Does Anyone Dislike Episode 29?

[Aqua]

One could argue that Earle can still be considered (without overthinking it, since the relative weight of the character indeed ended up light) a highly successful mcguffin because of the way successful mcguffins are, helping achieve more important goals as they do even if unintentionally/in hindsight. I.e. was it not for the goofiness of certain scenes with him (that may have also indirectly later influenced the more basic tone of the scripts for the final episodes as per above), there would importantly exist less blank space and the resulting need/kick to improvisingly compensate it not only with the cliffhangers, but full-fledged, extended dive into Coop's - and then Laura's - crucial moments and psyches at the end (finale and fwwm).

Plus, it was purportedly that Earle let/embraced the lodge on his own will mostly - and thus, he could not have been portrayed as covert but still weakishly retaining his human qualities as Leland or even as (supposedly) a mostly fully switched Coop at the end of S2. This, coupled with the fact that he has been in most actuality used not only by the series but also by the lodge itself after his FBI exit mostly only as a key to get access to Cooper, could mean that he wasn't fully embraced/utilized by the evil and thus his diminishing personality being portrayed the way it was.

Which in its own turn, bodes positively for the new season by again having left sort of a space for a stark contrast to potentially concentrate on the wildly converted Coop (with maybe a growing as opposed to a decaying personality if say he indeed has become a strong pawn for the lodge) as been discussed here in the forums. And even if it's the opposite, and he has actively fought Bob within him or else been up to something different in the last 25 years, Earle's character portrayal would thus still remain correct/exact.

[bowisneski]

I even showed him FWwM right after episode 14 as an experiment, and he was all about it and couldn't believe it when I told him it didn't receive the warmest welcome back in the day.

Interesting placement; the Twin Peaks machete order! I read an article a while back that made a compelling case for watching the film there - is that where you got the idea or did you come up with it independently?

I know some people on the old Usenet boards were disappointed with the finale and I've definitely seen a lot of new viewers frustrated by it (albeit usually in the "that was really good but whaaaaaat?" fashion).

It was actually a combo. My idea originally had been to show it after episode 16. I decided to research the idea to see if anyone had done it because I was afraid of spoiling things for him, and while searching I think I came up with the article you mentioned. I felt the post 14 placement was better in the end because it comes before you have Leland have his touching semi-redemptive discussion with Coop as he passes.

I also like it better myself because it sometimes feels to me like after the end of episode 29, I still have the feeling of wanting to jump right back in to the Coop storyline after that cliffhanger. And I know we sort of do, but that wasn't the way I saw it on my first watch through in 06. I was actually disappointed with FWwM back then. It felt overwhelming to me. Maybe it was because I was fresh off the show, or because I was 16 and not ready for that experience having grown up in a small town and having never seen anything else Lynch before. I actually never rewatched it until the blu came out. But on that second watch I absolutely loved it, and had only the slightest inkling of why my younger self had not liked it.

And thank you all for the well thought out and helpful responses.

My reaction the first time I watched it was impatience, especially in the bank vault. Knowing this was it for Peaks, besides a prequel, caused me to go "why the hell are we focusing on the inconsequential stuff. But after the Red Room and final moments I had come around and loved at least all of that stuff. The things I was frustrated with on my first view were the Donna scene(pre-arrival of Doc), the Nadine stuff, and the bank scene. However, I actually really enjoyed all of those things on my first rewatch a day or two later, and every subsequent viewing(with or without a full series rewatch) I enjoy it more and more. Knowing what happened I was able to just appreciate the beauty of the shots, the wonderful quirk of the scenes, and this time with these characters.

One place I seem to be totally out of whack though is that I actually like Earle quite a bit. I love his clash with the style and feeling because he is a complete outsider to the town who has no interest in the town itself. He really is the anti Dale and I think it comes across well. I wish he had been a little more menacing here and there, but overall I really like him.

And I totally agree with you, David Locked. As pumped as I am about returning to the world(Secret Hostory was literally just delivered!!) it feels like that moment will never be as strong again. And maybe that's part of his issue my friend can't yet articulate yet. He knows there is more coming. The cliffhanger just loses some punch when you know that there will be some sort of resolution.

[laughingpinecone]

I love how Windom's relevance was undercut by the actual powers he was sure he'd be able to control and I would have liked him a lot better if the writing up to that point had been aware of that. Season 1 was very good with undetectable foreshadowing ("I'll be the woman of his dreams" still gives me the shivers), I would've liked something like that. Watch it for the first time, believe in the threat he poses; watch it for the second time, realize that he was completely out of his depth all along.

And/or show him as completely broken by his search for the Lodge, if they could come up with something more nuanced than "stock mad genius". Show Coop terrified by the brilliant man he remembers (MLMT Windom, whom I find a compelling sleazeball), but also show that the man he remembers is not the man we're seeing on screen, there's a discrepancy there, a potentially interesting tension that the story could exploit.

[Aqua]

Yeah, true that his character could have been more developed from a guy brilliant, but in a down-to-earth and maybe slightly liberally mannered way, he seemed pre-lodge on the 'dugpas they're called' tapings and mlmt. It does seem that there is a lack of an intrinsic hook for him to become connected with the lodge, the way eccentricity and impulsivity say was for coop; hopelessness/feeling small in life maybe in the face of the all-scorching, relentless force of Bob etc. I may be forgetting certain details though, and this again may have been analyzed more exactly elsewhere.

Overall though, if taking much of the later S2 as bearing relative little weight as such ado before crucial events (or the increasingly chaotic dream before ending) usually does, the empty, shell-type personality originally fitted - and served - well as much it can be remembered in retrospect back in the -naughties

[Aqua]

Is it weird that I almost miss the way that Episode 29 felt before we knew we'd be getting new episodes? Watching for the first time in 2009, or subsequent rewatches in 2011-2013 and such, that ending was SUCH a kick in the face, I mean it hurt but the power and the audacity and bitterness and darkness of it all was so unprecedented in TV finales. So now knowing we're actually getting more kind of changes that sense.

Don't get me wrong, I'm over the moon that there's another season of this show, I'm just kinda saying, on some small level I really perversely enjoyed the fucked-up feeling you got from watching 29 and knowing that it was (in all likelihood) THE END. Just really made a deep impression on me.

^ seconded fully, both today (20 years left with THAT) and at the time; may only add that after such long time getting news in 2014-2015 on filming uncovered that the readiness to receive more was there, however not a year being left with it felt wasted. Hooking up an army of underaged fans for the comeback in 25 years with all the unexpected, morally blunt force of coop's turn impacting tender psyches (talk dostoevsky of this age), or they weren't aware of them with the size of the phenomena they generated

[Soolsma]

It was extremely silly Ronette Pulaski is apparently always present at the police station, just in case some oils need to be smelled.

I've read somewhere it was Lynch who put this in... silly old Lynch ^^

[PeaksCarnivaleLost]

I didn't care for it.

All that running around when you have no idea of the layout just annoys me.

Laura screaming over and over was just ridiculous. (I fall asleep to Netflix trying to get Peaks dreams and those scenes always wake me up, along with the neighbors)

More friends! Hey, woohoo. Where is that original script again?

I am dying to introduce a few people to the show in advance of S3 but I can't work around the S2 lull and the finale. I doubt that would make anyone geeked for the new episodes.

Maybe since I just read Frost's book I can give some backstory that might help smooth it all over for any newbies. But best bet is probably just start watching S3 (which I believe will be stand-alone ish) and then go back during the week to watch the oldies.

[bowisneski]

Original Episode 29 script http://www.glastonberrygrove.net/texts/script29.pdf

[Johnsusername]

Each to their own! It's one of my favourite episodes. As much as I love Twin Peaks, I'm as much a David Lynch fan and am glad he took over. I'm hoping series 3 is more Lynch.

[StealThisCorn]

How can you say Windom Earle is some sort of redundant aspect of the episode, when he was, bar Cooper, the most important element that led to the Black Lodge?! Moreover, it's not like the episode took its sweet time to wrap up his storyline (not that I'm complaining - I think his undoing at the hands of Bob was the stuff of brilliance!)...
On other front, I'm inclined to agree with you about the merit of Episode 9 (I take it that you mean the second ep of S 2, which also goes by the name "Coma" in some circles?).

The episode made it painfully clear how little interest Lynch had in focusing on Cooper and Windom's actual confrontation, despite a long mishandled buildup to that "moment".

I actually meant Episode 9, aka "May the Giant Be With You". But "Coma" is very good as well.

[dweller]

Hi. I've only recently found this forum and it's probably been discussed here at some point in the past, but I'm wondering what the theories are regarding the involuntary twitching/shaking of the arms/hands signifies in the townsfolk (and Cooper) in the build up to the series finale?

[FrightNight]

How can you say Windom Earle is some sort of redundant aspect of the episode, when he was, bar Cooper, the most important element that led to the Black Lodge?! Moreover, it's not like the episode took its sweet time to wrap up his storyline (not that I'm complaining - I think his undoing at the hands of Bob was the stuff of brilliance!)...
On other front, I'm inclined to agree with you about the merit of Episode 9 (I take it that you mean the second ep of S 2, which also goes by the name "Coma" in some circles?).

The episode made it painfully clear how little interest Lynch had in focusing on Cooper and Windom's actual confrontation, despite a long mishandled buildup to that "moment".

I actually meant Episode 9, aka "May the Giant Be With You". But "Coma" is very good as well.

True dat (regarding Lynch swiftly brushing off the Cooper-Earle duel). Still, calling all the Windom stuff redundant does seem a little exaggerated; not only does it function as the main storyline for about a third of the whole show, we also learn a good deal about Cooper's past and overall persona through the character of Windom. It's absolutely your right to like the character and his arc or not (someone's taste cannot be the subject of arguing), but we simply can't say he was only a meaningless fluff on the level of Evelyn Marsh, Little Nicky, Lana Milford, Dick Tremayne etc., at least he wasn't conceived as such by whoever was running the show in that period (and since Lynch had a right to interfere but didn't, he sort of gave it his blessing, I take it). I would go so far as to suggest Windom Earle is one of the three most important characters to influence Cooper's fate, second only to Laura (the third one is Annie Blackburn); and if we take in the factor of his influnce extending back to the time well before the beginning of the series (where his wife also comes into play), his importance for (the shaping of) our protagonist is practically unparalleled. I'm aware that a good deal of people here will find these assertions a borderline sacrilege (what with the whole silly make-ups and chess obssession and such), but facts as presented in the show and in Scott Frost's My Life, My Tapes book speak in their favor.

Ah, I see you actually went by the same numeration for the episodes that I use (I count the pilot as Ep 1, not simply as "The Pilot"; consequently, the last ep's number is 30, not 29) - that's a rare thing around these parts (and before anyone reminds me, I realize it's not the official numeration, but that one just doesn't make sense to me) Yeah, I like the S 2 opening a lot, but not as much as other three Lynch-directed episodes in S 2 ("Coma", "Lonely Souls" and "Beyond Life and Death") - I would have an extremely hard time if I had to pick a favourite out of these three.

[Panapaok]

It's a mostly masterful episode. I don't think I dislike any of the episodes. What I dislike though, is subplots and some of them are unfortunately carried on the last one and make it weaker. All the Cooper/Black Lodge stuff are absolutely mesmerising but still this episode is downgraded a bit because of indifferent storyilnes, such as Donna's fatherhood, the whole Andrew Packard subplot and Nadine's & Mike's affair. I kinda wish that all the cliffhangers would be presented in the penultimate episode and the last one would only include the Cooper scenes. From the sheriff's station to the woods and from the Lodge to the Great Northern.

[OK,Bob]

Love all of the Lynch-directed episodes, but I'll admit the Red Room sequence here strikes me a feeling a bit too rushed - perhaps it's the staging, the bright lighting, and even the sound design* in many of the shots. Feels to me like the long-night improvisation on a sound-stage that it actually was. By comparison, the sequenced that appeared as Cooper's dream feels more carefully executed, and I prefer the softer lighting. I can't imagine a character in the earlier sequence flashing a smile at the camera. Meh...

*i.e. Dopple-Cooper's laugh as he chases Coop.

That said, lifelong fan here...

[djerdap]

It's a mostly masterful episode. I don't think I dislike any of the episodes. What I dislike though, is subplots and some of them are unfortunately carried on the last one and make it weaker. All the Cooper/Black Lodge stuff are absolutely mesmerising but still this episode is downgraded a bit because of indifferent storyilnes, such as Donna's fatherhood, the whole Andrew Packard subplot and Nadine's & Mike's affair. I kinda wish that all the cliffhangers would be presented in the penultimate episode and the last one would only include the Cooper scenes. From the sheriff's station to the woods and from the Lodge to the Great Northern.

I actually thought Lynch managed to make those boring subplots at least slightly more interesting. For example, the bank scene is just a fantastically constructed scene, both hilarious and shocking, which is ironic since I couldn't care less for the Andrew Packard subplot. The character of Nadine finally gets some of the old pathos back, which was missing since the first season. The weakest scene is probably the Doc Hayward/Ben confrontation, but that doesn't diminish the whole experience at all.

Even my favorite episode, Episode 2, has the cheesy Donna/James scene at the beginning which is far below the quality of pretty much anything else in that hour. It's part of the charm of Twin Peaks to have those silly tonal shifts. In fact, what I think makes episode 29 so successful is that the tone of utter dread and paranoia is ingrained in even the most banal of subplots.