Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

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Troubbble
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by Troubbble »

firefly2193 wrote:Phew! Only just caught up with the thread!

While it's certainly not confirmed BadCoop raped Diane, I do have an issue with most of the alternative theories that suggest Pre TP Dale and Diane had a relationship or anything of that sort. Firstly this suggests that normal (good) Dale would be so awful as to screw Diane over, which is not in keeping with Dale's character, and secondly for him to jilt her and then send her tapes from TP as if they were still very close would be so insensitive and again out of character.

There is also another thing people have written I personally find strange - the idea that if she'd met BadCoop before why was she so shocked to discover that he was 'not there' anymore - I don't know about you, but as a normal person if someone does something weird or abnormal or even soulless, my first assumption is not that they've been replaced by an evil doppelgänger of themselves from a netherworld. I know she's Coop's assistant but still. She may even have had her suspicions but seeing him up close and looking into his eyes confirmed it was not the good Dale (combined with what she'd heard on the plane). The repeated reference to 'that night' also suggests it was one dramatic night. I just fail to see how our Dale Cooper could've done something bad to Diane pre-TP and then send her tapes like nothing bad happened at all. That's not our Coop.
Agree 100%, and frankly, I'm surprised about all the wild speculation around the scenes with Diane. Thought they were pretty clear.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by indyit »

F*U*Tammy wrote:Hi everyone,

First post here as I only recently found this community. I'm really liking it, and I love reading all of your theories/comments.

I have a theory for Diane's saltiness, which I am very much enjoying because Laura Deen is an amazing actress. While I find the sexual assault theory to be plausible, for some reason my gut is telling me that isn't what happened. Diane is mad at Cooper and the FBI, but I think it's because she felt like they both turned their backs on her. Here's what I came up with:

1) Cooper - Diane and Cooper obviously had a close and, one would assume, warm relationship during the original series. Whether or not that relationship was romantic us unknown, but they were obviously at the very least good friends and confidants. Then Cooper essentially abandoned her after he emerged from the lodge as Bad Cooper. Imagine someone who you have basically devoted your life to just up and disappearing. Especially if that person also abandoned everything he previously stood for and believed in. That's going to make you worried, then confused, and then angry and bitter.

2) FBI - During the initial abandonment, I'm betting Diane was the one person who raised the alarm about Dopplecooper's out-of-character behavior. Knowing what we know about her, I have no doubt that she went straight to Gordon and told him something was wrong. For whatever reason (maybe they couldn't find him, or maybe Dopplecooper sent in a resignation letter), I think Cole brushed her off. This would explain why she's so angry that they have come back begging for her help. They didn't want to listen to her when she begged them for help, but they ended up realizing she was right and she was (rightfully IMO) pissed about it.

A few othet supporting theories I have:

A) Dopplecooper somehow stole Cooper's conscious memories when he exited the lodge. This explains how he was able to recognize everyone and correctly answer Diane's question about the last time they saw each other. The real Cooper was able to retain only rudimentary/deeply rooted information about his life. He only sees flashes of things that seem familiar without being able to put them in context. It's like seeing someone vaguely familiar without being able to remember where/when you've seen them before.

B) It's possible Cooper and Diane had a romantic moment that they planned to explore after the conclusion of the Twin Peaks case. Or mayb she was in love with him, but he was too much of a professional to let anything happen with a coworker. Then she starts getting tapes about Annie, and (Dopple)Cooper ghosts her. Again, I can see why she would be angry/bitter.

C) Gordon was scared to see Diane alone. He knew he was wrong when he ignored her requests for help, and he knew she held him responsible for her emotional pain. That's why he tried to get Albert to get her to help.

D) At some point, Gordon realized his folly in not listening to Diane. They tried to find Cooper, leading to the one and only photo of Dopplecooper in Rio. Once Dopplecooper realized they were looking for him, he went underground.

E) This one's a stretch. What if Gordon and Diane had an earlier marriage? This would explain her hug and his awkwardness in returning it.

So that's it. Sorry for the long post! I've been thinking about this for a long time, and I guess I had a lot to say. :lol:
All very good ideas. I had a similar feeling that 2 happened, and is why she's mad at the FBI. It's hard to read that scene between them in the interrogation room whether the last time they met is alluding to a time she met DoppelCoop or normal Coop. I'm thinking the latter at the moment (as do you) but her distraught could suggest the former. Her line of questioning felt like her sizing him up for a second time - possibly building on her experiences from meeting him the first time, when she wasn't suspicious.

Just a random note - that interrogation room is so funny looking, very much a Lynch thing. Why are there so many knobs? It's nearly like a recording studio, you surely don't need that level of tech to simply record an interrogation.

A) I think that's the case, I think Doppels get memories, or "watch" their originals from the Lodge. That's severed once they're out.

B) I haven't read it, but MLMT apparently suggests a night between them.

C) & D) Yes all makes sense, I definitely thought Gordon was afraid to see Diane, especially when he flaked and drank Bordeaux instead.

E) Don't think so, I did think at first maybe she had a history with Albert, but I don't think that either after seeing this episode.
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MoondogJR
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by MoondogJR »

Wait a minute. There's a two week hiatus after this week's part? :shock:
Why?
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by Hockey Mask »

No new episode due to July 4th holiday in the U.S.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by beyondthesea »

I was looking at the wikipedia pages for MIKE and Bob last night. It reminded me that when they worked together that they raped and murdered their victims. Just something else that adds weight to the theory that Diane may have been raped.

I'm still wondering if when whatever did happen with Bad Cooper happened, whether or not she saw bob, just like Laura did when Bob/Leland was raping her. Or if Bob raped Diane and Cooper revealed himself at some point during the ordeal. Rape seems the likely 'ordeal', but I suppose it could be any ordeal.

Also, for those who wonder why she might have kept quiet about it, if indeed she did, the fact that she might have seen bob or cooper change into the other, might have given her further cause to think that no one would believe her story.
Last edited by beyondthesea on Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by OrsonWelles »

Here Comes That Bob wrote:- I'm very curious about the entity which walked behind Lieutenant Knox when she was on the phone. I think its the same spooky guy who appeared at the jail cell in PART 1/2. Possible lodge inhabitor ?

- Also did anyone entertain the possibility that Dougie's assassination attempt ending up on the news will be the way for Cole and the FBI to locate and meet with him ? Now that Dougie's fingerprints are all over the crime scene, they could easily compare it to the ones of Cooper and confirm his real identity.
Well, someone posted a picture of the two spooky guys. They seem to be different. This one gives more credence to it being the Log Lady's husband, but don't know why he would appear in Buckhorn, SD.

As for the second one. That is indeed a possibility, along with Dougie Cooper appearing on national news and Cole/Albert/Twin Peaks-residents seeing him on TV (I'd actually prefer that option)
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by Rodigy »

Good episode, but not my favourite.
My favourite parts were the scenes with Mr C and the Ike the Spike attack on Cooper, especially with the arm shouting "squeeze his hand off!"

11 more to go...
Last edited by Rodigy on Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:08 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by douglasb »

Why would a minor scuffle make national news? Lifting prints from the gun and running them against a database makes sense though.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by OrsonWelles »

douglasb wrote:Why would a minor scuffle make national news? Lifting prints from the gun and running them against a database makes sense though.
Well, watching the news/the internet anno 2017, I'd say it's quite plausible that trivial heroism would get that kind of attention.
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beyondthesea
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by beyondthesea »

OrsonWelles wrote:
douglasb wrote:Why would a minor scuffle make national news? Lifting prints from the gun and running them against a database makes sense though.
Well, watching the news/the internet anno 2017, I'd say it's quite plausible that trivial heroism would get that kind of attention.

It make major news if they manage to connect that murder attempt to the other murder that Ike committed, maybe.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by dronerstone »

beyondthesea wrote:
OrsonWelles wrote:
douglasb wrote:Why would a minor scuffle make national news? Lifting prints from the gun and running them against a database makes sense though.
Well, watching the news/the internet anno 2017, I'd say it's quite plausible that trivial heroism would get that kind of attention.

It make major news if they manage to connect that murder attempt to the other murder that Ike committed, maybe.
hmmm...

i guess he killed all witnesses for the office murders

and the murder attempt weapon is different this time.

his height could be an indicator though...
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by DeepBlueSeed »

Was it definitely on the news? Just considering the fact that 'Dougie' and Janie-E are just talking to cops and, although the witnesses are filmed as if for a news report, I wonder whether it's just a style thing, that they're just being questioned by the cops.

Either way, if they are filmed, it doesn't appear that 'Dougie' and Janie-E were, in which case it'll be difficult to make a connection that way. Coop's finger prints on the gun though, that'd likely get the FBI's attention.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by Here Comes That Bob »

dronerstone wrote:
beyondthesea wrote:
OrsonWelles wrote:
Well, watching the news/the internet anno 2017, I'd say it's quite plausible that trivial heroism would get that kind of attention.

It make major news if they manage to connect that murder attempt to the other murder that Ike committed, maybe.
hmmm...

i guess he killed all witnesses for the office murders

and the murder attempt weapon is different this time.

his height could be an indicator though...
What about security cameras ? They must have recorded Ike's killing spree, of course if he didn't disable them or took care of the footage.
Last edited by Here Comes That Bob on Fri Jun 23, 2017 4:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by dronerstone »

Here Comes That Bob wrote:
dronerstone wrote:
beyondthesea wrote:

It make major news if they manage to connect that murder attempt to the other murder that Ike committed, maybe.
hmmm...

i guess he killed all witnesses for the office murders

and the murder attempt weapon is different this time.

his height could be an indicator though...
What about security cameras ? They must have recoreded Ike's killing spree, of course if he didn't disable them or took care of the footage.
of course! didnt think of that.
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Re: Part 7 - There's a body all right (SPOILERS)

Post by eyeboogers »

DeepBlueSeed wrote:Was it definitely on the news? Just considering the fact that 'Dougie' and Janie-E are just talking to cops and, although the witnesses are filmed as if for a news report, I wonder whether it's just a style thing, that they're just being questioned by the cops.

Either way, if they are filmed, it doesn't appear that 'Dougie' and Janie-E were, in which case it'll be difficult to make a connection that way. Coop's finger prints on the gun though, that'd likely get the FBI's attention.
Watch the scene again, the TV crew footage starts with them interviewing Janie-E and Dougie.
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