Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Discussion of Twin Peaks and Fire Walk With Me

Moderators: Annie, BookhouseBoyBob, Ross, Jerry Horne, Brad D

Forum rules
Welcome to the forum. We know our members are passionate about their love for all things Twin Peaks. You wouldn't be here if that wasn't the case. Despite having differing viewpoints it is a policy that we all treat each other with mutual respect.

Posting abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, sexually-orientated, or any material that may violate any laws be it of your country or the country where this forum is hosted will get you permanently banned.

Posting of spoilers are allowed as long as you indicate (Spoilers) in the topic name and use the Spoiler Tag.
User avatar
AXX°N N.
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2017 8:47 pm

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby AXX°N N. » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:00 am

Agent Earle wrote:You both made my point beautifully. I wouldn't have a problem with how it all turned out during the show's initial run - I think it's all water under the bridge and we should let it go at this point (no matter how I wish the show would've gotten a continuation back then ...). What irks me is that Lynch and some of the cast are so quick to dismiss S 2 today as this ungodly, shameful thing and forget (or "forget") to mention Lynch's own considerable role in the infamous deterioration of the show's quality. The least we can agree on is that such behavior is unfair. Peyton himself implied as much in one of his recent (embittered) tweets.

I agree, but at the same time I can understand their stances. The deterioration didn't happen in a vacuum, with Lynch and Frost getting a fair shake at making the show how they wanted, as if they capitulated to deterioration on their own terms. Frost has stated that they agreed to buckle to the pressure, but the pressure was there nonetheless, and I disagree categorically with the executive demands. I imagine that having your creative output tampered with would be an absolutely fouling experience, and turn your involvement very quickly into one that's compromised in a fundamental way. When the show is no longer your show, you might start seeing things once unjustified on your part, like disengagement and missed deadlines, as tat for tat.
Recipe not my own. In a coffee cup. 3 TBS flour, 2 TBS sugar, 1.5 TBS cocoa powder, .25 TSP baking powder, pinch of salt. 3 TBS milk, 1.5 TBS vegetable oil, 1 TBS peanut butter. Add and mix each set. Microwave 1 minute 10 seconds. The cup will be hot.
User avatar
Mr. Reindeer
Posts: 2145
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:09 pm

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:36 pm

The forced resolution of the “Who Killed Laura Palmer” arc (which Mark has said he endorsed at the time but now regrets) may have been the straw that broke the camel’s back for DKL, but I think once he was forced to confront the realities of conventional TV production, the whole process was anathema to his creative impulses. He disengaged fairly early on due to W@H (whatever caused him to decide to make that movie right then I’ve never quite understood), and in his book he talks a lot about how painful it was to have other writers and directors working in his universe. This is a guy who wants to be involved in every microcosm of his films, from placing the dust bunnies under the radiator to painting blood on actors himself. I think his disenchantment began creeping in very early, once he realized that every time he directed, he was walking into a story that had been continuously evolving without him, as if someone had directed a half hour of Blue Velvet and then handed the film back to him and told him to pick up from whatever they did. I don’t think outside forces can be blamed for the sporadic/unreliable nature of his commitment to the show, particularly in the first season. According to everyone, L/F & co. had complete freedom and very little meddling beyond a few minor censorship things (“little Elvis”). I’m not even sure the network could have forced the WKLP reveal if Mark hadn’t capitulated. I think DKL agreed to work in a manner without really thinking through the realities, and it ended up being a lot more annoying and painful to him than he expected.
User avatar
AXX°N N.
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2017 8:47 pm

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby AXX°N N. » Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:27 pm

Mr. Reindeer wrote:The forced resolution of the “Who Killed Laura Palmer” arc (which Mark has said he endorsed at the time but now regrets) may have been the straw that broke the camel’s back for DKL, but I think once he was forced to confront the realities of conventional TV production, the whole process was anathema to his creative impulses. He disengaged fairly early on due to W@H (whatever caused him to decide to make that movie right then I’ve never quite understood), and in his book he talks a lot about how painful it was to have other writers and directors working in his universe. This is a guy who wants to be involved in every microcosm of his films, from placing the dust bunnies under the radiator to painting blood on actors himself. I think his disenchantment began creeping in very early, once he realized that every time he directed, he was walking into a story that had been continuously evolving without him, as if someone had directed a half hour of Blue Velvet and then handed the film back to him and told him to pick up from whatever they did. I don’t think outside forces can be blamed for the sporadic/unreliable nature of his commitment to the show, particularly in the first season. According to everyone, L/F & co. had complete freedom and very little meddling beyond a few minor censorship things (“little Elvis”). I’m not even sure the network could have forced the WKLP reveal if Mark hadn’t capitulated. I think DKL agreed to work in a manner without really thinking through the realities, and it ended up being a lot more annoying and painful to him than he expected.

You know, that's a great point I'd never considered. Even without the executive meddling, the setup of the series involving other directors & writers was probably doomed in and of itself in terms of Lynch's disenchantment ... I think it's also worth pointing out how Mark (according to Reflections) wanted Spielberg to direct the Season 2 opener, which made David jump back in and take the helm--apparently, at one point, not even having planned to direct the premiere himself, which sounds bonkers to me. And indicates that his involvement has always been sorta contentious, and almost predicated on challenges posited to his authorship.
Recipe not my own. In a coffee cup. 3 TBS flour, 2 TBS sugar, 1.5 TBS cocoa powder, .25 TSP baking powder, pinch of salt. 3 TBS milk, 1.5 TBS vegetable oil, 1 TBS peanut butter. Add and mix each set. Microwave 1 minute 10 seconds. The cup will be hot.
User avatar
Mr. Reindeer
Posts: 2145
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:09 pm

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:05 pm

AXX°N N. wrote:You know, that's a great point I'd never considered. Even without the executive meddling, the setup of the series involving other directors & writers was probably doomed in and of itself in terms of Lynch's disenchantment ... I think it's also worth pointing out how Mark (according to Reflections) wanted Spielberg to direct the Season 2 opener, which made David jump back in and take the helm--apparently, at one point, not even having planned to direct the premiere himself, which sounds bonkers to me. And indicates that his involvement has always been sorta contentious, and almost predicated on challenges posited to his authorship.


Good call on the Spielberg thing. Ever since I read about that, I’ve thought that DKL’s actions were incredibly selfish from the standpoint of professional and personal loyalty (it’s impossible to even imagine what the prestige of a Spielberg-directed premiere might have done for the show’s caché, and in turn for the fortunes of its cast and crew). And yet artistically, thank GOD DKL stepped in, whatever his motives (it sounds, based on Mark and Harley’s version, like DKL felt jealous at the idea of a bigger director working on his show), because I can’t imagine anyone else directing E8 (Spielberg is great at his own thing, but his take on the Waiter/Giant scene, or the closing train car flashback, could never approach what DKL did with those sequences). I don’t necessarily admire his offscreen actions, but I’m so grateful for what ended up onscreen as a result.

It’s also sort of telling re: DKL’s level of involvement in even the earliest stages of S2 that Mark and Harley apparently met with Spielberg semi-formally multiple times about directing before they even ran the idea by DKL.

One last stray thought: DKL has repeatedly talked about his meeting with George Lucas about potentially directing Return of the Jedi, and his concluding advice to Lucas that Star Wars was George’s thing and DKL wished he would direct it himself. I think that speaks volumes about his mindset regarding directorial delegation.
User avatar
dreamshake
Posts: 104
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:04 pm

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby dreamshake » Tue Sep 18, 2018 6:49 pm

All this is wonderful stuff guys. Don't have much more to add to what yall have said but I do want to point out that Lynch's incompatibility and disquiet from the get-go with the reality of episodic tv in 1991 w/r/t authorship is really reflected in his comments from last year about season 3 bringing the show back to the "true world" of Twin peaks from the pilot.
Agent Earle
Posts: 793
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:55 am

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby Agent Earle » Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:29 am

Yes, kudos to Mr. Reindeer and AXX°N N. for a great discussion. The arguments that have come up during it put, I think, all the yammering about how great the show would've been hadn't bad bad "outside forces" taken it away from Lynch during Season 2 to rest. That being said, I love all the Lynch-directed eps from S 1 and 2 (with the seldomly mentioned second episode of S 2, "Coma", being my particular favorite), and I would've loved to see him commit more to the ongoing tasks of daily showrunning, demanded to keep the series alive and well, during the show's original run. What he did with Finale (considering the written mess that was handed to him to direct) is the work of a Genius, pure and simple.
User avatar
Mr. Reindeer
Posts: 2145
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:09 pm

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Sat Sep 22, 2018 8:13 pm

Agent Earle wrote:And let's not forget: no-one forced Lynch to walk away from TP the first time around. Kimmy Robertson would do well to get her facts straight instead of perpetuating the same old same old rumor whenever she feels like crapping all over season 2 and the collective efforts of people who worked really hard to give us our weekly fix of TP when His Majesty wasn't around (something that was of his own choosing). And, overall, did a damn fine job with what they were given and with chaotic conditions they were forced to work in - as opposed to Lynch, who simply walked away cause he felt like it, abandoning it all and in so doing helping to create the said chaotic conditions, and now complaining from 25 plus years worth of safe distance.


I think Kimmy (like Lynch himself) speaks her mind with no filter, and varies from day to day in terms of what mindset she’s in. In Lynch’s recent biography Room to Dream, she actually does put more of the blame on Lynch himelf: “When David left I felt like he abandoned the show. This isn’t on the people who worked on the second season—they did what they were supposed to do, and I honestly don’t know whose fault it is.”
Agent Earle
Posts: 793
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:55 am

Re: Season 3 Magazine Coverage and Articles Worldwide

Postby Agent Earle » Sun Sep 23, 2018 12:21 am

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
I think Kimmy (like Lynch himself) speaks her mind with no filter, and varies from day to day in terms of what mindset she’s in. In Lynch’s recent biography Room to Dream, she actually does put more of the blame on Lynch himelf: “When David left I felt like he abandoned the show. This isn’t on the people who worked on the second season—they did what they were supposed to do, and I honestly don’t know whose fault it is.”



Hm, I missed that quote as I haven't read "Room to Dream". Thanks for alerting me to it. What she says sounds fair and I can totally live with it.

Return to “Twin Peaks”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 45 guests