Parts 1 & 2 - My log has a message for you & The stars turn and a time presents itself (SPOILERS)

Discussion of each of the 18 parts of Twin Peaks the Return

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N. Needleman
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by N. Needleman »

I also assumed the Laura in these episodes is post-FWWM. She's ascended and has light and power within, but she comes back to communicate with Cooper. Then something reaches out and takes her somewhere.
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claaa7
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by claaa7 »

N. Needleman wrote:I also assumed the Laura in these episodes is post-FWWM. She's ascended and has light and power within, but she comes back to communicate with Cooper. Then something reaches out and takes her somewhere.
yup, that's what i get from her exposing the light behind her face as well
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Mibbler
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Mibbler »

Sorry folks but, as a non american fan I have a (maybe silly) question: I tried to locate Buckhorn in Googlemaps but when I was typing the name I couldn´t get any town located in South Dakota:
buckhorn.jpg
buckhorn.jpg (18.58 KiB) Viewed 11045 times
Guiding myself by what we see in Bad Coop´s computer, Buckhorn would supposed to be located more or less near the town named Sturgis... or Tilford.
buckhornb.jpg
buckhornb.jpg (66.02 KiB) Viewed 11045 times
sturgis.jpg
sturgis.jpg (23.02 KiB) Viewed 11045 times
Do I have to assume therefore we are talking about a fictional Buckhorn? :?
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Zachary
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Zachary »

Mibbler wrote:Sorry folks but, as a non american fan I have a (maybe silly) question: I tried to locate Buckhorn in Googlemaps but when I was typing the name I couldn´t get any town located in South Dakota:

buckhorn.jpg

Guiding myself by what we see in Bad Coop´s computer, Buckhorn would supposed to be located more or less near the town named Sturgis... or Tilford.

buckhornb.jpgsturgis.jpg

Do I have to assume therefore we are talking about a fictional Buckhorn? :?
I think your conclusion is correct. Yankton is definitely a real place, and Sturgis is a fairly well-known town. I wonder why they decided to fictionalize the South Dakota location while also referencing the globally-known New York City and Las Vegas.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Mr. Reindeer »

Zachary wrote:
Mibbler wrote:Sorry folks but, as a non american fan I have a (maybe silly) question: I tried to locate Buckhorn in Googlemaps but when I was typing the name I couldn´t get any town located in South Dakota:

buckhorn.jpg

Guiding myself by what we see in Bad Coop´s computer, Buckhorn would supposed to be located more or less near the town named Sturgis... or Tilford.

buckhornb.jpgsturgis.jpg

Do I have to assume therefore we are talking about a fictional Buckhorn? :?
I think your conclusion is correct. Yankton is definitely a real place, and Sturgis is a fairly well-known town. I wonder why they decided to fictionalize the South Dakota location while also referencing the globally-known New York City and Las Vegas.
Probably to create a mirror of Twin Peaks, Deer Meadow, etc. NYC and Vegas are unique cities, obviously chosen to evoke their well-known images. In the case of Buckhorn, they just wanted another small town where a murder happens. Using a real town name wouldn't have really added anything.
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Zachary
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Zachary »

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
Zachary wrote:
Mibbler wrote:Sorry folks but, as a non american fan I have a (maybe silly) question: I tried to locate Buckhorn in Googlemaps but when I was typing the name I couldn´t get any town located in South Dakota:

buckhorn.jpg

Guiding myself by what we see in Bad Coop´s computer, Buckhorn would supposed to be located more or less near the town named Sturgis... or Tilford.

buckhornb.jpgsturgis.jpg

Do I have to assume therefore we are talking about a fictional Buckhorn? :?
I think your conclusion is correct. Yankton is definitely a real place, and Sturgis is a fairly well-known town. I wonder why they decided to fictionalize the South Dakota location while also referencing the globally-known New York City and Las Vegas.
Probably to create a mirror of Twin Peaks, Deer Meadow, etc. NYC and Vegas are unique cities, obviously chosen to evoke their well-known images. In the case of Buckhorn, they just wanted another small town where a murder happens. Using a real town name wouldn't have really added anything.
Yep. Good point. NYC and Vegas are in everything, so that's just a plot device. It would be oddly specific to make an actual small town a location in something like this.
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tmurry
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by tmurry »

Had not seen this mentioned, but I reviewed the red room sequences while endeavoring to answer a Reddit thread and noticed that the Venus de Milo from the original red hallway was replaced with the Venus of Arles with the arms taken off. The Venus of Arles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus_of_Arles) IRL was found without arms (and missing neck segment and hip). It was restored to have arms and hold an apple in the left hand (the Venus de Milo hand had a similar apple which was original to the statue but not reattached) and a mirror in the right (not present on the Milo). In the episode, it is armless but the break on the left leaves more shoulder than the original statue had and the breaks are ragged.

The reasons for the switch could be many or none but I tend to read it as the Milo simply has no arms (you know my arms are the self creation of the ego schtick)(the Milo in a "naive" state). The Milan has the arms to cover the nakedness in self knowledge like Eve in the post fall (this is intentional in the statue). The Arles bore the fruit of knowledge of good and evil and a symbol of self knowledge/peering into the subconscious and these have been REMOVED. Milo = preconcious; Milan = conscious, selfhood; Arles = annihilation of the self (NON-EX-IS-TENCE).

Now, the actual Greek story of the start of the Trojan war should be interrogated, but the symbol as discord/beauty/the female reproductive capacity as the ultimate resource/treasure probably integrates here. Add a sprinkle of Coop facing various forms of Anima (3 coops, 3 Venuses) and we have stuff to mull over. Thoughts?
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wxray
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by wxray »

Mr. Reindeer wrote: Probably to create a mirror of Twin Peaks, Deer Meadow, etc. NYC and Vegas are unique cities, obviously chosen to evoke their well-known images. In the case of Buckhorn, they just wanted another small town where a murder happens. Using a real town name wouldn't have really added anything.
Right. Our international friends should also know that this area on the map (The Black Hills) has a few important touchpoints to American history.

1) Native American heritage (Hawk's Heritage). South Dakota has a large Native American population and was also the scene of various unpleasant episodes of USA government treatment of Native American Indians.

2) Missile Silos. All through that area are old Minuteman Missile sites. You know, Gordon's picture of the nuke bomb? Coincidence? I'm thinking no.
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Leebob
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Leebob »

tmurry wrote: The Arles bore the fruit of knowledge of good and evil and a symbol of self knowledge/peering into the subconscious and these have been REMOVED. Milo = preconcious; Milan = conscious, selfhood; Arles = annihilation of the self (NON-EX-IS-TENCE).

... Thoughts?
I have nothing to add other than to say thanks for the post - Fascinating information on the statuary in the red room...
Thanks tmurry.
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ikerno
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by ikerno »

StrangerDanger wrote:
ikerno wrote:The so criticized FX and animations are very artistic, very lynchian. Awesome.

... The Evolution of The Arm is what it is. A lynchian artistic creation to replace Anderson. I can`t understand his decision. Fucking money! It`s a huge loss.
I love how Lynch didn't try to be too clever with the CGI, it felt more like a professor drawing a diagram that is just good enough to explain a point.

As for TREE ... there's serious genius behind it, a lot is being said on the internet, e.g.
- TREE = Seedling on Julee Cruise's Voice of Love album
- LAURA said "Meanwhile ..... [tree sapling gesture]"
- TREE is electrified even though wood is considered an insulator, compare with Burning Bush, which burns even though it aint being consumed, it aint even dead (is it the doppelganger of Burning Bush?)
- TREE is like Forbidden Tree, with Serpent coiled around it, hence sibilant voice.

and so on.
I don`t understand your first sentence. Sorry. And about the Tree, I prefer to connect it with the style of CGI, and the gesture that Laura`s doppelganger did. I would be dissapointed if those religious references were correct (I "hate" religions).
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Jeziwa82
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Jeziwa82 »

Buckhorn Mountain, South Dakota, comes up when I do a search on google maps, and the area looks to be in somewhat proximity to where Buckhorn (fictional TPS3 town) is on the map in reference to the state lines.
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Jasper
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Jasper »

ikerno wrote:
StrangerDanger wrote:
ikerno wrote:The so criticized FX and animations are very artistic, very lynchian. Awesome.

... The Evolution of The Arm is what it is. A lynchian artistic creation to replace Anderson. I can`t understand his decision. Fucking money! It`s a huge loss.
I love how Lynch didn't try to be too clever with the CGI, it felt more like a professor drawing a diagram that is just good enough to explain a point.

As for TREE ... there's serious genius behind it, a lot is being said on the internet, e.g.
- TREE = Seedling on Julee Cruise's Voice of Love album
- LAURA said "Meanwhile ..... [tree sapling gesture]"
- TREE is electrified even though wood is considered an insulator, compare with Burning Bush, which burns even though it aint being consumed, it aint even dead (is it the doppelganger of Burning Bush?)
- TREE is like Forbidden Tree, with Serpent coiled around it, hence sibilant voice.

and so on.
I don`t understand your first sentence. Sorry. And about the Tree, I prefer to connect it with the style of CGI, and the gesture that Laura`s doppelganger did. I would be dissapointed if those religious references were correct (I "hate" religions).
Religion and mythology can be spoken of in cultural, metaphorical, allegorical, and overall symbolic terms without advocating or denigrating religious belief itself. For his part, Lynch clearly has an interest in certain spiritual traditions of India. Angels are featured prominently in FWWM, and to attempt to dance around this fact would be to absurdly hamstring any in-depth conversation and analysis of that film. The concept of garmonbozia is clearly inspired by soma/amrita, and related foods and drinks of the gods in Indo-European tradition (with the word itself resembling the Greek permutation of ambrosia). There are statues of Venus in the lodge.

In any case, this is not really the appropriate forum for you to air your grievances over religion. We're not including or excluding anyone based on religious criteria, and we should be respectful of everyone who posts here.

Religion and mythology have been discussed here a great many times in a neutral manner when they have been thought to relate to Lynch's work. [Example: http://www.dugpa.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2781]
Mario Stein
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by Mario Stein »

Hello, can someone please explain the timeline when Cooper appears in the cube and later young lovers die? When Dale sees the couch there is a pen and memory cards under the table (episode 2) while in episode 1 when the girl comes into the room we see there's empty under the table.
episode 1
episode 1
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episode 2
episode 2
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douglasb
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Re: RE: Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by douglasb »

Mario Stein wrote:Hello, can someone please explain the timeline...
Until we've seen the entire series? Probably not.
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ikerno
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Re: Parts 1 + 2 (SPOILERS)

Post by ikerno »

Jasper wrote:
ikerno wrote:
StrangerDanger wrote:
I love how Lynch didn't try to be too clever with the CGI, it felt more like a professor drawing a diagram that is just good enough to explain a point.

As for TREE ... there's serious genius behind it, a lot is being said on the internet, e.g.
- TREE = Seedling on Julee Cruise's Voice of Love album
- LAURA said "Meanwhile ..... [tree sapling gesture]"
- TREE is electrified even though wood is considered an insulator, compare with Burning Bush, which burns even though it aint being consumed, it aint even dead (is it the doppelganger of Burning Bush?)
- TREE is like Forbidden Tree, with Serpent coiled around it, hence sibilant voice.

and so on.
I don`t understand your first sentence. Sorry. And about the Tree, I prefer to connect it with the style of CGI, and the gesture that Laura`s doppelganger did. I would be dissapointed if those religious references were correct (I "hate" religions).
Religion and mythology can be spoken of in cultural, metaphorical, allegorical, and overall symbolic terms without advocating or denigrating religious belief itself. For his part, Lynch clearly has an interest in certain spiritual traditions of India. Angels are featured prominently in FWWM, and to attempt to dance around this fact would be to absurdly hamstring any in-depth conversation and analysis of that film. The concept of garmonbozia is clearly inspired by soma/amrita, and related foods and drinks of the gods in Indo-European tradition (with the word itself resembling the Greek permutation of ambrosia). There are statues of Venus in the lodge.

In any case, this is not really the appropriate forum for you to air your grievances over religion. We're not including or excluding anyone based on religious criteria, and we should be respectful of everyone who posts here.

Religion and mythology have been discussed here a great many times in a neutral manner when they have been thought to relate to Lynch's work. [Example: http://www.dugpa.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2781]
I think I don`t disrespect anybody here. I only said that I wouldn`t like those religious references because I don`t like religions. That is respectful freedom of spech, right? I don`t attacked anybody. If you feel offended, that is your problem.
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