Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

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Walterodim
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Walterodim » Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:22 am

Nighthawk wrote:Hopefully this makes things visible enough and in the context of the whole frame:

Image


No I can't see it here. On Reddit it is very clear. It says spoiler, but don't worry, all you see is the scene with Big Ed's reflection. On first watch on my laptop I couldn't see it either. It is very sensitive with the colouring
Metamorphia
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Metamorphia » Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:55 am

cgs027 wrote:
Elric99 wrote:It's easier to see the glitchyness of it in this animated and brightened gif. Ignore the blocky compression artifacts and see how Ed's reflection abruptly jumps between different postures.

Image


And I STILL barely see that, looks like a tiny editing glitch to me (and not one that they thought people would go crazy over).


But I don't see how this could be any kind of "editing glitch" - the only way for this to happen is to cut out and recomposite the reflection from another scene and place it in.

It may turn out to not be very important and just be a little easter egg (for lack of better word), but it's definitely intentional.
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby douglasb » Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:01 am

I think if the notion of reality being out of sync is being suggested it could have been done in a slightly less esoteric way. The diner scene does it, the CCTV in FWWM does it but if you need a professionally calibrated TV screen to see some clues, that's asking a lot of the audience.
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Hockey Mask
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Hockey Mask » Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:25 am

This is just editing to adjust timing of cars. Nothing more.
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alek2702
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby alek2702 » Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:47 am

Hockey Mask wrote:This is just editing to adjust timing of cars. Nothing more.

Exactly, they just edited part of the frame, happens often these days.
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Nighthawk
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Nighthawk » Sat Aug 12, 2017 5:41 am

Walterodim wrote:
No I can't see it here. On Reddit it is very clear. It says spoiler, but don't worry, all you see is the scene with Big Ed's reflection. On first watch on my laptop I couldn't see it either. It is very sensitive with the colouring


It was very clear on my run of the mill 46 inch TV, and it's the same on my mid-range laptop. That being said, a number of people mentioned that they couldn't see Bob's face in the orb extracted out of Doppel Coop so perhaps their devices' brightness/contrast settings are all out of whack. Ed's reflection should be clearly visible, and if you can see it, you can see "the glitch" as well.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Sat Aug 12, 2017 5:53 am

Nighthawk wrote:
Walterodim wrote:
No I can't see it here. On Reddit it is very clear. It says spoiler, but don't worry, all you see is the scene with Big Ed's reflection. On first watch on my laptop I couldn't see it either. It is very sensitive with the colouring


It was very clear on my run of the mill 46 inch TV, and it's the same on my mid-range laptop. That being said, a number of people mentioned that they couldn't see Bob's face in the orb extracted out of Doppel Coop so perhaps their devices' brightness/contrast settings are all out of whack. Ed's reflection should be clearly visible, and if you can see it, you can see "the glitch" as well.


The Bob orb and Ed reflection are also murky/indiscernible on my TV (and the nighttime drone shot of the woods which someone -- mtsi? -- claims is CGI) is almost pure black. The thing is, my TV is calibrated to the brightness settings DKL put on the Eraserhead Blu Ray.

Caveat: my TV is eleven years old, so I guess maybe some of the contrast is going? It seems a shame to junk a perfectly functional piece of hardware just to see a few VERY dark shots. (We are not wealthy people! We drive cheap terrible cars!)
whoisalhedges
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby whoisalhedges » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:20 am

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
whoisalhedges wrote:Annie is the big one. She is the REASON Coop went into the Lodge to begin with. Frost knew damn well she won the pageant. I'd entertain the thought of retconning, but... Part 7, there's Annie. So, she is in fact NOT being erased from TP history... just the book. There's a reason. I don't know what it is, but THAT is intentional.


The "Lana winning the pageant" thing wasn't even in the book, though. It's just something he said at signings.

I'll be damned....

Could have sworn it was in the book. So much so that I flipped to the two Lana parts (one on the Milford courtship, the other posthumous, a page or two apart), set to prove you wrong with page number citations... but you're right. :lol:

Thing is, I didn't really pay that much attn. to the pre-series hype. I was out of work for two years. I was poor - very poor - when Lynch & Frost sent their tweets; and TBH I didn't know if I'd ever be able to see something I'd been waiting over half my life for. By the time this year came around, I'd been gainfully employed for several months, had cable, realized I would be able to watch... got the book and awaited the premier. But before then, I didn't want to tease myself....

Anyway, without reading the interviews, why did I assume it was in the book? I noticed Annie was written out of the story, and MF did mention Lana and the MTP pageant (but just her "contortionistic jazz exotica"), I suppose my brain just added it in there.

Honestly, it seems to me they're intentionally playing that tendency of ours. Take The Experiment. Probably 90% of people here, on Reddit, on Facebook, on YouTube, are calling it "Mother." But it is only referred to as "Experiment" in the credits (the actor is credited as Experiment Model in Part 1, but I think - again with the assumptions - is that there's a lot of CGI in that appearance, and she "modeled" her body for the general form in motion-capture; but was actually photographed in Part 8 ). At no point in the dialog (it's not even referenced in the dialog; Albert & Cole might know what killed Sam & Tracey, but they ain't talking) or in the credits is it referred to as "Mother." So why do people use that word?

American Girl says "my mother is coming" in Part 3. She says it as a warning, as there are loud, menacing, banging sounds outside. Moments later, Coop passes through the glass box, and The Experiment follows. Five parts later, in the aftermath of the Trinity test, we see it again; and this time it's barfing up a bunch of eggs and a PokéBOB. Well, now it's certainly a "mother," in that it "gave birth to" a bunch of eggs, at least one of which contained a gestating frogbug, and another Killer BOB. So, people's brains seem to make that connection. It didn't stick around to raise anything, showed no maternal behavior - so I'm guessing the biggest reason is its appearance subsequent to Phoebe Augustine saying "my mother is coming." In any case, though, there's absolutely nothing in the text to suggest that we should call it anything but Experiment. It might be what American Girl is talking about. I'd allow that it *most likely* is what she's talking about. But it is not *by necessity* what she is talking about; and yet the vast majority of people discussing Twin Peaks online call it "Mother."

It's how brains work. Just like how, in the absence of the Miss Twin Peaks winner, I went ahead and gave Annie's crown to her runner-up, even without reading anything about Frost's book tour.

Edited to change 8) to 8 because phpBB.
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Nighthawk
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Nighthawk » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:34 am

whoisalhedges wrote:Honestly, it seems to me they're intentionally playing that tendency of ours. Take The Experiment. Probably 90% of people here, on Reddit, on Facebook, on YouTube, are calling it "Mother." But it is only referred to as "Experiment" in the credits (the actor is credited as Experiment Model in Part 1, but I think - again with the assumptions - is that there's a lot of CGI in that appearance, and she "modeled" her body for the general form in motion-capture; but was actually photographed in Part 8 ). At no point in the dialog (it's not even referenced in the dialog; Albert & Cole might know what killed Sam & Tracey, but they ain't talking) or in the credits is it referred to as "Mother." So why do people use that word?


I think one reason for that, aside from deducing the connection you mentioned (experiment giving birth to Bob and other unknown entities), it bears a resemblance to the archetypal fertility goddess present in many ancient cultures.

You can look at this one as an example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venus_of_Willendorf
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Saturn's child
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Saturn's child » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:46 am

referendum wrote:The thing is, with a show like twin peaks (or alot of music or art or books), it doesn't really matter whether x or y theory is right or wrong [...] What the artist/ film-maker/ composer/ author intended might not be what some people take from it. Some people might even find things and make connections which the artist ( etc ) did not think of themselves. So to me, talking about ' right ' and ' wrong' , and insisting on one ' true ' reading that excludes other readings, is, as you put it ' missing the point' :)


For what it's worth, with regard to the Big Ed scene, I feel this & referendum's follow-up post reflect my feelings. The world of Twin Peaks is wide & can hold many meanings. If people want to see Ed's demonic reflection gobbling garmonbozia, power to them, especially if their viewing experience is richer for it. If the 'OFFICIAL STORY' turns out to be that it was an accident, well, luckily it's one that fits some of the underlying themes of the Return (& I know there are a few Jungians lurking about, so I'm sure they would also welcome any synchronicites).
whoisalhedges
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby whoisalhedges » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:49 am

Huh. It never reminded me of the paleolithic Venuses (Venusi? :lol: ) but that's an interesting comparison.

Still, my point is that calling the Experiment "Mother" is an assumption our minds overlay atop the text, rather than something actually stated by the material at hand. And I think that's something Lynch & Frost are more attuned to, that aspect of human nature, than most authors and filmmakers.
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Dreamy Audrey
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Dreamy Audrey » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:52 am

alek2702 wrote:
Hockey Mask wrote:This is just editing to adjust timing of cars. Nothing more.

Exactly, they just edited part of the frame, happens often these days.

How would editing only Ed's reflection help with adjusting the timing of the cars?
whoisalhedges
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby whoisalhedges » Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:53 am

Saturn's child wrote:
referendum wrote:The thing is, with a show like twin peaks (or alot of music or art or books), it doesn't really matter whether x or y theory is right or wrong [...] What the artist/ film-maker/ composer/ author intended might not be what some people take from it. Some people might even find things and make connections which the artist ( etc ) did not think of themselves. So to me, talking about ' right ' and ' wrong' , and insisting on one ' true ' reading that excludes other readings, is, as you put it ' missing the point' :)


For what it's worth, with regard to the Big Ed scene, I feel this & referendum's follow-up post reflect my feelings. The world of Twin Peaks is wide & can hold many meanings. If people want to see Ed's demonic reflection gobbling garmonbozia, power to them, especially if their viewing experience is richer for it. If the 'OFFICIAL STORY' turns out to be that it was an accident, well, luckily it's one that fits some of the underlying themes of the Return (& I know there are a few Jungians lurking about, so I'm sure they would also welcome any synchronicites).

Garmonbozia? Good lord, son....

Yeah, some people have brought up that several characters are eating something that looks like yellow mush... but the VAST majority are merely saying that the reflection is a couple seconds off, just a little time anomaly - we're not diving into the deep end of a pool full of garmonbozia.
Calderon
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Calderon » Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:07 am

So now I've finally seen episode 13. Without a doubt a good episode, but it falls short compared to episode 14.

Spoiler:
Really amazing how much happened in this episode.
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Saturn's child
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Re: Part 13 - What story is that, Charlie? (SPOILERS)

Postby Saturn's child » Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:10 am

whoisalhedges wrote:Garmonbozia? Good lord, son....
Yeah, some people have brought up that several characters are eating something that looks like yellow mush... but the VAST majority are merely saying that the reflection is a couple seconds off, just a little time anomaly - we're not diving into the deep end of a pool full of garmonbozia.


I know, I know, I was exaggerating for effect. :) But, while we're here, yellow slop heaped down with a spoon is at least evocative of the g, intentional or no.

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