Part 8 - Gotta light? (SPOILERS)

[HagbardCeline]

Actually, Hawk DID talk to Truman about Cooper emerging from the Black Lodge. He maybe didn't mention the name of the grove specifically.

I still don't think the series is playing around with time as much (or at all) as so many people on here seem to desperately want it to be. I think the two actual shifts in time were explicitly told to us because they put on the screen what years it was. Otherwise, absolutely nothing indicates to me that Cooper/Giant has to be in the past (looks to me like it's black and white in the White Lodge all the time) or that Hawk was in the future. The Log Lady called Hawk right before he reached the grove. Was that a call from the future? No!

In that conversation he was referring to Cooper emerging in Episode 29. I mean, did you see Cooper come out of the curtains in S3E1? That scene is definitely out of order. It may even be the last scene of the series.

[oxyboldine]

Actually, Hawk DID talk to Truman about Cooper emerging from the Black Lodge. He maybe didn't mention the name of the grove specifically.

I still don't think the series is playing around with time as much (or at all) as so many people on here seem to desperately want it to be. I think the two actual shifts in time were explicitly told to us because they put on the screen what years it was. Otherwise, absolutely nothing indicates to me that Cooper/Giant has to be in the past (looks to me like it's black and white in the White Lodge all the time) or that Hawk was in the future. The Log Lady called Hawk right before he reached the grove. Was that a call from the future? No!

In that conversation he was referring to Cooper emerging in Episode 29. I mean, did you see Cooper come out of the curtains in S3E1? That scene is definitely out of order. It may even be the last scene of the series.

In episode 7, we see the woods once again, at night, filmed from the sky. Then, it suddenly cuts to the Double R. In episode 1, Hawk is at Glastonbury grove but he never mentions it nor goes to take tea with Margaret.

I think that this establishing shot in episode 7 tells us that Hawk is in the woods, at Glastonbury Grove, at this moment. The episode 1 shows it, but as a "flash-forward" ; it happens in episode 7. Which is more logical :

- Hawk gets a phone call from Margaret, she tells that something is missing (episode 1)
- Hawks talks about it to Andy and Lucy (episode 1), to Truman and the others (episode 4), and then finds the pages from Laura about the Black Lodge (episode 6-7)
- As he understands that "The Good Dale is in the Black Lodge", THEN he goes to Glastonbury Grove : episode 7... and episode 9 ?

[DeepBlueSeed]

Wasn't the firing pin just taken from the gun, rather than something supernatural? (I don't know anything about guns so unsure if that would be possible with that particular model -- mind you I don't think you can get rid of bugs in the same manner that DopelCoop did! LOL!).

I honestly don't know much about guns. Is the firing pin the thing that makes the gun click when it's empty?

[DeepBlueSeed]

Also, some have mentioned about the "Good your still with me" quote while BadCoop was in prision. Checking the mirror he saw a faint reflection of Bob. Remember Bob feeds on Garmonbozia. BadCoop vomited quite a bit of Garmonbozia in the car accident so I would imagine that Bob is very weak without his creamed corn.

Good point! I'd been assuming that BOB didn't appear in the mirror in the same as he had previously just become more submerged into BadCoop's identity, but just being weak works too. Although I got the impression that holding his Garmonbozia in as long as he could kept him in the world rather than Dougie, the eventual loss of his lunch probably had unexpected side effects.

[dontlooknow]

I honestly don't know much about guns. Is the firing pin the thing that makes the gun click when it's empty?

yes, afaik. or rather: the mechanism hitting something inside the gun (instead of hitting the primer in the bullet).

the easiest way to sabotage a gun so that it looks loaded and ready but isnt, would be loading it with inert bullets. although that would make a different (more dull) sound: the firing pin or striker would hit the back of the inert bullet without causing the explosion and subsequent burning of the propellant.

but i dont think the soundman thought about that when he put in the clicking sounds as badcoop tries to fire the revolver

btw it's interesting that badcoop doesnt request more ammunition from the warden. six bullets are more than enough for him it seems

[DeepBlueSeed]

Is Obvious that the series is playing with time! the first scene of gigant and cooper probably is a scene of the past!! ( black and White), the scene where Hawk is walking by the forest very probably is of the future! Is very strange that Hawk didn´t say anything of glanstonbury grove in the chapters of after.

Are mixing the future and past in the series. i don´t know if there are alternate timelines on the series or if will have in the future, but the time and their possible distorsions are beeing very important in the series.

How you can see, to Lynch and Frost like play with time. i wouldn´t be so radical in this Topic.

Actually, Hawk DID talk to Truman about Cooper emerging from the Black Lodge. He maybe didn't mention the name of the grove specifically.

I still don't think the series is playing around with time as much (or at all) as so many people on here seem to desperately want it to be. I think the two actual shifts in time were explicitly told to us because they put on the screen what years it was. Otherwise, absolutely nothing indicates to me that Cooper/Giant has to be in the past (looks to me like it's black and white in the White Lodge all the time) or that Hawk was in the future. The Log Lady called Hawk right before he reached the grove. Was that a call from the future? No!

I tend to agree. There may be little bits out of synch (so that we see Cooper appear in the glass box after we've already seen 'Mother' break out of it), but I assume those are to keep the relevant scenes fluid and uninterrupted. Also time does seem a little more flexible in the Lodge.

[sewhite2000]

Oh my gosh, all you people who think Hawk at Glastonbury Grove is a flash-forward, you are WRONG.

I don't know why this theory is so popular. I have to have read 50 different people say this on this website. And everybody says the exact same thing: he didn't mention it to anybody! So it's a flash forward! What? I don't get it! That is a logic jump I don't see. A billion things have happened in this show that no character refers to another character later. The show is too fast-moving for a lot of follow-up scenes to have many (or any) follow-up scenes to recap action. Maybe Hawk mentioned to it other characters off camera. That is incredibly tiny flimsy evidence for everyone to automatically assume a time-jump has been witnessed.

When the show is over, and this is not revealed to be a time-jump, all of you can let me know I was right and you were wrong.

[james.mooney.]

So why did Dopplecooper try to shoot Ray when he had not yet gotten the "coordinates" (that Ray got from Hastings' secretary) from him?

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[dontlooknow]

do we have theories yet on how dougies wedding ring ended up inside briggs' stomach?

So why did Dopplecooper try to shoot Ray when he had not yet gotten the "coordinates" (that Ray got from Hastings' secretary) from him?

he didnt need them, just wanted them?

nah, he began firing only when he saw ray's gun iirc.

[DeepBlueSeed]

I honestly don't know much about guns. Is the firing pin the thing that makes the gun click when it's empty?

yes, afaik. or rather: the mechanism hitting something inside the gun (instead of hitting the primer in the bullet).

the easiest way to sabotage a gun so that it looks loaded and ready but isnt, would be loading it with inert bullets. although that would make a different (more dull) sound: the firing pin or striker would hit the back of the inert bullet without causing the explosion and subsequent burning of the propellant.

but i dont think the soundman thought about that when he put in the clicking sounds as badcoop tries to fire the revolver

btw it's interesting that badcoop doesnt request more ammunition from the warden. six bullets are more than enough for him it seems

Interesting that he needed a gun when he could've just given Ray a face massage.

I would be genuinely interested to learn if the clicking of the gun is an error, or deliberate. Much like the scene in the diner, with its either deliberate or accidental continuity error. Of course, we may never get these answers.

[DeepBlueSeed]

So why did Dopplecooper try to shoot Ray when he had not yet gotten the "coordinates" (that Ray got from Hastings' secretary) from him?

It doesn't make a lot of sense, but maybe he has weird Lodge powers that draw secrets out of dead people. Or maybe the gun was going to be used first as a threat, then a torture device, rather than going for a all-out kill shot.

[mujubuju]

Oh my gosh, all you people who think Hawk at Glastonbury Grove is a flash-forward, you are WRONG.

I don't know why this theory is so popular. I have to have read 50 different people say this on this website. And everybody says the exact same thing: he didn't mention it to anybody! So it's a flash forward! What? I don't get it! That is a logic jump I don't see. A billion things have happened in this show that no character refers to another character later. The show is too fast-moving for a lot of follow-up scenes to have many (or any) follow-up scenes to recap action. Maybe Hawk mentioned to it other characters off camera. That is incredibly tiny flimsy evidence for everyone to automatically assume a time-jump has been witnessed.

When the show is over, and this is not revealed to be a time-jump, all of you can let me know I was right and you were wrong.

Or we can just tell you now to take a deep breath and relax.

[wxray]

"The Farm". Evil Cooper speaks weird. I saw it as nothing more. His favorite band is undoubtedly "The NIN."

[zeronumber]

Could the Young Girl from '56 be the "American" Girl in the Room on the purple ocean world?

( f ~ tammy)

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[pixletwin]

About the flash forward theory... forgive me if it's already been brought up but the man from the insurance agency who wants to speak to Sheriff Truman in episode one only makes sense if it's a flash forward... or it was just a device to let us know there are two sherif Trumans...

*shrugs*