NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

[CuriousWoman]

Yeah, bashing James Hurley is all fun and game but it really needs to stop when you are becoming vicious, epecially to the actual James Marshall.

It's not as bad as what happened to the child actor of Anakin in the Phantom Menace (look up what happened to him. Or rather don't, it's nasty), but it makes me feel bad to even be in the same fanbase sometimes.

Germans probably have a word for this kind of emotions.

[Venus]

I'm another one who never understood the James bashing. I think he does a good job in the role and the character did what he needed to. Like I never understood the Donna bashing either. I think LFB did a great job in that role. Though don't get me started on Moira Kelly. Only one Donna for me and Moira replacing LFB in FWWM is still to this day jarring for me. That's why I'm hoping Michael Ontkean being replaced isn't going to be too jarring either.

[CuriousWoman]

I think the Evelyn plotline is one of the main reason of the James hate. That and the fact that he far from the most intriguing character, he is a stereotype that we sse in many soap operas. To me, he is not the worst actor either (the consensus would be Eric DaRe but since his character is much better used, that's not brought up nearly as often)

[underthefan]

Not sure if this information is already in the EW article (because I haven't been able to find the magazine yet), but thought I would post this for anyone interested:

http://ew.com/tv/2017/03/28/twin-peaks- ... aclachlan/

[Mordeen]

There's a deleted scene out there where James' mother is featured in person. It's horrible (if you're familiar with the details) in the sense that it speaks to just how deeply James is cut by the women in his life. He's actually a very complex character with a fatal flaw: all the women in his life are damaged or murdered. How would you behave?

Most underrated and misunderstood character in Twin Peaks. Can't wait for Lynch to make him shine in S3.

-Mordeen

[N. Needleman]

Interesting tidbit from the Kyle interview re: Season 2 -

He was “very excited” to get back into Agent Cooper’s threads, he says, and recalling that excitement reminds him of a story from the show’s second season. “There was a point where I wanted to get away from the suit, as a way to explore different dimensions of the character.” He got his wish after the conclusion of the Laura Palmer mystery, during a stretch of episodes when Cooper went local and adopted an outfit that might be called lumberjack business casual: red and black flannel shirt tucked into gray khakis with a brown belt. In some ways, Cooper’s makeover was a visual symbol for the show’s intensifying identity crisis. “I thought it was the right thing to do,” he says. “Looking back on it now, it was absolutely not the right thing to do!”

I actually like that part of Coop going native for awhile (and then regaining the suit), though I understand the recurring complaint abut it from many quarters (Lynch included, I believe) - this is the first I'm hearing of Kyle saying he was involved with it vs. simply disliking it.

[Panapaok]

Even if it's still hush-hush, they're talking more and more about the show exploring Cooper's fate and about going into dark places with the character. It's going to be crazy.

[Boy]

Interesting tidbit from the Kyle interview re: Season 2 -

He was “very excited” to get back into Agent Cooper’s threads, he says, and recalling that excitement reminds him of a story from the show’s second season. “There was a point where I wanted to get away from the suit, as a way to explore different dimensions of the character.” He got his wish after the conclusion of the Laura Palmer mystery, during a stretch of episodes when Cooper went local and adopted an outfit that might be called lumberjack business casual: red and black flannel shirt tucked into gray khakis with a brown belt. In some ways, Cooper’s makeover was a visual symbol for the show’s intensifying identity crisis. “I thought it was the right thing to do,” he says. “Looking back on it now, it was absolutely not the right thing to do!”

I actually like that part of Coop going native for awhile (and then regaining the suit), though I understand the recurring complaint abut it from many quarters (Lynch included, I believe) - this is the first I'm hearing of Kyle saying he was involved with it vs. simply disliking it.

Personally I think Cooper going native for a while is a very good thing for the character. I was excited seeing him integrating into Twin Peaks. He was not only a "observer" anymore. There's something vulnerable about Cooper there. We learn he loves this place so much he integrates (maybe to understand the place better, too) but ultimately he has to face the darkest parts of that town, the town that he has personally invested in. (And face his personal life mistakes as well)

[Boy]

Well, at least for storywise it wasn't a mistake to integrate Cooper. It was the writing and directing after this.

[Snailhead]

There's a deleted scene out there where James' mother is featured in person. It's horrible (if you're familiar with the details) in the sense that it speaks to just how deeply James is cut by the women in his life. He's actually a very complex character with a fatal flaw: all the women in his life are damaged or murdered. How would you behave?

Most underrated and misunderstood character in Twin Peaks. Can't wait for Lynch to make him shine in S3.

-Mordeen

Did they actually shoot the scene, or are you referring to a scene that was written but then never shot?

As for James: he was never a favourite character of mine, but I mostly chalk that up to the writing.

I think James Marshall's performance in FWWM was really good, so I'm happy he's involved in the new material.

[Audrey Horne]

First, James Marshall is a great guy... And it's been a discovery of mine through reading and meeting some of the fans is they lack a chip of common sense, which is true of probably people obsessed with most fandoms.

And yes, the scene of James and his mom, Colleen was filmed and then scraped during season one. And then was going to be used in season two (third or fourth episode, can't remember) and then scraped again. The name of the actress escapes me.

[mtwentz]

I always liked James - he had some great moments in the show, especially in the Pilot and episode 16, just before he rode off.

[Mordeen]

First, James Marshall is a great guy... And it's been a discovery of mine through reading and meeting some of the fans is they lack a chip of common sense, which is true of probably people obsessed with most fandoms.

And yes, the scene of James and his mom, Colleen was filmed and then scraped during season one. And then was going to be used in season two (third or fourth episode, can't remember) and then scraped again. The name of the actress escapes me.

All of this 100%.

In the scene she comes home with a "John" in tow. It was apparently cut for time on the first go, not sure what stopped it a second time, but if included at any point would have gone a long way to show James' inherent struggle, even for such a short scene.

-Mordeen

[kitty666cats]

I would love to see the scene with James' mother! A shame it got cut out. I forget, is his father deceased? I know they mention him in TSHOTP, but I forget what is mentioned about him in the show itself...

[Mr. Reindeer]

I would love to see the scene with James' mother! A shame it got cut out. I forget, is his father deceased? I know they mention him in TSHOTP, but I forget what is mentioned about him in the show itself...

In the show, his dad was a musician who split while they were living "on the west coast" (more specifically San Fran, per the scripts); I don't believe there was any indication that he died.

In TSHoTP, the Hurleys have been Packard Mill employees for generations (Ed seems to have two brothers who both worked for the Mill, Ernest and Billy -- Billy is James's dad). Billy has his leg crushed by logs (apparently the third generation of Hurleys to be injured at the Mill) and goes on disability, turning to drink. (Oddly, in the show, James's mom was the alcoholic -- in the book, his mother Susan begs Ed to read her husband the riot act to get him to sober up.)

The Colleen scene being cut -- twice -- feels like a Lynch move to me. I have no insider info to support that, but I've been comparing the scripts to the finished episodes throughout my rewatch. Lynch tends to shy away from the more "overwritten" moments in the episodes he directs. Episode 8 is possibly as good a "Frost vs. Lynch" analysis as we're apt to get. Lynch seemingly rewrote almost every scene on set, reordering lines and changing wording while conveying the same information (IMO, with great success -- for a guy who is unabashedly more committed to images than words, he has a way with dialogue). Notably, the moments Lynch leaves 99% untouched in Episode 8 are the lines that deserve to be overwritten: anything involving Albert, and the monologues by Ed and Garland. The Colleen Hurley scene (which I personally like) boils down to TV writers giving intentionally pretentious dialogue to an intentionally pretentious writer character. To me, that feels like exactly the sort of thing that Lynch would dub a "sadness." I can't say that I agree or disagree -- I think Hunter or Glatter (or Lynch himself, gun to his head) could certainly have made that scene work beautifully. But my guess is that, for Lynch, that was a scene that pulled too far in the Frost/Peyton/Engels direction to fit his world.

Btw, according to Jerry, Linda Carlson is the actor who played Colleen. My question is: Was the scene shot for Episode 4 or Episode 10? Or both?