Season 4? Or is it over after this?

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LateReg
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby LateReg » Thu Dec 10, 2020 3:11 pm

JackwithOneEye wrote:I don't know if it's been mentioned here or not, but Production Weekly is now listing the title as Unrecorded Night. and Wisteria as a working title or whatever.


Yes, I mentioned that yesterday. But thank you for putting it back into focus! I really love that title. So evocative.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Thu Dec 10, 2020 3:23 pm

This may be a naive question, but why would a show have a working title if it already has a real title? My guess is “Wisteria” was supposed to act as a fake title during production, but Production Weekly has now ruined that, so maybe Lynch will pick something else?
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby mtwentz » Thu Dec 10, 2020 3:45 pm

Mr. Reindeer wrote:This may be a naive question, but why would a show have a working title if it already has a real title? My guess is “Wisteria” was supposed to act as a fake title during production, but Production Weekly has now ruined that, so maybe Lynch will pick something else?


Unrecorded Night means it's definitely Peaks related, right?
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JackwithOneEye
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby JackwithOneEye » Thu Dec 10, 2020 4:41 pm

good question. I worked on a few high profile movies and we wrote the cover titles on camera reports and paperwork, emails, etc . but everyone knew the cover title, so its kinda pointless. i guess for people who dont read production weekly, maybe it's effective, i really dont know.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby JackwithOneEye » Thu Dec 10, 2020 4:45 pm

mtwentz wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:This may be a naive question, but why would a show have a working title if it already has a real title? My guess is “Wisteria” was supposed to act as a fake title during production, but Production Weekly has now ruined that, so maybe Lynch will pick something else?


Unrecorded Night means it's definitely Peaks related, right?


i'm still in the camp thinking its not Peaks. Netflix probably wants a fresh slate, new mystery. moving all the showtime eps over to netflix and doing a continuation of the carrie page-verse may be hard to market, and only hardcore maniacs like us on dugpa boards would be the audience. I could be totally wrong tho, just my gut instinct + mark frost's denials.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Thu Dec 10, 2020 4:52 pm

JackwithOneEye wrote:good question. I worked on a few high profile movies and we wrote the cover titles on camera reports and paperwork, emails, etc . but everyone knew the cover title, so its kinda pointless. i guess for people who dont read production weekly, maybe it's effective, i really dont know.


Fair, the Internet has definitely made it tougher to keep this kind of thing under wraps. I guess I’m usually not following the making of, say, a Marvel or Star Wars or whatever this early on, so I’m not really sure when these codename working titles become common knowledge. Certainly, by the time a Marvel movie is in the production phase, word seems to spread on Reddit and such what title they’re filming under, but I figured that was by fan word of mouth. I didn’t realize that trade publications actually just put the info out there!
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby JackwithOneEye » Thu Dec 10, 2020 6:29 pm

the spielberg movie The Post , the cover title was Nor'easter, but the production title was The Papers, somewhere along the way after filming it became The Post though. but the swag they gave out said The Papers, so that was intended to be the final title for awhile. in any case, everybody knew the story , so there were no spoilers to uncover really, but for insurance purposes, using the cover title theoretically a good idea, so people dont steal drives or film or something that the insurance company would have to reimburse. and if it's high profile, and you have to do an exterior, best to put cover title on permits to help keep the hordes away. but if someone has the internet and whatnot, easy for movie fans to figure out cover titles, especially if these trades just blurt it out.

maybe there's indecision on whether it should be Unrecorded Night or Wisteria. Rancho Rosa was also the name of the production company, and I seem to remember that was used as a cover title (?). I havent heard about anything like Wisteria Productions being set up, but that could be a possibility I suppose.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Thu Dec 10, 2020 6:35 pm

Yeah, Rancho Rosa was the TP cover title, but fans sussed it out pretty quickly. That made sense because obviously TP is a well known property and, as you say, they wanted to keep the hordes away. In this case, I think the “Wisteria” title is currently far more circulated online than Unrecorded Night. Not a very effective cover! Obviously no one gives a damn about either title, outside of the knowledge that it’s a Lynch project.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby Jasper » Thu Dec 10, 2020 7:03 pm

JackwithOneEye wrote:
mtwentz wrote:
Mr. Reindeer wrote:This may be a naive question, but why would a show have a working title if it already has a real title? My guess is “Wisteria” was supposed to act as a fake title during production, but Production Weekly has now ruined that, so maybe Lynch will pick something else?


Unrecorded Night means it's definitely Peaks related, right?


i'm still in the camp thinking its not Peaks. Netflix probably wants a fresh slate, new mystery. moving all the showtime eps over to netflix and doing a continuation of the carrie page-verse may be hard to market, and only hardcore maniacs like us on dugpa boards would be the audience. I could be totally wrong tho, just my gut instinct + mark frost's denials.


I also continue to doubt that this project is Twin Peaks related. As for Netflix, I'm not so sure about that. Twin Peaks didn't have huge ratings on Showtime, but it drove subscriptions, and sold tons of merch. Netflix is all about subscriptions, and a NEW Lynch project could be much harder to market, and I suspect that it would be a much bigger risk both in terms of getting people to watch it, and ending up with a product that's accessible. Honestly, if The Return had been on Netflix, I suspect that it would have done significantly better. Netflix could even be able to bring wider attention to The Return if they acquired it and pushed it in the long wait for a hypothetical continuation, but I doubt that they'd acquire it or even acquire temporary rights to show it.

I still think that this probably has nothing to do with Peaks, but the filings of various legal documents and the timing of those filings allows for a tiny possibility that it's some kind of radical continuation. It's true that Frost dropped out of FWWM because Lynch wanted it to be primarily a prequel, and strictly in terms of its success at the box office, and even among a lot of major fans (at least at the time), I think Frost had it exactly right. On the other hand, Frost was responsible for the idea of setting much of The Return outside of the town itself, and was probably also a big part of crafting the gigantic mythology that it presents. That said, whatever this is, I suspect that Lynch just wanted to make something having more or less total artistic control, start to finish, and I can't blame him for that, especially in the likely event that this is not a Twin Peaks project.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby JackwithOneEye » Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:27 pm

Jasper - all good points.

Twin Peaks is definitely a valued property, and I remember quotes from someone corporate at Netflix years ago who said they would love to have new Twin Peaks. I do feel though that a spin off Carrie Page alternate dimension multiverse prequel show under another title might be convoluted to explain to people, particularly as a follow up to a season from Showtime that isn't as iconic as the original, wouldn't excite them as much. Unless it's the Twin Peaks brand name, I think they'd prefer a clean slate. But I could be wrong.

re: Twin Peaks Productions.

I hadn't realized that Lynch/Frost Productions had changed it's name to Twin Peaks Productions until I found this 1993 lawsuit online against Penguin/ Publications International for the Welcome to Twin Peaks: A Complete Guide to Who's Who and What's What book, which I may own somewhere. According to this lawsuit, 'TPP (formerly Lynch/Frost Productions) ' is listed in the verbiage.

https://law.justia.com/cases/federal/ap ... 66/181394/

But there are errors in here, it lists David Lynch as creator of the show, and Mark Frost as producer of the show.

That said, I'm not sure what the new corporate filing of Twin Peaks Productions looks like compared to an older one. I've seen fan theory/speculation that Frost had been listed as a corporate officer on a previous one, but I haven't seen a previous filing myself.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby Rhodes » Fri Dec 11, 2020 12:58 am

FormicaTable wrote:Good grief. This thread has been hijacked. Full stop. Can we shut it down and please take the political convo elsewhere?


Well, in all fairness, these political forces are aiming to take over the world (including our beloved shows and directors). So, it is definitely not (completely) off-topic. We live in very dangerous times and it is inevitable that people are worried about woke culture (and its effects on art).

But I guess everything has been said, so we should move on. (But let's all stay alert, folks!)

Is there a poll on this forum whether we would prefer Twin Peaks S4 or an entire new show by Lynch? I couldn't find it. Me, I'm more or less indifferent (very hyped for both). If I had to choose, I would slightly prefer a new show (if it is a 'typical' Lynch-show, that is).
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby Soolsma » Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:27 am

Jasper wrote:Honestly, if The Return had been on Netflix, I suspect that it would have done significantly better.


Yep, I believe the same. I even think the show would have been better in itself, and I think Lynch does too, which is why I'm quite convinced the Netflix rumor is real. I mean, he was spotted at their HQ so he must at the very least have talked/negotiated with them. That and that one source being very adamant on it being real.

So far my bets are on:
Wisteria - Working Title/codename
Unrecorded Night - Actual Title
A2K Productions, inc - Lynch's new solo TV production company. Might be used for future products as well...
Carrie Page: "It's a long way... In those days, I was too young to know any better."
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby krishnanspace » Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:19 am

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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby eyeboogers » Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:36 am

Soolsma wrote: I'm quite convinced the Netflix rumor is real. I mean, he was spotted at their HQ so he must at the very least have talked/negotiated with them. .


The much documented meeting was reportedly about Duwayne Dunham's upcoming film "The Happy Worker", Lynch is that films executive producer.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?

Postby JackwithOneEye » Fri Dec 11, 2020 9:14 am

I agree that Unrecorded Night is the actual title.

The US copyright office likes things to be exact, and I don't think that in the event of any lawsuits, judges have time or interest in cover titles/ code titles, and could create wiggle room in arguments etc. Makes more sense to just make it air tight. That's my reaction after having read the Twin Peaks Productions vs Penguin lawsuit brief online, where there was citations of what had been specifically copyrighted in terms of teleplays and programs themselves.

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