The Secret History of Twin Peaks
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- LonelySoul
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
RE: Mark's tweet about Norma's mom...
Yesssss. It sounds like there is a definite reason for this. You could say we've been arguing for no reason, but to be fair, Frost hadn't spoken on the matter until that tweet. Anyway, hats off! This great news. This will turn my frown upside down: https://youtu.be/_BcrtgMM8N0?t=28s
Yesssss. It sounds like there is a definite reason for this. You could say we've been arguing for no reason, but to be fair, Frost hadn't spoken on the matter until that tweet. Anyway, hats off! This great news. This will turn my frown upside down: https://youtu.be/_BcrtgMM8N0?t=28s
Come hang out at http://www.reddit.com/r/twinpeaks. I'm /u/iswitt, one of the moderators.
- Audrey Horne
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
So the info supplied about Norma's mother was to obscure or hide the fact that she was MT Wentz? If Annie was alluded to somewhere in the book, I'd make the case that events are omitted and ties to her family in order to hide or fabricate facts about someone tied to the Red Room in the dossier. My gut tells me though that these are narrative changes Frost wrote... Most likely by forgetting most of the show's info on Norma, Ed and Nadine. Nadine is 37 by the events of 1989 in the book instead of "35, you moron!"
Seeing Frost tonight... Excited!
Seeing Frost tonight... Excited!
God, I love this music. Isn't it too dreamy?
Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
I'm at work now and I don't have the book with me so I can't check if I'm right, but I just had an idea on my way to work, that I think no one mentioned yet...
Who wrote the part of the book with the most continuity errors? The whole mess with Normas parents, the "moon" stamp on the postcard, the date of Josies death...
This is all in the dossier from Cooper on Andrew Packard. And according to the remarks he wrote it "after the case was solved and before he left town" and even the archivist wonders why he did this at all.
If he wrote this JUST before he left town, he might not have been the most reliable fellow. And maybe he had his own agenda for these changes - e.g. omitting a certain Annie from reality.
Yeah, there are glitches in other sections too (Nadines accident is mentioned in Hawks section) - but this might be the key to the puzzle...
Who wrote the part of the book with the most continuity errors? The whole mess with Normas parents, the "moon" stamp on the postcard, the date of Josies death...
This is all in the dossier from Cooper on Andrew Packard. And according to the remarks he wrote it "after the case was solved and before he left town" and even the archivist wonders why he did this at all.
If he wrote this JUST before he left town, he might not have been the most reliable fellow. And maybe he had his own agenda for these changes - e.g. omitting a certain Annie from reality.
Yeah, there are glitches in other sections too (Nadines accident is mentioned in Hawks section) - but this might be the key to the puzzle...
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
So cool! I'm trying to go see him on Saturday. Let us know if you or anyone else addresses the continuity stuff?Audrey Horne wrote:So the info supplied about Norma's mother was to obscure or hide the fact that she was MT Wentz? If Annie was alluded to somewhere in the book, I'd make the case that events are omitted and ties to her family in order to hide or fabricate facts about someone tied to the Red Room in the dossier. My gut tells me though that these are narrative changes Frost wrote... Most likely by forgetting most of the show's info on Norma, Ed and Nadine. Nadine is 37 by the events of 1989 in the book instead of "35, you moron!"
Seeing Frost tonight... Excited!
Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
I don't know about the rest of you , but I was happy to see that the bank employee who had just had a child ("It's a boy, it's a boy!") did not perish in the explosion!
That said, I've been trying to compile a list all of the post-finale reveals. This is what I've gathered so far,
- Pete, Dell Mibler and a third person (Andrew) were the sole casualties of the bank explosion. Audrey survived with critical injuries.
- Ben Horne survived his incident with Doc Hayward (there are mentions of him sitting at Audrey's bedside at the hospital)
- Cooper (or Dopplerganger Coop) apparently visited Major Briggs's home later on the same day as the "How's Annie' incident. Some time afterward, Cooper left town
- Hank was killed in prison in 1992
- Albert and Gordon are still alive and employed by the FBI in 2016
- Catherine sold the Mill land back to Ben (not sure if this is truly 'post-finale' or within the now-muddled timeline of the series)
So, maybe not truly the complete 'filling in of the gaps' novel we were hoping for, but we did get answers to some of the S2 finale cliffhangers. The big loose ends are Leo's fate and, of course, 'How's Annie'?
Am I missing anything?
That said, I've been trying to compile a list all of the post-finale reveals. This is what I've gathered so far,
- Pete, Dell Mibler and a third person (Andrew) were the sole casualties of the bank explosion. Audrey survived with critical injuries.
- Ben Horne survived his incident with Doc Hayward (there are mentions of him sitting at Audrey's bedside at the hospital)
- Cooper (or Dopplerganger Coop) apparently visited Major Briggs's home later on the same day as the "How's Annie' incident. Some time afterward, Cooper left town
- Hank was killed in prison in 1992
- Albert and Gordon are still alive and employed by the FBI in 2016
- Catherine sold the Mill land back to Ben (not sure if this is truly 'post-finale' or within the now-muddled timeline of the series)
So, maybe not truly the complete 'filling in of the gaps' novel we were hoping for, but we did get answers to some of the S2 finale cliffhangers. The big loose ends are Leo's fate and, of course, 'How's Annie'?
Am I missing anything?
- BEARisonFord
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
Am I the only one that was not expecting any mention of Annie at all? Always seemed to me that anything pertaining to her post-series future will be left for the series.
Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
I certainly wasn't expecting a mention of her POST series status. But I thought she'd be mentioned elsewhere.BEARisonFord wrote:Am I the only one that was not expecting any mention of Annie at all? Always seemed to me that anything pertaining to her post-series future will be left for the series.
"I can see half my life's history in your face... And I'm not sure that I want to."
http://twinpeakssoundtrackdesign.blogspot.com/
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
Did it specifically say Cooper left town? I listened on the audio and I did not hear that, but the implication was that Cooper is somehow missing.dkenny78 wrote:I don't know about the rest of you , but I was happy to see that the bank employee who had just had a child ("It's a boy, it's a boy!") did not perish in the explosion!
That said, I've been trying to compile a list all of the post-finale reveals. This is what I've gathered so far,
- Pete, Dell Mibler and a third person (Andrew) were the sole casualties of the bank explosion. Audrey survived with critical injuries.
- Ben Horne survived his incident with Doc Hayward (there are mentions of him sitting at Audrey's bedside at the hospital)
- Cooper (or Dopplerganger Coop) apparently visited Major Briggs's home later on the same day as the "How's Annie' incident. Some time afterward, Cooper left town
- Hank was killed in prison in 1992
- Albert and Gordon are still alive and employed by the FBI in 2016
- Catherine sold the Mill land back to Ben (not sure if this is truly 'post-finale' or within the now-muddled timeline of the series)
So, maybe not truly the complete 'filling in of the gaps' novel we were hoping for, but we did get answers to some of the S2 finale cliffhangers. The big loose ends are Leo's fate and, of course, 'How's Annie'?
Am I missing anything?
Maybe I am missing something, but the fate of Garland Briggs is still up in the air, I think. I did not hear specifically that he had died, which leaves open the possibility he is still alive (and his role has been recast).
F*&^ you Gene Kelly
Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
GoodMorningAmerica wrote:I just finished the book and I am 100% certain that most of the continuity errors are there by design, not sloppiness, and now Mark Frost's tweet only confirms it. I think the book is FANTASTIC. If there are any of you still out there who are refusing to buy/read it because you've heard that it doesn't match the image in your minds of what Twin Peaks is supposed to look like, my goodness, I beg you, promptly dislodge your heads from your posteriors and EMBRACE THE MYSTERY.
"Catholics, real ones, are all about the mystery." <---one line in the book, of many, that spoke directly to my soul.
I agree the book clearly had clues included in it.
I'm almost at the end of disc 3 of the audio version.
It is very well done, narrated and keeps your attention the entire time. Already putting things together.
I personally don't subscribe to the nature of the book being inaccurate. Mark Frost and David Lynch created the world of Twin Peaks so try information is accost by default and I feel like as I move through this chapter of the story I will find clues along the way to a bigger mystery.
When Jupiter and Saturn meet , oh what a crop of mummy wheat.
- gonetocroatan
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
Hey gang, long time listener / first time caller here.
As someone generally wary of rebottled lightning, I couldn't be more excited for S3. Unlike some since-mellowed people trying to pretend they're still 'weird' (*koff* pixies :/), Lynch has only walked further out on that lonely white chalk line over the last few decades. This book assured me that Frost is right there with him, weaving a lifetime's worth of esoteric research into our narrative.
I just want to throw out a couple thoughts regarding these inconsistencies. My suspicion has been that they are intentional since I got to "checkers, not chess". It remains to be seen if they are the product of a conniving narrator(s) or a fractured timeline. First, the book makes many distinctions between a 'mystery' and a 'secret', generally implying that while mysteries are timeless and profound, secrets are the hollow work of men with something to lose. In this light, the title "The Secret History..." supports the idea of the shady relater.
Some of the changes, however, are hard for me to see as strategic. Norma's mom, for example, has nothing to do with Milford or Coop or the Lodges (so far as we know). Seeing as everything from the name and nature of the town to its relationship to Deer Meadow refers to doubles/mirrors/dualities, and especially watching the progression of Lynch's films, could they be submitting the narrative itself (and everyone within it, forwards and backwards in time) to what happened to Fred Madison or Nikki Grace? The book regularly suggests the existence of other dimensions--perhaps S3 takes place "between two worlds". This would be insane and yet a natural outgrowth of both the mythos and Lynch's path as an artist. Maybe its a stretch, but Frost telling GQ that the book takes place "largely in the universe" of S1/2 could be a clue--what other universe would it be? And didn't most of the book have very little to do with the events of S1/2?
Either way, I'm pleased as punch that LYNCH/FROST are already making people angry--and we're supposed to be the sure bets!
As someone generally wary of rebottled lightning, I couldn't be more excited for S3. Unlike some since-mellowed people trying to pretend they're still 'weird' (*koff* pixies :/), Lynch has only walked further out on that lonely white chalk line over the last few decades. This book assured me that Frost is right there with him, weaving a lifetime's worth of esoteric research into our narrative.
I just want to throw out a couple thoughts regarding these inconsistencies. My suspicion has been that they are intentional since I got to "checkers, not chess". It remains to be seen if they are the product of a conniving narrator(s) or a fractured timeline. First, the book makes many distinctions between a 'mystery' and a 'secret', generally implying that while mysteries are timeless and profound, secrets are the hollow work of men with something to lose. In this light, the title "The Secret History..." supports the idea of the shady relater.
Some of the changes, however, are hard for me to see as strategic. Norma's mom, for example, has nothing to do with Milford or Coop or the Lodges (so far as we know). Seeing as everything from the name and nature of the town to its relationship to Deer Meadow refers to doubles/mirrors/dualities, and especially watching the progression of Lynch's films, could they be submitting the narrative itself (and everyone within it, forwards and backwards in time) to what happened to Fred Madison or Nikki Grace? The book regularly suggests the existence of other dimensions--perhaps S3 takes place "between two worlds". This would be insane and yet a natural outgrowth of both the mythos and Lynch's path as an artist. Maybe its a stretch, but Frost telling GQ that the book takes place "largely in the universe" of S1/2 could be a clue--what other universe would it be? And didn't most of the book have very little to do with the events of S1/2?
Either way, I'm pleased as punch that LYNCH/FROST are already making people angry--and we're supposed to be the sure bets!
Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
The implication in the book was only that Cooper had suffered a similar "terrible" fate, like the other people on the list of agents TP found (save for Cole and Albert). Also that it was apparently terrible enough for the FBI to seal Cooper's post-Twin Peaks files such that TP doesn't have clearance to read them.mtwentz wrote:Did it specifically say Cooper left town? I listened on the audio and I did not hear that, but the implication was that Cooper is somehow missing.
Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
Jesus Christ, thanks for that, pal. That was honestly one of the funniest things I've ever read.LonelySoul wrote:Maybe you're right, but I'm pretty disappointed in the book. I've almost considered having my mother return it (it was a birthday present)
Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
Ahh yes, now I remember. So I'm not quite sure Coop 'leaving town' can be verified except that he may have disappeared altogether from the face of the planet.The_Trout wrote:The implication in the book was only that Cooper had suffered a similar "terrible" fate, like the other people on the list of agents TP found (save for Cole and Albert). Also that it was apparently terrible enough for the FBI to seal Cooper's post-Twin Peaks files such that TP doesn't have clearance to read them.mtwentz wrote:Did it specifically say Cooper left town? I listened on the audio and I did not hear that, but the implication was that Cooper is somehow missing.
F*&^ you Gene Kelly
- GoodMorningAmerica
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
gonetocroatan wrote:It remains to be seen if they are the product of a conniving narrator(s) or a fractured timeline. First, the book makes many distinctions between a 'mystery' and a 'secret', generally implying that while mysteries are timeless and profound, secrets are the hollow work of men with something to lose. In this light, the title "The Secret History..." supports the idea of the shady relater.
This right here - my thoughts exactly.
gonetocroatan wrote:Some of the changes, however, are hard for me to see as strategic. Norma's mom, for example, has nothing to do with Milford or Coop or the Lodges (so far as we know).
Except that this revision in Norma's parentage could have the effect of writing Annie out of the history.
There was reference made in the book to the multiple, frequently deceptive, investigations into the UFO phenomena creating a "house of mirrors." I think we're in a similar house of mirrors w/r/t to the history of some of Twin Peaks' inhabitants.
- LonelySoul
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks
herofix wrote:Jesus Christ, thanks for that, pal. That was honestly one of the funniest things I've ever read.LonelySoul wrote:Maybe you're right, but I'm pretty disappointed in the book. I've almost considered having my mother return it (it was a birthday present)
I... don't know why. But I'm happy to have made you laugh?
My mother is also a huge Peaks fan. She went to the Fest with me in 2014. Random story - I was 26 at the time and someone actually asked me if my mother was my significant other. When I said no the person replied, "Well, you never know. Some people are into that." That being dating older women. Then I told them that she was in fact my mother and they looked mortified. Good times.
Come hang out at http://www.reddit.com/r/twinpeaks. I'm /u/iswitt, one of the moderators.