Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

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sewhite2000
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby sewhite2000 » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:47 am

TheGum wrote:I have never felt so satisfied at the end of a series as I do right now.


Okay, I promise I'm not trying to get snarky. I'm just trying to understand. There are a ton of posts incredibly similar to yours. One sentence, two sentence, expressing utter happiness and satisfaction with the ending, but none of them elaborating why. Could you or others give some reasons why you're so deliriously happy, please? Maybe it will help me understand what I seem to be missing.
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mtwentz
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby mtwentz » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:49 am

claaa7 wrote:
mtwentz wrote:I think it has to be interpreted as a dream. Cooper's old room key should not fit into the boiler room below- this indicates no logic to the world he's in except a dream logic.

I believe trying to make sense and connect all the dots for this series will be very hard, but I'm open to the possibility that I am wrong and will be interested to see what people come up with.


not only that, but the boiler room at the Great Northern is suddenly the same as the basement of the Twin Peaks hospital as seen in the EU ending, all scored to the same sound effect.. it's exactly the type of thing that happens in dreams, one door leads you to a room in a different house, etc.


Hah, I didn't notice that. One more piece in the puzzle!
"Dougie is COOPER? How the Hell is this!?"
Hester Prynne
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Hester Prynne » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:52 am

claaa7 wrote:
Jerry Horne wrote:It was about the bunny.


i'll be damned!


Great find, Jerry. So, there's a connection between Jack Rabbit's Palace and Odessa, and Odessa is feminine for "wrathful" but can also mean odyssey. Needleman had a great post describing Odessa as Judy's lair.

Also, did anyone notice the prominence of the Maersk logo and the 7 point star before Judy's diner? Apparently the Danish founder of the company, before it became Maersk, affixed it to a steamship named "Laura" after he prayed for a sign after his wife was ill - that a star would appear in the sky symbolizing that the Lord answers prayers. Not making this up:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maersk
Rex
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Rex » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:54 am

Rex wrote:On the Infinity Symbol being mentioned, as above, so below. Remember the rearranged symbols on Major Briggs (RIP DD) and The Log Lady. Three diamonds top to bottom between twin peaks.

Two different timelines/realities? Three?

Expanding on my previous post, quoted above, when we look at the combined symbols of Major Briggs and The Log Lady, perhaps the twin peaks are the two worlds and the Infinity Symbol is the "between".

In the center, the Infinity Symbol means your stuck in Infinity between two worlds or, with the three diamond pattern in the center, the top diamond is the White Lodge, the center diamond is reality, and the bottom diamond is the Black Lodge.

In Owl Cave, Windom Earle turned the diamond/gull-wing symbol upside down. Diamond at low-center, between two peaks, representing the Black Lodge.

Just spit-balling here.
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FlyingSquirrel
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby FlyingSquirrel » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:57 am

AgentEcho wrote:-An electrical pole with the number 6 by Carries. He seems surprised that she looks like Laura. Who was he expecting? And Carrie, when Coop identifies himself as FBI, immediately thinks he's there for some other reason. "Did you find him?" She's not particularly concerned about letting an FBI agent see the dead body in her living room.


Well, at the time I assumed he was looking for Judy. I had thought, up until that point, that everything after the "crossover" was taking place inside another manifestation of the Lodges, and that Cooper was behaving strangely because he knew that and assumed that what he was experiencing was some sort of representation of something he couldn't perceive directly. (If you've ever seen Star Trek: Deep Space Nine and remember when Sisko would interact with "the prophets" in the form of people he knew from real life, I was expecting something along those lines.) So in that case, a diner appearing with the name "Judy" would have just been a puzzle piece to solve as opposed to a real location with real people.

As it is, I guess he thought he was in the real world but was counting on some sort of supernatural serendipity to get him where he needed to go. As for who he would have expected other than Laura or Judy, I suppose the other possibility would be Annie, who also worked as a waitress, but my sense is that he knows where she ended up and has long since reconciled himself to her fate, whatever it may have been.
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TheGum
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby TheGum » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:58 am

sewhite2000 wrote:
TheGum wrote:I have never felt so satisfied at the end of a series as I do right now.


Okay, I promise I'm not trying to get snarky. I'm just trying to understand. There are a ton of posts incredibly similar to yours. One sentence, two sentence, expressing utter happiness and satisfaction with the ending, but none of them elaborating why. Could you or others give some reasons why you're so deliriously happy, please? Maybe it will help me understand what I seem to be missing.


Look right above that post for an extremely verbose detailed couple of posts elaborating on exactly why I love this so much.
I'm back in style!
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Saturn's child
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Saturn's child » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:02 am

Part 18 was the most I've smiled during watching, along with part 8. I can't decide if I would love a 4th season, or if this is the perfect place to end it. Not sure what to add at this point, since I'm still reeling, but:

* I agree with several other posters, that the part 18 Coop (presumably 'Richard') is an amalgamation of good Coop, Mr C, & Dougie; he is the integrated whole, even if it is an uncomfortable juxtaposition (especially in this new [version of] reality). This was most apparent at Judy's: helping out the waitress (good coop), asking for the address (Mr C), & blindly walking around with the gun pointing every which way (Dougie).

* Jerry is found in Wyoming? I'm not from the U.S., but looking at a map it seems he's a fair distance from Twin Peaks (at least by foot). Kinda sounds like an abduction scenario, waking up naked hundreds of miles away.

* As others have noted, Sarah's stabbing of Laura's image seems to time/resonate with her disappearance from Coop's guiding hand. In both instances we see a character interacting with 'past Laura' (or at least her image); Coop finds her, Sarah stabs her, she screams & disappears.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby CircleOfTrees » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:04 am

All you good people, you want to know who killed Laura? You did. We all did. We live inside a dream.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Rex » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:05 am

yaxomoxay wrote:Question: if TP:TR was a dream and goodCooper knew it, what was the purpose of re creating Dougie and make Jeaney-E happy?

I think the Dougie tulpa is the anchor to the real world. When Coop needs to take advantage of it he electrocutes himself to expel the fake and takes his place in reality.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby cgs027 » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:06 am

BHell wrote:
Cipher wrote:That's definitely one of the bigger mysteries, right?

Who's the only person who actually tells Cooper to find Laura? Leland, the only other person we've seen host Bob. And he only does it after she's whisked away, presumably, because of Cooper's own actions.

Could it just be that their two motivations come together into one unfortunate loop? Leland's guilt and greed--a need to see his daughter returned, and Cooper's desire to kill two birds with one stone by saving Laura and stopping Judy. Both are short-sighted; both have only part of a picture and somewhat naive goals. Cooper's actions trigger Leland's plea; Leland's plea spurs on Cooper's sense of righteousness without due examination.

As far as the ending being depressing, it's horrifying in the moment, but I'm coming around to the idea that Laura's awakening and the seeming shattering of that reality may in fact promise something more redemptive to come.

Though, agreed with posts above; Cooper won't be the one to lead them out of it. Laura's the one -- our gateway into the mystery, and the only one with the hard-fought self-perspective to solve her way out of her own fate.


Your observation that Leland's command to find Laura actually happened after the fact in this episode is intriguing, but then again, Leland had exactly the same line of dialogue the first time Cooper escaped the lodge. And within the lodge time does obviously not run in a linear fashion. So, yeah, probably some kind of reciprocal (and entirely non-temporal) causation between Cooper and Leland (and their individual desires) going on.

And you are certainly right on the point that Leland is as imperfect a being as is Cooper, and thus does not see the whole picture. Though that does open up another "loophole": Other lodge spirits should have been able to forsee the consequences of Cooper going after Laura (either by going back to FWWM or by crossing over to a strange (dream?) dimension with Diane). Especially Mike, who guided him throughout the whole Dougie-Plot, but later didn't deem it necessary to warn him of persuing Laura. And where again did Cooper get those "430 miles" from!?

Does that mean, that the (perceived) forces of good wanted the ending to happen the way it did? And if so, why?

Damn, Lynch is crazy. But the good kind of crazy.


Yeah, that kind of bugged me, too. Even the Fireman seems to guide Cooper into this alternate timeline where both him and Laura are shadows of themselves, and are confused and ineffectual. Doesn't seem like the act of a benevolent character. Unless the entire end game was to keep Laura away from Judy (who may or may not have possessed Sarah). Almost like Briggs "hibernating", we have Laura hiding out in this skewed timeline (though she is not aware of it in this case).
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Panapaok
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Panapaok » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:07 am

I always thought they'd go for a more bittersweet finale, in the vein of other Lynch films. I'm actually shocked and surprised that the ending was so devastating. Cooper failed again, even though his intentions were benevolent. The ending is so haunting, it left me gobsmacked. :cry:
This is - excuse me - a damn fine cup of coffee.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby TwinsPeak » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:11 am

I dont have a twitter account. But fans of having a season 4 should be tweeting Showtime and maybe Nevins has a twitter account i dont know if he does....but please tweet...#TwinPeaks Season 4
sewhite2000
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby sewhite2000 » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:12 am

TheGum wrote:
sewhite2000 wrote:
TheGum wrote:I have never felt so satisfied at the end of a series as I do right now.


Okay, I promise I'm not trying to get snarky. I'm just trying to understand. There are a ton of posts incredibly similar to yours. One sentence, two sentence, expressing utter happiness and satisfaction with the ending, but none of them elaborating why. Could you or others give some reasons why you're so deliriously happy, please? Maybe it will help me understand what I seem to be missing.


Look right above that post for an extremely verbose detailed couple of posts elaborating on exactly why I love this so much.


I went back and read your long post and found it interesting. I don't interpret it the same way, I guess. Not sure I see the ending as this wonderful gift as I do just more mind-screwing.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Rex » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:12 am

ThumbsUp wrote:
nonemoreblack wrote:
NewtoTwinPeaks wrote:I didn't really like the romance angle with Cooper and Diane. I felt they should've kept it a professional relationship.

I also felt Diane was very flat as a character, other than episode 9 and the great scene with Bad Coop.


I didn't like that either. Didn't make sense with how Cooper talked to her in the original series, and like he just completely forgot about Annie? And especially after what Happened with the DoppleCoop. I wanted to like Diane, but I felt nothing for her.


Was it romance though? The sex scene seemed more like they were acting out a ritual that was all part of their plan but I can't make sense of it. If tulpas really do share the real person's memories, it seemed like Diane/Coop's romance might've been more a fling (the kiss "only happened once before").

"Love and fear open the door." Diane covered his eyes because he was staring at her.

Not real conducive to orgasm.
Last edited by Rex on Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
sewhite2000
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby sewhite2000 » Mon Sep 04, 2017 10:17 am

cgs027 wrote:
BHell wrote:
Cipher wrote:That's definitely one of the bigger mysteries, right?

Who's the only person who actually tells Cooper to find Laura? Leland, the only other person we've seen host Bob. And he only does it after she's whisked away, presumably, because of Cooper's own actions.

Could it just be that their two motivations come together into one unfortunate loop? Leland's guilt and greed--a need to see his daughter returned, and Cooper's desire to kill two birds with one stone by saving Laura and stopping Judy. Both are short-sighted; both have only part of a picture and somewhat naive goals. Cooper's actions trigger Leland's plea; Leland's plea spurs on Cooper's sense of righteousness without due examination.

As far as the ending being depressing, it's horrifying in the moment, but I'm coming around to the idea that Laura's awakening and the seeming shattering of that reality may in fact promise something more redemptive to come.

Though, agreed with posts above; Cooper won't be the one to lead them out of it. Laura's the one -- our gateway into the mystery, and the only one with the hard-fought self-perspective to solve her way out of her own fate.


Your observation that Leland's command to find Laura actually happened after the fact in this episode is intriguing, but then again, Leland had exactly the same line of dialogue the first time Cooper escaped the lodge. And within the lodge time does obviously not run in a linear fashion. So, yeah, probably some kind of reciprocal (and entirely non-temporal) causation between Cooper and Leland (and their individual desires) going on.

And you are certainly right on the point that Leland is as imperfect a being as is Cooper, and thus does not see the whole picture. Though that does open up another "loophole": Other lodge spirits should have been able to forsee the consequences of Cooper going after Laura (either by going back to FWWM or by crossing over to a strange (dream?) dimension with Diane). Especially Mike, who guided him throughout the whole Dougie-Plot, but later didn't deem it necessary to warn him of persuing Laura. And where again did Cooper get those "430 miles" from!?

Does that mean, that the (perceived) forces of good wanted the ending to happen the way it did? And if so, why?

Damn, Lynch is crazy. But the good kind of crazy.


Yeah, that kind of bugged me, too. Even the Fireman seems to guide Cooper into this alternate timeline where both him and Laura are shadows of themselves, and are confused and ineffectual. Doesn't seem like the act of a benevolent character. Unless the entire end game was to keep Laura away from Judy (who may or may not have possessed Sarah). Almost like Briggs "hibernating", we have Laura hiding out in this skewed timeline (though she is not aware of it in this case).


But in the final seconds, she once again becomes aware of it, which is why she screams?

I too am confused as the role of the Fireman, who seems to have been the engineer of Laura as some kind of force of good in the world to combat the evil of Judy and BOB? Cooper seems to follow his directions precisely, and now he and Laura are when this really bleak, seemingly hopeless place as the result of his doing so. Now, if this was just the beginning, if there was more to come, maybe I could understand it. Maybe Cooper still has a chance to rectify things. But if this is where the Fireman (and Lynch and Frost) wanted Cooper's journey to end, it makes me feel like his motives are malevolent.

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