The Secret History of Twin Peaks

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Loola
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby Loola » Mon Nov 07, 2016 3:40 pm

Bookworm wrote:
MaiTaiRob wrote:THEORY: Truman has not been re-cast. Forster IS playing Sheriff Truman, but it's Harry's brother Franklin.

Someone has altered the past, which I think is consistent with the stamp, Norma's revised history, and other changes from the original show.

I think it's either Cooper, or someone closely related to him, and I think they did it to protect the people he loves. Norma's changes protect Annie, so what if this person also altered Truman's family history to save his future self from Coop/BOB. Franklin stays sheriff, Truman never picks up the badge.

Originally, Phillip Jeffries was to play a part, and we know he has at least some time travelling abilities. He could have done it, or maybe "Good Dale." Perhaps if you figure out how to exit the Lodge, you can do so at any time. Perhaps Coop left the Lodge in the 70's or 60's (thus the stamp) and set about altering history to shield the people closest to him.

This could also explain allegedly-living characters of Leland and Laura, and would explain the weird "Doing it, then not doing it" stories surrounding Ontkean's involvement. I've always smelled misdirection when it comes to Ontkean's and Graham's involvement, so maybe they can still both come back if the timeline is righted during season 3.

Or, they're really out, because Coop cared enough about them to place them on paths that never cross his own.

Thoughts?


Wow, now this is a theory I like. And I think you could really be onto something there. Great thinking! And honestly I was wondering this myself. Having read/seen/played many things about time traveling and many worlds theory I certainly wasn't screaming "inconsistencies! Reckoning!" to the top of my lunges but rather "Hmmm, look like someone wandered in the past and created a new timeline!" Now as for the Someone in question... May be good old Coop or Jeffries indeed.


Absolutely this! Some of the other 'mistakes ' then are like tine has shuffled/rippled slightly after Annie was removed from history. It affected the Norma/Ed/Nadine/Hank timeline slightly, the result was still the same (Nadine has her eye shot out and Norma & Ed never quite get to be together).

Lana wins Miss Twin Peaks etc etc.

It makes me wonder though, if Annie doesn't exist, Cooper doesn't follow Windom Earle to the lodges trying to save Annie. So is that how he escapes the lodge? By altering time? Or is his path such that he would've ended up there anyway but how would he get in without love?

It's all about Annie that's for sure. And Laura. Annie visited Laura before her death in a dream and told her that Laura and the good Dale are in the lodge, write it in your diary. She said this repeatedly to the nurse after she was saved, who then put on the ring.

I'm thinking there are 2 realities and the Ring helps you access them both. The lodge is the place between 2 worlds where time has no meaning. There is a time when the planets align correctly that you can get into the lodge without the ring, which is what windom and cooper did. Once in the lodge the rooms all look very similar but some have slight differences. Maybe fear and love unlock the puzzle of the lodge depending on which room you're in - until you get to the next alternate reality. The Venus de milo is a clue here I think.

The fact that the place is called Twin Peaks and there's all those doppelgängers about is an obvious clue to duality/duplication. Almost exactly alike but not quite the same.

I feel that Teresa banks came from 'the other Twin Peaks' no one came to collect her body, had she wiped herself from her family's memory? Desmond obviously disappears when he finds it and Jeffries knows all about the ring too.

I'm now thinking perhaps there's a ripple in time every time someone puts on the ring. Perhaps the nurse taking the ring from Annie started a new ripple that wiped Annie from history as we know it. Maybe the aliens are watching trying to work out what is making the world stop spinning every now and then, they've been looking for the ring. Btw I've always thought of the greys as highly evolved humans visiting from the future. I know I'm waffling now!

I'm so intrigued to know how the ring has been passed on to so many people with all their fates being pretty bleak as far as we know. I've always assumed there's only one ring.

Anyway, if there's no Annie then no one knows that the good Dale is in the lodge as she was the only one who knew and was trying to relay the message. So someone's definitely trying to stop him being discovered, probably dopplecooper. But did Laura write it in her secret diary? Has this page not been found yet?

Let's hope that's The basis for season 3.

I love the book btw. But I feel like I need a few weeks off work to study it.

I particularly love the Aleister Crowley and Jack Parsons references. I collect tarot cards and Crowley created his own Thoth tarot deck of course. But the bit that interests me is that Tarot is linked with the zodiac suits of Fire, Earth, Air and Water. All the spirits of the lodge appear to be too. Except Electricity. Not sure about that yet.

Crowley is well known for being a 'magician' who allegedly opened a portal and invited in to our dimension the LAM species of extra terrestrial.

There's just too much to contemplate in this book! I'm not complaining. I don't think the E.T. Stuff will be a big part of the next series though.

Plus I think the Archivist becomes someone else during the book. The 1's and I's on the typewritten notes are a give away. Why on earth would Briggs reveal himself? Definitely a red herring - someone trying to stop the mystery being solved. What would be the point in Tamara investigating if he admits who he is anyway. Literally no investigation required, so it was obviously not the task she was given. Are her notes a red herring too? Does she know someone, probably a dodgy FBI agent is also trying to find out what's inside the dossier?

Apologies if this has been said before, I haven't read the whole thread.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby sneakydave » Tue Nov 08, 2016 1:43 am

Loola wrote:Btw I've always thought of the greys as highly evolved humans visiting from the future. I know I'm waffling now!


This has long been my personal thoughts about the greys.

Picture my joy when Fringe used it as a rather large plot device.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby LonelySoul » Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:28 am

I summarized Frost's AMA from yesterday here: http://www.dugpa.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3301

Some of the answers pertained to the book specifically.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby FlyingSquirrel » Tue Nov 08, 2016 5:25 pm

Catching up on this thread here...

Ross wrote:
dugpa wrote:Gut tells me the 1991 murder is Annie Blackburn.

Sigh...

I fear you might be right. That will be pretty devastating for me if true. Such a cruel fate for the nicest character in TP.

I've always thought that the Cooper situation would be a tough one. Seeing (or at least knowing) our beloved Coop committing crimes such as murder will be rough. I guess that's why Lynch introduced the concept of the split.


I also have to wonder how the Good Cooper will deal with that, psychologically. His role in the events leading to Caroline's death seemed to have really broken him for a time according to "My Life, My Tapes," and he was pretty adamant about maintaining an emotional distance to keep something like that from happening again. Whether Annie is one of the victims or not, it's hard to imagine that he wouldn't blame himself for whatever Bad Cooper did.

N. Needleman wrote:
I've only begun to skim it, but there are some definite continuity lapses. Not enough to make me upset - the Nadine thing is whatever to me - but the Ben material is a bit baffling. Again, I've only skimmed, but it seems to very explicitly suggest Ben never turned good, and there is a letter from Audrey that would seem to indicate she went to the bank to defy his plans for Ghostwood. By that time, on the show, Ben was fully behind stopping Ghostwood.


This is perhaps a bit of a reach, but what if Ben's "Stop Ghostwood" campaign was a scam that he was using to try to coerce Catherine into playing ball and Audrey got wise to this? I don't remember the exact events well enough to know if that would hold water, but I do remember wondering at times if "Good Ben" was 100% sincere or if any (or perhaps all) of it was an act. Though if it was phony, he certainly miscalculated in keeping it up with the Haywards.

N. Needleman wrote:There is A Lot in here about Carl Rodd. As to the back end of the timeline, though, per the Archivist/Major Briggs, it claims he "returned to his hometown" (Twin Peaks, I believe) in the early 1980s and "took up residence outside Twin Peaks in a brand-new trailer park. He eventually became the manager of this park [...] he lives there in the park to this day."


It also appears that Carl had a "close encounter" with the Lodge spirits as a child in Twin Peaks. That actually fits with what I'd thought for a while about that scene in FWWM where he sees the strange-looking woman and says something like, "I've been places...I just want to stay where I am." My working theory was that he had perhaps entered one of the Lodges or otherwise had a brush with their residents, and that it scared the daylights out of him and left him determined to avoid such things in the future.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby chrisfil » Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:41 pm

Don't know if it's been mentioned before but could the 1991 crime actually be the murder of Coops doppelgänger? Maybe by Annie? She could be being protected. Maybe the doppelgänger story will already have been resolved and the new series deals with the real cooper out of the lodge...


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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed Nov 09, 2016 1:23 pm

wpc77 wrote:We already know of one crossover from 6 Messiahs - Denver Bob appears in that book and SHoTP.


I hadn't heard that before! Can you elaborate at all on DB's characterization in 6 Messiahs? Anything that lends credence to him having any relation to that other Bob? Unfortunately, 6 Messiahs appears to be the one Mark Frost book that isn't on the Kindle store. :-/
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby GaryC » Wed Nov 09, 2016 4:00 pm

Just noticed and not seen it here but in 'Coopers' Andrew Packard file, the Interpol report on Josie lists her alias as Josie PACKARD despite supposedly being written before she'd even met Andrew. Obviously the documents also omit to mention that Cooper was there when she died so not reliable anyway but thought I'd mention it. I was also looking at the passport photocopy especially the dates but couldn't find anything of note yet it seems an odd thing to include if it doesn't convey any information. Weirdly the headings for chapter 2 switches to Chapter 1 but could just be human error, though TP underlines the word 'second' when introducing the second chapter which could be another pointer for the reader to see something is off.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby OK,Bob » Wed Nov 09, 2016 5:01 pm

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
wpc77 wrote:We already know of one crossover from 6 Messiahs - Denver Bob appears in that book and SHoTP.


I hadn't heard that before! Can you elaborate at all on DB's characterization in 6 Messiahs? Anything that lends credence to him having any relation to that other Bob? Unfortunately, 6 Messiahs appears to be the one Mark Frost book that isn't on the Kindle store. :-/


Again, Frost's DB character [Edit: and the journal writer in SHoTP, Wayne Charlie Chance] pre-dates 6 Messiahs by a couple of decades: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2679&p=58227&hilit=denver#p58227
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed Nov 09, 2016 10:06 pm

OK,Bob wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:
wpc77 wrote:We already know of one crossover from 6 Messiahs - Denver Bob appears in that book and SHoTP.


I hadn't heard that before! Can you elaborate at all on DB's characterization in 6 Messiahs? Anything that lends credence to him having any relation to that other Bob? Unfortunately, 6 Messiahs appears to be the one Mark Frost book that isn't on the Kindle store. :-/


Again, Frost's DB character [Edit: and the journal writer in SHoTP, Wayne Charlie Chance] pre-dates 6 Messiahs by a couple of decades: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2679&p=58227&hilit=denver#p58227


That's great, thanks! Sounds like the character is more a Lemurians-type in-joke than a hint at something bigger.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby laughingpinecone » Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:24 am

Mr. Reindeer wrote:
OK,Bob wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:
I hadn't heard that before! Can you elaborate at all on DB's characterization in 6 Messiahs? Anything that lends credence to him having any relation to that other Bob? Unfortunately, 6 Messiahs appears to be the one Mark Frost book that isn't on the Kindle store. :-/


Again, Frost's DB character [Edit: and the journal writer in SHoTP, Wayne Charlie Chance] pre-dates 6 Messiahs by a couple of decades: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2679&p=58227&hilit=denver#p58227


That's great, thanks! Sounds like the character is more a Lemurians-type in-joke than a hint at something bigger.

Definitely an in joke! As an amateur writer, seeing both Frost and Lynch (Log Lady!) recycle their preexisting original character into this setting fills me with glee.
And - not sure if intended, but it would fit the way Twin Peaks does things - recurring names and recurring initials could be loose symbolic ties. "Bob" is shared by an embarrassing number of background characters. and now we have another "D. B." ensnared by the woods. THSOTP plays a lot with this kind of loose connections...
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby GaryC » Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:57 am

Unfortunately Mark Frost has had to cancel uk book signing dates due to illness :(

We are sad to announce that the tour to promote The Secret History of Twin
Peaks by Mark Frost is now postponed until 2017.

Owing to Mark Frost suffering from early symptoms of pneumonia, his doctor has
advised him not to take any long flights and to rest. He therefore will not be
travelling to the UK for press and events next week 14-19 November.

It is with sorrow and disappointment that Mark has had to do this and thanks
his fans for the wonderful support that they have already shown since the
publication of the book. We wish Mark a speedy recovery and hope to reschedule
the tour for early 2017.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby Harry S. Truman » Fri Nov 11, 2016 4:12 pm

Jacoby wrote:All these alternate timeline/reality things are too easy. I expect more from Frost, Lynch, and co, and fully expect something at least as great as they have provided in the past.


I Agree. I don´t know they have planned, but i am sure the TIME WILL BE A ELEMENT FACTOR in the new season. alternative timelines, alternative universe, ect.

Lynch liked forever these idea of the time.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby Harry S. Truman » Fri Nov 11, 2016 4:18 pm

MaiTaiRob wrote:THEORY: Truman has not been re-cast. Forster IS playing Sheriff Truman, but it's Harry's brother Franklin.

Someone has altered the past, which I think is consistent with the stamp, Norma's revised history, and other changes from the original show.

I think it's either Cooper, or someone closely related to him, and I think they did it to protect the people he loves. Norma's changes protect Annie, so what if this person also altered Truman's family history to save his future self from Coop/BOB. Franklin stays sheriff, Truman never picks up the badge.

Originally, Phillip Jeffries was to play a part, and we know he has at least some time travelling abilities. He could have done it, or maybe "Good Dale." Perhaps if you figure out how to exit the Lodge, you can do so at any time. Perhaps Coop left the Lodge in the 70's or 60's (thus the stamp) and set about altering history to shield the people closest to him.

This could also explain allegedly-living characters of Leland and Laura, and would explain the weird "Doing it, then not doing it" stories surrounding Ontkean's involvement. I've always smelled misdirection when it comes to Ontkean's and Graham's involvement, so maybe they can still both come back if the timeline is righted during season 3.

Or, they're really out, because Coop cared enough about them to place them on paths that never cross his own.

Thoughts?



A theory very good!!! I hope to see it. has very much possibilities.
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby _/\_wowbobwow_/\_ » Sat Nov 12, 2016 12:04 pm

chrisfil wrote:Don't know if it's been mentioned before but could the 1991 crime actually be the murder of Coops doppelgänger? Maybe by Annie? She could be being protected. Maybe the doppelgänger story will already have been resolved and the new series deals with the real cooper out of the lodge...


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Please god let this be true rather than this alternate universe, time-travel theory that seems to be very popular. Who's going to be able to follow any of that if the Showtime series turns out to go that way?

Annie could have changed the dossier to hide her own existence (or someone else could have done it)... fascinating. If TP is actually Dale and Annie's daughter and TP has to investigate her own father's murder (even though it was really BoB who was murdered, and good Dale gets out somehow) and then track down her mother (all the while not knowing any of this) and meets up with the Town residents and starts to encounter the lodge beings WOW... as Donald Trump would say, "tremendous."

I'd be way more excited for something like that and it would be more accessible to new fans than the whole time travel plot - yuck
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Re: SPOILERS: The Secret History of Twin Peaks

Postby NormoftheAndes » Sat Nov 12, 2016 1:28 pm

_/\_wowbobwow_/\_ wrote:
chrisfil wrote:Don't know if it's been mentioned before but could the 1991 crime actually be the murder of Coops doppelgänger? Maybe by Annie? She could be being protected. Maybe the doppelgänger story will already have been resolved and the new series deals with the real cooper out of the lodge...


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Please god let this be true rather than this alternate universe, time-travel theory that seems to be very popular. Who's going to be able to follow any of that if the Showtime series turns out to go that way?

Annie could have changed the dossier to hide her own existence (or someone else could have done it)... fascinating. If TP is actually Dale and Annie's daughter and TP has to investigate her own father's murder (even though it was really BoB who was murdered, and good Dale gets out somehow) and then track down her mother (all the while not knowing any of this) and meets up with the Town residents and starts to encounter the lodge beings WOW... as Donald Trump would say, "tremendous."

I'd be way more excited for something like that and it would be more accessible to new fans than the whole time travel plot - yuck


Its a clever idea but honestly, really not sure about that being an 'accessible' idea! Compare that plot to how the first season began, its a completely different, convoluted sort of fantasy.

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