Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Discussion of each of the 18 parts of Twin Peaks the Return

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Ashok
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Ashok » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:44 pm

cgs027 wrote:Sorry if this has been answered (and it may have been across multiple posts), but just trying to summarize:

When we see Laura's corpse disappear from the waterfront, are most people interpreting that as Coop saved her life and she wasn't killed? So, she is still part of that "reality"? Or, is she gone from that reality, period -- and dropped into this Carrie Page alter-ego/skewed universe? Or, is the general consensus that there are multiple realities pushing against one and other here?

Not sure I've wrapped my head around what her corpse disappearing means in terms of where she is existing at that point.


My assumption was that everything in Season 1+2 always happened. Laura was always murdered. When Coop "saved" her, the original timeline remains intact in history but a sort of Timeline 2 where Laura lives was generated. But in this new timeline, Laura isn't living happily ever after in the future. She was whisked away by otherworldly forces and send to another alternate reality where Richard/Linda reside.
Last edited by Ashok on Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Drgarage
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Drgarage » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:44 pm

Longtime lurker, just registered because a few things make sense to me that I haven't seen discussed yet:

-- Everyone is saying that Sarah is possessed by Judy. But the actual imagery around her dark side seems connected to the Jumping Man and/or the Boy. Richard and Carrie went to Sarah's house expecting Sarah (and, we assumed, a confrontation with Judy). Instead, we met "Alice Tremond", who bought the house from "Mrs. Chalfont." So we were all disappointed to never really see the face of Judy.

Or did we?

--Jeffries told Dark Coop that he had already met Judy. As Judy is a spirit entity, it cannot be an earth-bound character. That pretty much limits us to anyone who was in the convenience store scene in Fire Walk With Me, given that if we've witnessed this meeting, it would be BOB meeting Judy.

Of characters from that scene who recurred outside of it, we get

1. The Arm (no chance this is Judy)
2. The Jumping Man
3. The Boy with the mask (distinct from Jumping Man? We don't know)
4. Mrs. Chalfont

I think they told us who Judy is, especially if you consider that Sarah seems possessed by the Jumping Man and/or the Boy. I seem to recall the Boy had a companion who provided a painting to Laura once... We never suspect the polite and the elderly.

One last thought: given that the Dutchman's has the wallpaper and door from Chalfont's painting, it makes sense that Jeffries would know all about Judy. The Dutchman's is her domain.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Drgarage » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:45 pm

To add--other than Woodsmen, the Jumping Man is the only consistent spirit at the Dutchman's.
tlk
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby tlk » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:50 pm

Rex wrote:We have been snookered.

will need a 4-cushion escape.
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Rudagger
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Rudagger » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:51 pm

With Judy being a potentially demonic evil entity, it really makes Jeffries' dialogue in FWWM a bit .. incongruous?

Doesn't he say something along the lines of "Judy is *sure* of this!", in regards to the convenient store and stuff. I know they're just repurposing old stuff, but, that line still feels written about a human character who's probably not a spirit but who found the Convenience Store (after all, why would Jeffries be talking to and getting information from a demonic entity?).
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Drgarage » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:53 pm

Rudagger wrote:With Judy being a potentially demonic evil entity, it really makes Jeffries' dialogue in FWWM a bit .. incongruous?

Doesn't he say something along the lines of "Judy is *sure* of this!", in regards to the convenient store and stuff. I know they're just repurposing old stuff, but, that line still feels written about a human character who's probably not a spirit but who found the Convenience Store (after all, why would Jeffries be talking to and getting information from a demonic entity?).

Because Mrs. Chalfont loves to provide information that seems helpful. And then terrible things happen.
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The Brown Lodge
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby The Brown Lodge » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:55 pm

When Sarah Palmer mauls that iconic photo with the glass bottle, this is a blatant metaphor that 'twin peaks' itself is being destroyed, right?
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Diane
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Diane » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:57 pm

What is this "in our house now"? I keep seeing references to it and I don't recall it.
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Drgarage » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:59 pm

Diane wrote:What is this "in our house now"? I keep seeing references to it and I don't recall it.

First line of the whole season, said to Cooper by the Fireman.
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TheGum
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby TheGum » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:59 pm

The Brown Lodge wrote:When Sarah Palmer mauls that iconic photo with the glass bottle, this is a blatant metaphor that 'twin peaks' itself is being destroyed, right?


I definitely see that. In the original series we saw that portrait in the ending credits of every single episode not to mention around town, there's no way they didn't consider that.
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thedougpa
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby thedougpa » Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:00 pm

Diane wrote:What is this "in our house now"? I keep seeing references to it and I don't recall it.

First minute of S03E01.
Hester Prynne
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Hester Prynne » Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:01 pm

TheGum wrote:Why are the chairs upside down? What an awkward feeling that Judy's has!


And why was Cooper clearly drinking from an empty coffee cup? That was like rash girl drinking from the empty beer can. Does this harken back to the magic trick with the disappearing coffee and creamed corn? Is Odessa an illusion?
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Troubbble
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Troubbble » Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:05 pm

Intrigued by someone's suggestion that Dale never left the Lodge the entire show, until stepping out into Glastonbury Grove to meet Diane. Not sure how viable that could really be, but it's an interesting idea in light of the other things I'm currently turning over in my mind...

(Need to rewatch everything, but will probably give it some time before I do.)
riesje
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby riesje » Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:06 pm

tlk wrote:
mtwentz wrote:I don't think there's one explanation to The Return. There will never be 'one' explanation.

Guess it's an unpopular view on this board.)) Or on any other internets for that matter )))


people unfamiliar with Lynch maybe, this is his way of working narratives since oh Lost Highway.
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Jacob
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Re: Part 18 - What is your name? (SPOILERS)

Postby Jacob » Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:11 pm

AgentEcho wrote:
Jacob wrote: But Part 17's softness is precisely why it fails to really work in my opinion.


I can see your point, but this seemed to be the point of those scenes. The climax came on startlingly quickly, especially after the long build up to getting there. Everything seemed awfully tidy for a long moment which contrasts with what happened before. There seemed to be an awareness throughout the Return of audiences expectations which were consistently subverted. Here we are given a kind of approximation of a crowd pleasing denouement, only to the rug pulled out from under us and be presented with something far more challenging and unsettling. Much of this seemed to serve as a contrast to what follows. You mentioned it seemed like a joke and I think it may have been a joke about the absudity of what audiences expect from stories.... he gave us momentarily what "audiences" would expect and highlighted the absurdity of it, right down to having a comic book super hero battle Bob. I think Lynch's counter to what your saying part 17 is soft would be to say, "expecting a tidy ending is soft, and I was just showing you that."

It's true, and that's why I said in my post that Part 18, in comparison, felt really tragic and honest. But still : you can't justify a part's flaws by saying it was conscious. It reminded me a bit of how Part 8's pure imagery was balanced by the really dynamic and narrative-driven Part 7. But here, even if Lynch's intentions are understandable, it's never beautifuly "absurd". Honestly it's bad.


Anyway, I really don't get the "Laura is the embodiment of nirvana" theory. I mean, come on : the girl was a prostitute and on coke even before she turned 18. Don't get me wrong, I know she was a victim. But I really can't see how we can make her an icon of detachment and nothingness. The girl has always been wild.
So I can't help myself to be really suspicious when we're talking of Laura like a "pure innocence" figure. Look at her when RichardCoop is coming to get her : there is a fucking dead body in her living room ! She's doomed to be surrounded by chaos. If she's the embodiment of Nirvana, well, no wonder Cooper and her are fucking lost god knows where. I've seen better Buddha.
I know I may be the only one here, but I still believe that Laura is maybe an incarnation of Judy. And maybe that's what she's telling Cooper during the final credits.

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