Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Discussion of each of the 18 parts of Twin Peaks the Return

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freeek
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by freeek »

Jesus, I'm amazed at some people's incapacity to connect the dots. It's all layed down before your eyes, people.

Twin Peaks : The Return is NOT the continuation of the original Twin Peaks. Lynch's intention is to tell a whole other story. The main theme is the desintegration of the word. The whole world has become a "dark, dark place" (Jane-E Leigh) and even the most charming place from the past, the town of Twin Peaks, is poisoned by this overwhelming darkness ("Something is missing", warned the Log Lady in the first ep. What is missing ? TP's spirit and soul, I guess).

TP has now become a place where ruthless white trashes shoot people with a rifle, then go get a bite at Wendy's like nothing happened.

TP is now a place where the children suffer never ending, agonizing pains : they see their dad getting shot right before their eyes, they are being run over by cars, they get so diseased they act like vomiting zombies, etc.

TP was a town where Ben Horn was able to enjoy the simplest pleasures in life (a bike given by his daddy) when he was younger, and now it's a place where his own grand son commit the most horrifying crimes to sustain his life as a piece of shit dealer.

TP is now a place where girlfriends meeting at the Roadhouse can only talk about their drug habits (Sky Ferrara) or people getting out of jail, like in this ep.

Maybe the Dougie arc is supposed to show how a fragile glimpse of hope is able (or not) to reenter such a bleak, desperate world.
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BigEd
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by BigEd »

AudreyHorne wrote:
Maybe this is a bit far-fetched, as there are a lot of rooms with wood paneling in Twin Peaks, but a few people here thought that something was definitely not right in this scene. Some suggested she might still be in a coma or in a mental institution. What if she is trapped in the Lodge, convenience store and/or room from Laura's picture? I know, the convenience store and room on Laura's picture look very run-down and empty, but it could be that Audrey's scene was happening in her mind and she made it look more like a real life room. As I said, it's far-fetched and I'm probably wrong, but I would find that more interesting than Audrey just being married to some guy she doesn't like and it would explain why no one mentioned her in connection to Richard, when she is the most likely candidate for being his mother.
Great post. Thanks! I've seen a theory floating around that equates "convenience store" with one's conscious mind, and "above a convenience store" with one's sub-conscious mind. If Audrey is now "upstairs," she may very well be trapped in a coma. That "little man" she has invented to provide her support and companionship is unfortunately too busy with piles and piles of paperwork to do anything for her or with her.

btw: was Sarah shopping in a grocery store or a convenience store?
LateReg
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by LateReg »

firefly2193 wrote:
I think a lot of the frustration from people here is due to how we know TPTR was designed - there may have been filler in the original Twin Peaks, but that was a show filmed episode by episode, with different writers almost every episode, the Lynch and Frost often disappearing from the show completely for sustained periods. This was show carefully scripted way in advance, written as a movie by just two people, and directed by one person. My only thought is that stuff like this is the result of the extension from 9 parts to 18, or some something as a result of the editing.
I still don't get the whole speculation about the "extension from 9 parts to 18" thing going on here. We don't know exactly what happened, but we do know that Lynch has complete control. By that logic, he wanted it to be 18 hours, or thereabouts. Maybe The Return would have been tighter or even better if it were the originally announced 9 parts, but in Lynch's head it seems that it was always 18 parts. I'm just saying: We shouldn't blame the "filler" on the fact that it is 18 hours instead of 9. It was always supposed to be the way it is now, Lynch didn't add in stuff just to fill time because the episode count suddenly doubled. Sure, if Showtime would have restricted him to only 9 hours, then this would be a different beast entirely, and in that sense the 18 hours enables Lynch to linger longer than some would like. But every time someone comments in the negative about the doubling of the runtime, it seems to insinuate that Lynch isn't doing this the way that HE thinks is best, which I think is certainly false.
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BigEd
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by BigEd »

Nighthawk wrote:Can anybody identify what this is?

Image
It would help if you told us where it appeared in the episode and also provide broader photo context.
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by BigEd »

Jonah wrote:
I think when we all heard Lynch was directing it all it sounded too good to be true. We expected a full season filled with episodes like Episode 14 and Episode 29. But instead we're mostly getting the weaker parts of "Mulholland Drive", in my opinion.
Weak parts of Mulholland Drive?? Now that's just crazy talk! :lol:
LateReg
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by LateReg »

BigEd wrote:
Nighthawk wrote:Can anybody identify what this is?

Image
It would help if you told us where it appeared in the episode and also provide broader photo context.
Is that what was on Diane's nail?
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Deep Thought
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by Deep Thought »

AudreyHorne wrote:
aldiboronti wrote:I really think that the title Let's Rock is the reason that so many are disappointed with this episode. It suggested that we would be seeing more Black Lodge activity and when we didn't people became angry, some of them very angry. I can understand that. A week is a long time to anticipate an episode, to imagine all sorts of stuff that will be in it. When our expectations are crushed we of course blame the director.
I don't think that's the reason. Most people here loved the first half of the episode but were disappointed with the second half. If people hated the episode for the missing Black Lodge scenes, why didn't they hate the entire episode?


I rewatched Audrey's scene and here are some of the things I noticed.

This is the room Audrey and Charlie are in:
Image

The wood paneling and white wall reminded me of the wall behind the stairs in the woodsman scene of Part 11:
Image

And the doors behind Charlie have the same style as the door in Laura's picture:
Image

The room that Audrey and Charlie are in is upstairs, you can see a stair-rail behind a curtain to the left of the bookshelf:
Image

Maybe this is a bit far-fetched, as there are a lot of rooms with wood paneling in Twin Peaks, but a few people here thought that something was definitely not right in this scene. Some suggested she might still be in a coma or in a mental institution. What if she is trapped in the Lodge, convenience store and/or room from Laura's picture? I know, the convenience store and room on Laura's picture look very run-down and empty, but it could be that Audrey's scene was happening in her mind and she made it look more like a real life room. As I said, it's far-fetched and I'm probably wrong, but I would find that more interesting than Audrey just being married to some guy she doesn't like and it would explain why no one mentioned her in connection to Richard, when she is the most likely candidate for being his mother.

A few other things I noticed:

- On the mantelpiece behind Audrey I spotted the books Happy Times and T.S. Eliot's Four Quartets, which (according to wikipedia) consists of four poems that are "interlinked meditations with the common theme being man's relationship with time, the universe, and the divine". One of the poems is about "the unity of past, present, and future", another poem describes life as "travelling in a boat" (there was a picture of a boat on the wall behind Charlie). The title Happy Times is very ironic, considering Audrey's life didn't seem very happy in this scene. I don't know the book, but apparently one of the characters is a blind stepdaughter, which made me think of Naido, the woman in the Purple Room. Maybe someone here has read Four Quartets or Happy Times and can tell us if there are any parallels to Audrey's situation or the series in general?

- Audrey tells Charlie he should talk to his crystal ball, to which he replies he doesn't have a crystal ball, but there is something that looks very much like a crystal ball on his desk.

- Audrey says that Billy's been missing for two days. When Audrey was trapped in One Eyed Jacks in Season 2, Ben told Hary: "Audrey’s missing ... For as much as maybe two days. "
Great post. I'm a proponent of the Audrey in the lodge theory, and your observations really back it up. The paneling/door is a dead giveaway, imo. Love the TS Eliot connection too. I knew I didn't need to freeze frame that bookshelf myself. Good work!
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Deep Thought
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by Deep Thought »

BigEd wrote:I've seen a theory floating around that equates "convenience store" with one's conscious mind, and "above a convenience store" with one's sub-conscious mind. If Audrey is now "upstairs," she may very well be trapped in a coma.
I floated that theory here. That interpretation was first presented by Martha P. Nochimson in her excellent 1997 book "The Passion of David Lynch: Wild at Heart in Hollywood." Quite persuasive.

Ha ha, I think BigEd you would like another theory in that book about why the giant fold his hands over his crotch, at least I think that was you that shot that idea down a while back. Forgive me if I'm wrong. 8)
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BigEd
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by BigEd »

Is the little man at the desk blocking access to the only exit doors? Will she only be able to leave the room when he gets through all that paperwork? Nobody puts their desk right up against the doors, or with the person at the desk not facing the doors.
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Ragnell
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by Ragnell »

So I rewatched before posting because I thought maybe the second half would work better after a rewatch. First viewing I disliked Dr. Amp and the Audrey scene, though I did like the idea maybe Audrey being married and having a side guy too increased the chances she had children OTHER than Richard, which is a comforting idea, and there was something amusing with Charlie. On the rewatch Audrey's scene was better. (Still not a big Dr Amp fan.) The weirdness sticks out more. Something odd is definitely up with the Hornes and Audrey. Maybe there's some memory or reality changing going on, maybe she's in a coma or in the Lodge but... the only person to mention Audrey so far is a character who retired to Middlebury. Everyone in town seems to never mention her... and why didn't she just leave the house without Charlie? And why does her verbal abuse just not hurt him at all?

It definitely reminded me of Doris, but just Doris. Janey-E defaults to gentleness after her bursts of frustrated anger elicit only a childlike response that reminds her of her husband's vulnerability and she uses that rage to protect him from inquisitive police officers and loan sharks. Sylvia complains to a man who complains back. Doris is the only other wife in here that berates a husband who never takes the bait and further frustrates her with his calm.

In Part 6 we found out Doris was yelling not to CAUSE pain but to express her own genuine agony. We find that out the same episode we learn that Janey-E can channel her aggression to defend her family from the rest of the world rather than just turning it on them. And that's the ep we first see the complex, caustic Diane. A turning point for women in the series, that part ends with the Doris revelation as a way to underscore that in this series, these "nagging wives" aren't just wet blankets or cruel harpies, they are people with their own internal lives expressing genuine pain. That was the whole point of Doris. (Notice we haven't seen her since), to put that into our heads for when we see these characters. A punctuation for an ep that hinged on a mother losing her child.

I remain convinced Audrey is Richard's mother. I am sure something strange is going on with that family. And I am sure Audrey's complaints are a symptom of the deep pain that's shaping her relationship with the other Hornes.
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Troubbble
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by Troubbble »

33 pages of the same shortsighted whining. Will we ever get tired of making the same complaints endlessly?

There was perhaps a little too much teasing in Part 12, and I completely understand finding it difficult to be patient right now...but some of the reactions here are just ridiculous.
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Framed_Angel
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by Framed_Angel »

The contrast between Part 12's opening scene with Albert and near-closing scene with Audrey & Charlie now has wheels turning in me brain.

Didn't the manner in which Albert shared the Blue Rose invitation and information with Tammy seem unusual? Business gatherings might sometimes be casual and spur-of-moment; but for top secret details I'd expect a more "on official business" grouping at a conference table.
Instead, it was framed, delivered and laid into by a straight-faced Albert between cuts to Tammy's expression of astonishment (even as we the audience could've figured Yeah, she'll become a Blue Rose investigator, why not) -- and it had a very intimate feel, over a bottle of wine, and less austere furnishings than most business suites. The three of them clinking wine glasses between Albert's pronouncements. The same feeling as if he were proposing to someone.

Fast-forward to Audrey, almost posed in position like her feet are glued to the floor; before the library fireplace or mantelpiece, as if the scene were in medias res. Here, it's a married couple as one of them says outright -- but intimacy, affection and good cheer are completely filled in with sarcasm, resentment and mutual hostility. Audrey flat-out brags she is "f*cking" Billy, yet Charlie saves his real "shocked face" for when she suggests with the papers she'd given him earlier she 'was willing to renege on their contract.'
And the upshot at the scene's closer is Charlie *withholding* information from Audrey, the opposite of Albert earlier providing Tammy with new info.

I just thought it was an interesting contrast. Carry on~
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BigEd
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by BigEd »

Troubbble wrote:33 pages of the same shortsighted whining. Will we ever get tired of making the same complaints endlessly?
Sounds like more whining! :lol:

Actually, on a pro-rata basis, I don't think the whining comprises more than 20 - 25 of the pages. :D
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Deep Thought
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by Deep Thought »

Troubbble wrote:33 pages of the same shortsighted whining. Will we ever get tired of making the same complaints endlessly?

There was perhaps a little too much teasing in Part 12, and I completely understand finding it difficult to be patient right now...but some of the reactions here are just ridiculous.
Yeah, but if you wade through the weeds there are some good and interesting posts in this thread.
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Re: Part 12 - Let's rock (SPOILERS)

Post by Ragnell »

Deep Thought wrote:Diane saying "Let's Rock" seems to me a reference to Chet Desmond's disappearance. As in the character was referencing what was later found on the car windshield at the last place Desmond was seen.
I've been an adherent of the Possessed Diane theory since Part 9 and now I believe even more strongly. It's just now I think she's hosting MIKE.
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