Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

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Saturn's child
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Saturn's child » Fri Sep 01, 2017 12:26 pm

Hester Prynne wrote:As You Like It has an Audrey and Billy (William) and characters in disguise escaping to a forest.


Nice; shake that speare Hester! I really like your idea regarding the red room's curtains, it's a nice way of feeling 'beyond life and death', into the realm of abstract representation where we become aware of the stage we were on, the curtains we appeared from / are going to. A black & white stage, in front of some (womb) red curtains? Pretty good microcosm of life right there.
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby starmand » Fri Sep 01, 2017 9:56 pm

Just rewatched part 2. Might have been mentioned already, but isn't the sound that plays when Laura removes her face the same sound as the tone Ben and Beverly are hunting in the great northern (among other uses this season)?
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby douglasb » Sat Sep 02, 2017 2:08 am

Watched 16 with my wife last night. She wondered if Cooper was going back to 're-set' TP somehow. Could he create a happy Palmer family? Can Coop re-imagine the Horne family (inc. Richard) as well as the Jones' and Palmers?
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Oneeyedwaldo
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Oneeyedwaldo » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:40 am

I know this might sound really far fetched but I'm currently watching blue velvet. Now I know that there are loads of theories of TP and BV either existing in the same or a relative universe.
Some of the sounds used in BV are the same or similar to S3 of TP and I'm not talking about the music. Even though that is very similar too.
There's a part where Jeffery is walking on the street after figuring out who Gordon is. There's the eerie wind sound that starts on s3. I know it's a massive long shot but I can see some correlation.
I wonder if what Laura Palmer said to Cooper was, "you're real name is Jeffery Bouemont".
I can probably gather people have already said this and this will fade into obscurity!
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Jerry Horne » Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:32 pm

Hmmm. Not sure about this.
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Jerry Horne » Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:46 pm

I just tweeted this then Mark Frost retweeted it. Unless Mark is playing around, it is him.
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Pinky » Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:48 pm

Jerry Horne wrote:Hmmm. Not sure about this.


it looks pretty convincing to me. Still looks uncannily like a young Keith Carradine!
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:34 pm

Jerry Horne wrote:I just tweeted this then Mark Frost retweeted it. Unless Mark is playing around, it is him.


Credit where it's due: board user Mibbler pointed this out a couple of weeks ago: viewtopic.php?f=31&t=3778&p=111169&hilit=Blevins#p111169

It's a pretty uncanny resemblance for sure. No clue what it means.
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Jerry Horne » Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:41 pm

Good job mibbler. What does it mean though? Are we to think that this is not any dream sequence?
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AgentEcho
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby AgentEcho » Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:23 pm

It's interesting that Frost retweeted it. He's pretty judicious about what he tweets about Twin Peaks wise. I don't know what it means. There's not much to compare between the two realities. Cooper and the RR are slightly different. Someone else is living in Laura's house. We don't have much non-tulpa Diane to compare, and who knows what's up with Carrie/Laura. Is this some clue to figuring that out? Regardless it's probably safe to assume this version of the character is different then the one that encountered Janey-E, which tells us even less than it would if we could assume it was the same character.
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby claaa7 » Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:36 am

AgentEcho wrote:It's interesting that Frost retweeted it. He's pretty judicious about what he tweets about Twin Peaks wise. I don't know what it means. There's not much to compare between the two realities. Cooper and the RR are slightly different. Someone else is living in Laura's house. We don't have much non-tulpa Diane to compare, and who knows what's up with Carrie/Laura. Is this some clue to figuring that out? Regardless it's probably safe to assume this version of the character is different then the one that encountered Janey-E, which tells us even less than it would if we could assume it was the same character.


it reminds me of how Lynch used the actor Gene Silva to portray both the Club Silencio manager and Cookie downtown in Mulholland Dr. to this day i have never seen a theory that connects the how and why.. i know he is credited twice so it's different characters.
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Panapaok » Thu Sep 28, 2017 2:28 am

Hmm, Lynch usually chooses actors based on their head shots. Maybe Lynch really liked him and he just used him for that small role too.
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Thu Sep 28, 2017 5:27 am

So what do we know about Tommy/Blevins in Part 6? He's a loan shark. He acts tough but is kind of a pushover (it's funny how both DougieCoop and Janey-E turn tough gangsters into pussycats -- Dougie with sweetness and humanity, Janey-E by cowing them with anger and guilting them. They're a dynamic duo!). Janey-E equates Tommy with the big banks as part of the problem of the greed, and lack of humanity and compassion in modern America (I doubt DKL was going for an overtly political message, but this might have played some part of it in Frost's mind, and the comparison is right there in the text as a major theme of the only scene where we see Tommy alive). This may fit with the fact that a lot of the Carrie-world seems to reflect the ugliness of modern reality.

I may be misremembering, but isn't there a throwaway line where Janey-E tells the two guys to look in the mirror at themselves? This may tie in to Audrey, Cooper, and the theme of fractured identity and multiple planes of reality?

Just spitballing based on what we have. It simultaneously feels like a lot to process and not nearly enough to go on.

It is interesting that Blevins isn't credited in Part 18, which feels like DKL hiding the ball in a way he typically doesn't.

claaa7 wrote:it reminds me of how Lynch used the actor Gene Silva to portray both the Club Silencio manager and Cookie downtown in Mulholland Dr. to this day i have never seen a theory that connects the how and why.. i know he is credited twice so it's different characters.


For me, Silencio exists on a different plane of existence from Betty's world, a between-worlds place. It may even be the highest plane of reality: note that when everything else is gone, the "Silencio" woman is left watching. For me, the MC is sort of a guide, or in TP terminology, a Lodge-spirit. It makes dream-sense to me that he is a protector to Adam in the Betty-world, but I'm not sure there is an articulable "explanation."
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Novalis » Thu Sep 28, 2017 6:45 am

Let's assume that Frost's retweet is a tacit confirmation, and see where this goes. Let's start with the pessimistic, 'nothing-means-anything, Lynch-is-a-troll' options that I see circulating again, and then gradually consider more optimistic / charitable possibilities.

On a pragmatic level (and not meaning to be in any way rude to the actor) Blevins has an nice amount of forehead available for staging a head wound. And the fact this particular role is uncredited could be taken as a sign that it may not have been intended as significant who was playing the part; maybe Lynch just grabbed one of the most appropriate seeming cast members to fill a very minor, non-speaking role that hadn't been cast or whose intended player didn't make it for some reason.

However, if this was the case it must have been obvious that fans would spot the doubling up. Which leads us to the conclusion that either i) Lynch considered this, and thought the little bit of added mystery accentuated the story or ii) it was always intended from the beginning.

If it was part of the long-term picture to have Blevins reused here, then once again we are faced with two possibilities: either i) this character is Tommy (explaining why he is not credited as a separate character, but not explaining why Tommy is not credited for this episode) or ii) this is somebody else, in the sense that Carrie is somebody else to Laura (but this still does not account for the lack of mention in the credits, which usually carry these doubles as 'Carrie / Laura' or 'Richard / Cooper').

Assuming it wasn't just a roll of the dice decision as some folks are claiming on Reddit (which is also perfectly acceptable to me artistically by the way), our confusion at this re-use of an actor seems to stem from the fact that we don't know which of these above conclusions to arrive at. We don't know who Blevins is playing here, or even -- and this is the kicker -- if the apparent doubling is supposed to carry any informational content or is just an aesthetic, formal, choice made purely for the way it deepens the already deeply uncanny affective quality of this particular mise en scène.

We can't ask Lynch, he'll no doubt play death of the author on us. Frost is a possibility. Maybe someone in his social network could tweet out a few theories and see if any get a like or a retweet. Does Blevins have online presence? We could ask who he thinks he was playing, or what he was told.

My (provisional) thinking is this: Carrie's place is a setting that been carefully arranged to suggest certain things about her lifestyle. There are knocked over plant pots and tin cans in the front yard, which is uncultivated and barren; a car wheel leans against the outside wall, next to a dusty, unused garden chair; the paint on the doorframe is flaking away; the phone starts ringing urgently but Carrie will not take the call; the interior is drab and largely colourless -- the walls look to be bare plaster painted in a very pale olive, and look in places to need some patching up; the pictures that are hanging are folksy, generic and unmatched,as if some have been there for a long time and perhaps belonged to former, older, residents, while some (the three-panelled calligraphy display in the hallway area) are more modern additions; loo rolls are stacked up in the living area next to a vacuum cleaner and a trash can; the hearth / fireplace area is littered with what seems to be decorator's equipment. On a table, next to what may be either a giant coin bottle or an empty water cooler tank, beneath a very generic watercolour landscape and an equally generic tablelamp -- also extremely neutral in colour and unlit -- stands an empty portrait frame. Yes, it's blank. You don't arrange a setting this carefully, and have a lead character look around it, tracking his POV, unless you want it to mean something, be it to create an atmosphere or to do some narrative work. We've seen details like the white horse ornament, we've seen the telegraph / utility pole, but we are also shown this hulking cadaver of a man previously seen as a loan shark back in Dougie's Vegas. You don't make a backdrop this characterless and then drop significant details like the horse, the pole, the blank portrait frame, and a murder victim in it unless they are carrying some weight and doing some work for you. What is that work?

Well, this is Carrie Paige's place. She looks like Laura Palmer, and seems to somehow get stirred up by the mention of Sarah Palmer. She's played by the same actor as Laura. The white horse from Sarah's vision is on her mantelpiece. A portrait frame by the fireside -- not the same kind as the one that Sarah will later attempt to smash up, but still a significant detail -- lacks any memorable portrait photograph. The same telegraph pole we have seen many, many times now stands outside the apartment. The common theme here, running through all these elements of the mise en scène, is a largely visual collection that refers us back to the world in which Laura lived and died. We feel that this world is 'wrong' because while it is clearly different there is just enough familiarity in it to make it unheimlich. This is the work that all these items are doing, the load they are bearing.

À propos, it is not unreasonable to assume that the dead body with the gunshot wound also will also contribute to this air of disquieting familiarity, while also serving in its own right as a disturbing piece of set. This is especially the case if we recognise the actor, or find him 'eerily like' someone we have already seen on the other side. A great deal of the disquiet around this body, however, is generated by the fact that he isn't spoken about, and only really raises a passing, if shocked, reaction from the visiting Richard/Cooper. Otherwise he's very much treated as furniture, as set dressing. This works to further defamiliarise Richard, who is by now obviously no longer the Cooper we knew from before.

So, all in all the choice of this actor feeds into the thematic stream of this sequence: the play of the familiar and unfamiliar that is necessary for the generation of the uncanny affective qualities. If this was the result of a dice throw, it was a very, very, lucky throw.

What it means on a narrative, in-world level, I'll leave to fan theory.

I don't have one yet.
As a matter of fact, 'Chalfont' was the name of the people that rented this space before. Two Chalfonts. Weird, huh?
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Theories & Speculation (SPOILERS)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Sat Oct 07, 2017 5:54 pm

Not really a theory, but interesting to note given that Judy is credited as “Experiment”: In TSDoLP, Laura says on 9/10/86 that BOB treats her like an experiment. On an undated entry between 8/02/88 and 8/10/88, she tells BOB, “I’m an experiment,” and he notes that she said that once before.

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