Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Discussion of each of the 18 parts of Twin Peaks the Return

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Aerozhul
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Aerozhul » Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:57 pm

Cappy wrote:
Ashok wrote:I'm totally confused by the timeline after Cooper left the Sheriff station. Was everything at the end of Part 17 and 18 linear from Cooper's POV or were we seeing everything out of order? I honestly don't understand Part 18 at all.


I'm confused by this too, but just before Naido is revealed as Diane they start superimposing Cooper's face over the screen... I think when that starts it becomes a sort of subjective experience where Cooper and his doppelganger become one, and maybe ep. 18 is the disparate parts of Cooper's soul trying to resolve itself. Maybe?


I took this to mean that Coop is the dreamer. What was happening in the sheriff's station wasn't real. He even says, "We all live inside a dream".
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Normonaut
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Normonaut » Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:57 pm

Okay, I'm done screaming internally and have some thoughts.

1. This season is called The Return, not Season 3. It IS about the return of Cooper (and Laura?). (is it also about the return of Twin Peaks to a pre-murder innocence?)
I think/hope there will be a next season, and it will be called Season 3. For new viewers The Return was a horrible place to start, but Season 3 will not be. Season 3 will again be about the mystery of Laura Palmer, but not the mystery of her death, rather her (new) life. A perfect place to jump in. You could even call it a "reboot". Who is she now, who was the guy on her couch, why did she have to leave town, who was the "him" she referred to when Coop (?) introduced himself as FBI?

The Return is basically Fire Walk With Me part two. There's a reason they kept saying it's a movie, not a TV show. This is the movie that bridges the gap between season 2 and 3.
IF I'm correct (and it's a massive if), the confusing roadhouse scenes could be characters from this new, non-Palmer, Twin Peaks. But where does Audrey fit in in... anything?

It also just struck me that the role of Diane could have been easily switched with Annie with just two or three changes in dialogue during the whole "season".

2. The opening scene of Cooper and the Giant in part 1 happens after this. The Giant mentions 430 (miles until the "dimension shift" or whatever), Richard and Linda (after said shift), and Coop says he understand. He understand because he remembers all of The Return, and knows what this could mean. He had no idea about Richard and Linda before.

Hi, I'm confused.
Last edited by Normonaut on Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Agent Cooper. Listen to the sounds.
It is in our house now. It all can not be said aloud now.
Remember 4 - 3 - 0
Richard and Linda. Two birds with one stone.
You are far away.
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AgentEcho
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby AgentEcho » Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:57 pm

richsmith wrote: Either way, you simply have to be amazed and impressed by Lynch and Frost's uncompromising vision... and the fact that they clearly have incredibly large testicles.


Absolutely agree with this.
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Yps
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Yps » Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:58 pm

So Carrie was wearing a prominent horseshoe necklace. The horseshoe symbol in set theory represents an intersection or union between two sets. It's basically the overlapping area between two circles in a Venn diagram. Maybe Carrie / Laura represents the intersection between two realities.

Another note: Season 1 ended with Cooper caught between life and limbo after being shot. Season 2 ended with Cooper stuck in purgatory. Season 3 ended with Cooper stuck in a purgatory of his own making.
Last edited by Yps on Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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N. Needleman
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby N. Needleman » Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:58 pm

richsmith wrote:
Wally Brando wrote:Genuinely astonished by how many people there are that didn't enjoy 18, to the point where there are multiple posters claiming they're in tears at how awful it was.

I'd rate it as my second favourite episode of The Return after 8. Loved it.

I think tonight's reaction is almost identical to what I remember after Series 2's finale. The vocal majority absolutely detested it, a passionate minority adored and defended it. Of course, Season 2's ending is now considered one of the all-time greats, and I suspect The Return's equivalent will come to be seen the same way in time. Either way, you simply have to be amazed and impressed by Lynch and Frost's uncompromising vision... and the fact that they clearly have incredibly large testicles.


That's how I feel. I'm gutted on one level to not have a tidy ending, but I cannot deny that both hours were absolutely incredible - from the highest high to the darkest dark. And after LH and MD I should've known. It was masterful and heartwrenching, and terrifying. It went from gratification to horror.

That said, I do hope there is more.
AnotherBlueRoseCase wrote:The Return is clearly guaranteed a future audience among stoners and other drug users.
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Jonah
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Jonah » Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:59 pm

I wonder if Carrie Page is an anagram?
Actually, now that some time has passed, I like "The full blossom of the evening".
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SpookyDollhouse
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby SpookyDollhouse » Sun Sep 03, 2017 8:59 pm

Sarah was inhabited by Judy. Cooper saved Laura in the past and thus thwarted Judy, whatever her goal was; the future where Laura's body was never found was a future Judy wasn't going to inhabit Sarah. Laura was dead, yet still lived. She wasn't supposed to recall or learn of that reality. (was it future, or past?) In good heart, Cooper thought revealing this to Laura was going to complete the circle and "defeat" Judy, if she wasn't "defeated" already anyway. All it did was dredge everything to the surface again; like others have pointed out, the effect of traumas never completely go away.

Also, I think episode 18 is quite possibly Lynch's finest moment since Mulholland Drive as great as Inland Empire was.
Cooperscoffeecup
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Cooperscoffeecup » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:03 pm

Ross wrote:All I can say right now is What. the Fuck...


You make me feel better. Part 17 loved it. The gang and then some back together again. Lucy - who would have thought. Then Part 18 happened..... wtf. For the last part of the series, lets go on a road trip....
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Wally Brando
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Wally Brando » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:03 pm

richsmith wrote:
Wally Brando wrote:Genuinely astonished by how many people there are that didn't enjoy 18, to the point where there are multiple posters claiming they're in tears at how awful it was.

I'd rate it as my second favourite episode of The Return after 8. Loved it.

I think tonight's reaction is almost identical to what I remember after Series 2's finale. The vocal majority absolutely detested it, a passionate minority adored and defended it. Of course, Season 2's ending is now considered one of the all-time greats, and I suspect The Return's equivalent will come to be seen the same way in time. Either way, you simply have to be amazed and impressed by Lynch and Frost's uncompromising vision... and the fact that they clearly have incredibly large testicles.

I can certainly remember being shellshocked by the original ending, and bring elated when the film was announced / outraged when it was announced it was a prequel.

This time around I found the final episode absolutely perfect.

The one criticism I do agree with is that the last 2 parts rendered a lot of the previous 16 episodes irrelevant. As entertaining as it almost all was, unless there is another season, I'm not sure how much I'll care about a lot of it, as parts 8 and 18 to me were just so much better than everything else. Just watched 18 again, and it's captivating and chilling at the same time, phenomenal.
BGate
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby BGate » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:04 pm

Jonah wrote:I wonder if Carrie Page is an anagram?


I saw someone else point out that it could be "Carry page" as in, pages of her diary.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Calderon » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:04 pm

N. Needleman wrote:
richsmith wrote:
Wally Brando wrote:Genuinely astonished by how many people there are that didn't enjoy 18, to the point where there are multiple posters claiming they're in tears at how awful it was.

I'd rate it as my second favourite episode of The Return after 8. Loved it.

I think tonight's reaction is almost identical to what I remember after Series 2's finale. The vocal majority absolutely detested it, a passionate minority adored and defended it. Of course, Season 2's ending is now considered one of the all-time greats, and I suspect The Return's equivalent will come to be seen the same way in time. Either way, you simply have to be amazed and impressed by Lynch and Frost's uncompromising vision... and the fact that they clearly have incredibly large testicles.


That's how I feel. I'm gutted on one level to not have a tidy ending, but I cannot deny that both hours were absolutely incredible - from the highest high to the darkest dark. And after LH and MD I should've known. It was masterful and heartwrenching, and terrifying. It went from gratification to horror.

That said, I do hope there is more.


All of this. Just a masterful piece of work. Yeah, now let us keep fighting for another season!
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yaxomoxay
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby yaxomoxay » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:05 pm

WhiteLodge90 wrote: If this was all a dream meaning everything we've seen for the past three seasons or 27 years was fake I will have lost all hope... ..


To me the opposite happened. Laura hearing Sarah's scream implies that her murder was real but they were now living in a fake reality (modified by Cooper), that is in a dream.


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sirpsychoswayze
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby sirpsychoswayze » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:06 pm

richsmith wrote:Does anyone have any thoughts about the incredibly disturbing Sarah Palmer scene, in which she smashes and stabs at the iconic Laura prom queen photograph? I'm assuming it's not a coincidence that right after it Laura disappears from Cooper's sight?


My guess is that this represents the moment Dale brought Laura back into the world. Sarah had spent the last twenty-five years grieving Laura and the way that her life was cut short, but when Dale brought her back, she was hit by twenty-five years of alternate history and maybe their relationship had soured somewhere along the way.
Rex
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Rex » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:06 pm

crash_and_burn wrote:So what happened to Beverley and her husband, and Ben? What happened with Audrey? Was Charlie her husband, doctor, shrink, care-taker, spirit-guide, baby-sitter? What about the zombie in the jail-cell? Was that Billy? Is Judy inside of Sarah Palmer? Where is Diane? Did we just watch the Richard and Linda show? How's Annie? How's Annie? HOW'S ANNIE?

ANNIE ARE YOU OKAY? ARE YOU OKAY ANNIE?

THERE WERE BLOOD STAINS, ON THE CARPET

ANNIE ARE YOU OKAY?

This ending would have made more sense:

https://youtu.be/Xbt40yzH0qg

Right. On.
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blue_tomorrows
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby blue_tomorrows » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:07 pm

richsmith wrote:
Wally Brando wrote:Genuinely astonished by how many people there are that didn't enjoy 18, to the point where there are multiple posters claiming they're in tears at how awful it was.

I'd rate it as my second favourite episode of The Return after 8. Loved it.

I think tonight's reaction is almost identical to what I remember after Series 2's finale. The vocal majority absolutely detested it, a passionate minority adored and defended it. Of course, Season 2's ending is now considered one of the all-time greats, and I suspect The Return's equivalent will come to be seen the same way in time. Either way, you simply have to be amazed and impressed by Lynch and Frost's uncompromising vision... and the fact that they clearly have incredibly large testicles.


To each their own, but I watched the series 2 finale live on ABC and was completely thrilled by it -- I spent most of that final hour with my jaw hanging open. I couldn't believe that I was watching that on network TV. And this, to me, fell about a thousand miles short of that on every level. At least the series 2 finale didn't retcon everything you had just spent all this time watching into oblivion!

I wasn't exactly in tears, but that was because I just didn't CARE enough! I might find the uncompromising nature of it admirable, but it doesn't automatically make it interesting (again, to me at least).

The difference between this, MD, and IE (which I'm a huge fan of -- hence my screen name) is simply that MD and IE seem to be about bigger things than their actual storylines. I never felt that for one moment in TP:TR with the exception of episode 8. Which is why this fails to me. Maybe someday I'll revisit and revise my opinion, but the prospect doesn't appeal to me at all right now (again, unlike MD and IE, which I couldn't WAIT to see again)

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