy appear in Laura's bed instead of Annie. All I saw was a bit of the Maddy murder scene poorly inserted just before Heather Graham appears. This "Maddy" still looked & sounded like Heather Graham. The visual differences between the series & FWWM also stuck out like a very sore thumb. I personally have no problem with the different visuals, but they do not work if edited together.

It doesn't seem that this guy who has made the fan edit of the series is trying to claim it is better than what Lynch & Frost created.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby Black Rose » Sat Sep 01, 2012 6:48 pm

I just finished watching the 5-hour cut and I liked it with a few caveats.

I really like the show LOST. For those not familiar with LOST, each episode has the main story with the large ensemble cast of plane crash survivors, but a good portion of each episode flashes back in the life of a particular character, and shows how that character got to be on the airplane in the first place.

For example, one character wanted to go to Australia to participate in a walkabout, but because he was in a wheelchair, the people in charge of the walkabout wouldn't let him participate, so he had to go home. In another episode you saw how he got to be in the wheelchair. In yet another episode you saw how he had gotten back in touch with his father whom he had never met. The back stories are told out of order, so while time is moving forward on the island the personalities and motivations of each character are revealed gradually, and subtle connections between the characters are also revealed.

The last time I watched LOST, I didn't watch the whole thing straight through. Instead I watched all the episodes about one character, then I watched all the episodes about another character, and so forth. Even though watching it this way wasn't what the people who made the show had intended, it was nevertheless helpful for revealing patterns and connections that I had never seen before. It even revealed things that the creators probably did intend, but were overshadowed by all the complexity of the main plot.

Similarly, in just watching the "main mystery" scenes in Twin Peaks, I observed things that I had never noticed before, despite the fact that I've seen the show a dozen times. For example, in the scene where Laura's body is in the morgue in the first episode, Cooper picks up a pair of forceps off a tray and digs under Laura's nail with them. These forceps appear in at least three more scenes, making it look like Cooper straight gaffled the forceps from the hospital. Other things that are in the series more than I ever noticed before are doughnuts and that whistle that Coop whittles.

Similarly, there are a lot of scenes where dialogue is repeated several times. The most notable of these scenes is when Donna goes to see Laura's mother, and Mrs. Palmer says, "I miss her so much," and then Donna echoes, "I miss her so much," and then Mrs. Palmer says, "I miss her so much, I miss her so much, I miss her so much..." Although I noticed that scene quite a while ago, there are several other scenes where the same thing is said several times that I had not reflected on before.

Finally, and this is probably a discussion for another thread, Cooper is a weird dude. The more I see the show, the less I am sure that I like him as a person. I think you could make a whole edit that shows him as a creepy sleazoid. It's been argued before that Cooper is such a "pure" character that he never would have had sex with Audrey, but that's nonsense.

In short, seeing the scenes from the perspective of one character opened a window to insights that I have never had before.

For the most part, I was surprised at how well done the transitions between scenes were, as well as the fact that some scenes were shortened to remove extraneous information in a way that would not have been obvious had I not known the dialogue already.

On the down side, I thought it was too short. There were a few plot lines such as the Shelly/Bobby/Leo plotline and the Donna/James/Maddy/Harold plotline that were obviously incomplete. There were also a few scenes like the scene in the town hall meeting at the beginning that were shortened in a way that cut out vital information. I think adding another half an hour or so could have rounded it out a bit.

Even though some of the canon scenes were janktified, I thought it was overall pretty good and a nice look into a side of a familiar show that I hadn't seen before.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby vancurenw » Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:35 pm

garethw wrote:
jlyon1515 wrote:Not at all. The works that have been posted recently by TP20 are fine original works by talented artists, inspired by and referencing ideas and imagery Twin Peaks. I'd be reluctant to call "Northwest Passage" art at all. It's a piece of technical work (and a pretty good one - quality is not the essence of my argument. I've gone out of my way to make that point). It's just an unauthorized edit, and undertaking such a project implies that a) there is something wrong with the original that needs fixing, and that b) the editor thinks highly enough of himself to believe he is the right person to fix it.


Not necessarily. It is an interesting experiment, and taken in that context, isn't necessarily arrogant or insulting. It doesn't imply those two points; you inferred them.
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby Mysterioso » Wed Sep 05, 2012 12:53 am

Yes. I like all fan edits. I am also do my own fan edit so I can learning edit and compositing with material I love. Yes, I make changes and it is for experiment. If you like, great. If you no like, great too, but not necessary be infer man. :roll:
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby Ajax Rules » Thu Nov 20, 2014 2:08 am

When I first read about this, yesterday, I got the impression that this edit was going to be a re-edit of season 2 only. And that was exactly what I was hoping for for a long time.

I think the idea makes perfect sense. S1 is briljant, S2 is very dissapointing (and not even in line with Lynch's ideas), so why not re-edit S2? Of course, it would be fantastic if Lynch would devote himself to this task. But I would be interested in a fan-edit as well.

Although I liked the general idea, I think the concrete implementation should have been different:
- S1 completely intact
- The final epsiode of S2 completely intact
- All the episodes in between re-edited, not by focussing only on Laura Palmer, but rather by eliminating/shortening all the weak plots and characters: Little Nicky, the paternity test, Mr. Tagamura, the new boyfriend of Audrey, Evelyn, etc. None of the material relating to the lodges, Giants, dwarfs, owls, ghosts and supernatural elements should be eleminated imho.

I would kill for Lynch (or someone else, for that matter) to take on this job. It would be great to have a new S2 (maybe even containing some new material, if it is available, to make it more fluid) of similar length to S1 and S3. And to remove the old S2 from the canon.

So instead of 5 hours for S1+S2, about 7 hours for S2 alone (including 100% of the final episode). Q2, would you be so kind to do it again like this? :wink:
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Re: northwest passage: a fan edit.

Postby jlyon1515 » Fri Nov 21, 2014 12:17 pm

Ajax Rules wrote:Although I liked the general idea, I think the concrete implementation should have been different:
- S1 completely intact
- The final epsiode of S2 completely intact
- All the episodes in between re-edited, not by focussing only on Laura Palmer, but rather by eliminating/shortening all the weak plots and characters: Little Nicky, the paternity test, Mr. Tagamura, the new boyfriend of Audrey, Evelyn, etc. None of the material relating to the lodges, Giants, dwarfs, owls, ghosts and supernatural elements should be eleminated imho.


That wasn't the task that Q2 wanted to do, so he didn't do it that way. I like that it's not S1 intact. It almost ruins the point of doing his edit to do it your suggested way. You are free to do your own edit to your liking, though. :)

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