NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

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John Justice Wheeler
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby John Justice Wheeler » Tue May 23, 2017 1:12 pm

dkenny78 wrote: I know that Lynch and Frost felt strongly about this not being a binge-show, but that philosophy feels somewhat at odds with the '18-hour movie' structure. If the show had more in common with traditional episodic TV, with each week offering a series of setups/payoffs, A-stories and B-stories, etc., I could understand that approach. But a sprawling, complex, challenging epic doled out over the course of 16 weeks might cause a lot of people to jump ship before they can see what we hope is a truly magnificent forest for the trees.

Yes, this is exactly what I thought upon seeing the new episodes. In fact, this to me seems the biggest issue of them all because I too find the show very difficult and frustrating and much of that has to do with being unable to assess it properly as it's been constructed as an 18 hour whole in which threads can develop slowly and attain coherence through that development later. It's an entirely different way to assess success and makes dong so via the current episodic output virtually impossible and meaningless.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby Jonah » Tue May 23, 2017 1:26 pm

John Justice Wheeler wrote:
dkenny78 wrote: I know that Lynch and Frost felt strongly about this not being a binge-show, but that philosophy feels somewhat at odds with the '18-hour movie' structure. If the show had more in common with traditional episodic TV, with each week offering a series of setups/payoffs, A-stories and B-stories, etc., I could understand that approach. But a sprawling, complex, challenging epic doled out over the course of 16 weeks might cause a lot of people to jump ship before they can see what we hope is a truly magnificent forest for the trees.

Yes, this is exactly what I thought upon seeing the new episodes. In fact, this to me seems the biggest issue of them all because I too find the show very difficult and frustrating and much of that has to do with being unable to assess it properly as it's been constructed as an 18 hour whole in which threads can develop slowly and attain coherence through that development later. It's an entirely different way to assess success and makes dong so via the current episodic output virtually impossible and meaningless.


I really do wonder why Lynch has been adamant about it being an 18-hour film, even down to insisting each installment be referred to as a "Part" (rather than an "episode") AND having it referred to as a film in the closing credits, YET has also insisted it be broadcast weekly like "episodes" of a tv "series". Seems like an oxymoron and a weird disconnect, I know it's Lynch, but still!

I would love it if Showtime decided - after conferring with Lynch - to upload it all. But I think this is unlikely as, even if Lynch agreed to this, wouldn't they lose potential revenue? After all, people who only signed up to Showtime (and affiliates) for this, could potentially cancel their subscription much sooner, whereas by playing it all summer, they get to keep people signed up longer, plus probably more additional hype/revenue.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby adl345 » Tue May 23, 2017 1:28 pm

Here's the barometer of whether or the show is a cultural success: if the pop culture sites are still writing about it by week 12.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby The Jumping Man » Tue May 23, 2017 1:37 pm

Man, I'm glad they didn't drop all the episodes at once. It would already be over, and I'm so looking forward to a summer of exquisite torture!
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby mtwentz » Tue May 23, 2017 1:39 pm

Jonah wrote:
John Justice Wheeler wrote:
dkenny78 wrote: I know that Lynch and Frost felt strongly about this not being a binge-show, but that philosophy feels somewhat at odds with the '18-hour movie' structure. If the show had more in common with traditional episodic TV, with each week offering a series of setups/payoffs, A-stories and B-stories, etc., I could understand that approach. But a sprawling, complex, challenging epic doled out over the course of 16 weeks might cause a lot of people to jump ship before they can see what we hope is a truly magnificent forest for the trees.

Yes, this is exactly what I thought upon seeing the new episodes. In fact, this to me seems the biggest issue of them all because I too find the show very difficult and frustrating and much of that has to do with being unable to assess it properly as it's been constructed as an 18 hour whole in which threads can develop slowly and attain coherence through that development later. It's an entirely different way to assess success and makes dong so via the current episodic output virtually impossible and meaningless.


I really do wonder why Lynch has been adamant about it being an 18-hour film, even down to insisting each installment be referred to as a "Part" (rather than an "episode") AND having it referred to as a film in the closing credits, YET has also insisted it be broadcast weekly like "episodes" of a tv "series". Seems like an oxymoron and a weird disconnect, I know it's Lynch, but still!

I would love it if Showtime decided - after conferring with Lynch - to upload it all. But I think this is unlikely as, even if Lynch agreed to this, wouldn't they lose potential revenue? After all, people who only signed up to Showtime (and affiliates) for this, could potentially cancel their subscription much sooner, whereas by playing it all summer, they get to keep people signed up longer, plus probably more additional hype/revenue.


For the sake of this board, I really am glad they did not allow us to binge watch. If they did, we'd be all over the place as to how far along each of us is in terms of the number of episodes watched, and it would make discussion, the water cooler effect, more difficult.

As it is, we have to deal with the fact some of us have seen only episode 1 and 2.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby Jonah » Tue May 23, 2017 1:48 pm

I don't think it would be a good idea to watch all 18 episodes at once, but I still feel this version is something that will not work as a weekly show and should be available to dip in and out of at our leisure, especially as Lynch himself calls it a film - and from what I've seen it really is. Apart from each arc closing with a song in the roadhouse, I don't really feel like they're separate episodes. (Maybe a little bit with 3 and 4, but still not really.) I also think the viewership may continue to fall off as it progresses. Even two episodes a week might have been a better idea. Also, that would have gone along with the 9 weeks Showtime had originally intended it to play for as a limited series. I think an entire summer of this kind of unusual narrative and filmic structure just won't operate well as a long 18-week series.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby underthefan » Tue May 23, 2017 2:33 pm

I haven't been on dugpa since Friday and I have decided to stay out of the spoilers threads for two reasons: 1) I don't want others' impressions to color mine; 2) You guys a smart bunch and I have no doubt sooner or later one of you is going to figure out the whole thing, and thus ruin it for me. I'm not sure what people's reactions are, but I can imagine. Those looking for a return to the original series will be disappointed (heavily, I assume), while those who are fans of Lynch, rather than just the show itself, will find plenty in it to appreciate and love. In fact, the show feels like Lynch's Greatest Hits and I mean that as a compliment. Personally, I am thrilled that this is not in any way a nostalgia cashgrab, but a well thought-out, considered season with its own feeling, atmosphere, and visual identity. Bring on the next 14 hours!
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby Jonah » Tue May 23, 2017 2:37 pm

Lovely post underthefan!

Looking forward to Episode 5. The two-week wait will be hard! I'm considering skipping a few weeks and watching in bulk as I still think this will be a better way to watch it. Remember the rumour that Episodes 5 & 6 would be available for streaming next week after 3 & 4 are officially aired? Shame that's not going to be the case. As for ratings, I know Episodes 1 & 2 had disappointing figures - but won't they be even lower next week given those episodes were already put on demand and that its a holiday?
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby Bloodflood » Tue May 23, 2017 2:37 pm

Watched both ways and parts 1&2 worked better edited as one episode.
Last edited by Bloodflood on Tue May 23, 2017 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby Rudagger » Tue May 23, 2017 4:34 pm

Bloodflood wrote:Watched both ways and parts 1&2 worked better edited as one episoded.


I think my dream is that for the Blu-ray release they have it so the entire thing is cut as one continuous film (obviously probably with some disk-change points).

(Perhaps they can keep the 'parts' intact as well for the sake of keeping film history intact)
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby dkenny78 » Tue May 23, 2017 5:03 pm

Jonah wrote:Even two episodes a week might have been a better idea. Also, that would have gone along with the 9 weeks Showtime had originally intended it to play for as a limited series.


Yeah, I agree. 9 weeks of two episodes each seems like a good compromise but there are financial benefits for Showtime to stretch it out over 3-4 billing cycles. I wonder that, if they lose momentum fast, they might end up going this route anyway to get to the end game more quickly. Ending in mid-July as opposed to early September would allow them to avoid the Ray Donovan schedule change and the competition from Game of Thrones, not to mention the finale awkwardly falling on Labor Day weekend.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue May 23, 2017 6:11 pm

underthefan wrote:I haven't been on dugpa since Friday and I have decided to stay out of the spoilers threads for two reasons: 1) I don't want others' impressions to color mine; 2) You guys a smart bunch and I have no doubt sooner or later one of you is going to figure out the whole thing, and thus ruin it for me. I'm not sure what people's reactions are, but I can imagine. Those looking for a return to the original series will be disappointed (heavily, I assume), while those who are fans of Lynch, rather than just the show itself, will find plenty in it to appreciate and love. In fact, the show feels like Lynch's Greatest Hits and I mean that as a compliment. Personally, I am thrilled that this is not in any way a nostalgia cashgrab, but a well thought-out, considered season with its own feeling, atmosphere, and visual identity. Bring on the next 14 hours!


I personally find it extremely unlikely that anyone will figure out what's going on before the show reveals the endgame (or, God forbid, a leak occurs). Every show from Westworld to Mr. Robot to Lost has had its "central mystery" figured out by crowd-sourcing fans pretty early on (Mr. Robot brilliantly used this as an asset -- and yes, I'm oversimplifying a bit with Lost, which I love). But her we are, nearly a quarter of the way into the new TP already (incredible and depressing to consider), and, having perused the spoiler threads, I'm 90% percent no one has come close to hitting the nail on the head. And I don't think anyone in the fandom -- possibly in the world -- is capable of predicting what DKL might be up to. He's a true original.
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby mfleite » Tue May 23, 2017 7:01 pm

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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby speedbeatz » Tue May 23, 2017 7:56 pm

Jonah wrote:I really do wonder why Lynch has been adamant about it being an 18-hour film, even down to insisting each installment be referred to as a "Part" (rather than an "episode") AND having it referred to as a film in the closing credits, YET has also insisted it be broadcast weekly like "episodes" of a tv "series". Seems like an oxymoron and a weird disconnect, I know it's Lynch, but still!

Is there any evidence that this is the case? I've always assumed that the traditional weekly split was a caveat put forth by Showtime in order to ensure that they have a good chance to directly make back some actual money on their investment. (The longer the show airs, the more subscribers you pull in and the longer they stay subscribed.)
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Re: NON SPOILERS: Twin Peaks: Season 3 on Showtime Thread

Postby Hockey Mask » Tue May 23, 2017 8:03 pm

dkenny78 wrote:
Jonah wrote:Even two episodes a week might have been a better idea. Also, that would have gone along with the 9 weeks Showtime had originally intended it to play for as a limited series.


Yeah, I agree. 9 weeks of two episodes each seems like a good compromise but there are financial benefits for Showtime to stretch it out over 3-4 billing cycles. I wonder that, if they lose momentum fast, they might end up going this route anyway to get to the end game more quickly. Ending in mid-July as opposed to early September would allow them to avoid the Ray Donovan schedule change and the competition from Game of Thrones, not to mention the finale awkwardly falling on Labor Day weekend.

I would bet the opposite is more likely. They would delay nine episodes to get MORE billing cycles.

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