Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

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LateReg
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby LateReg » Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:08 pm

Mr. Reindeer wrote:DKL likes “bad”/quirky/nonrealistic/artificial acting sometimes. Check out the BTS footage of Lillard and Cornelia Guest rehearsing the prison scene. Guest gives a much more subdued/natural performance in the rehearsal and DKL is clearly not into it. Presumably, he amped Guest up to the overblown soap opera performance she gave, which many have complained about.

Bell’s performance worked fine for me. I thought she was very effective in some scenes (such as the silent scene where she looks at Cooper’s fingerprints — a deceptively tricky thing to perform — and the scene where she is inducted into Blue Rose). I understand why people find her performance stiff or artificial, although I do think it’s been blown out of proportion because she’s a singer, and I think some people came into the season intent on disliking her. That’s not to say that everyone isn’t entitled to his or her opinion, but I never got the vitriol. I’ve actually come to find her performance quite charming.


I'd agree with all of that about Bell. And I also like Guest's performance as well. Admittedly, I was so on guard throughout much of The Return that I didn't know what to make of certain elements on my first (or second!) viewing, and both those actresses were part of that unsteady ground for me. But I loved Guest's performance on second viewing onwards and find Bell, as you said, quite charming.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Tue Jan 30, 2018 5:41 pm

What I like about Bell’s performance is that, while her physicality is a pinup-girl/Marilyn Monroe version of an FBI agent, her demeanor is earnest, girlishly enthusiastic, and proper in a way that befits the TP Cooper-fitered vision of the FBI. Yes, she’s a little awkward, simultaneously goofy and stiff...but I know people in my life who behave similarly. Is the performance largely the result of Bell’s inexperience? Probably. Is it also exactly what DKL wanted? I think so. In any event, I do find it really endearing, and much prefer it to Annie Wersching’s sardonic take.
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby darthbozia » Fri Feb 02, 2018 8:14 am

I thoroughly enjoyed Season 3 and watched each part up to 25 times (Yes, I’m a bit obsessed) but am now rewatching the series on Blu-Ray and have to say that it’s a completely new experience. I LOVE it!!! Without the elements of surprise and frustration of not knowing what will happen next, it’s become a much clearer picture than I’d initially thought. I feel like I’ve got a complete grasp on the series that is deeply personal. As it is a deeply personal, I rarely share my explanations or theories on this series. It’s unlike anything I’ve ever experienced on TV or movies. In fact, it is unlike any experience I’ve had with any art form. Twin Peaks, David Lynch, and Mark Frost along with countless others are directly responsible for me writing. On that note, I (and my co-writer, Jamie Hughes) presently have our script for a television series sitting on the desk of one of the top three studios I’d want to produce this show. Nothing may come of it as has happened before with smaller studios and usually due to financing the series but I still feel as if I owe them a huge amount of gratitude. I’ll share a small story about my personal feelings of Twin Peaks:
When If first watched it, my friend had a VHS tape of the pilot and Season 1. At this point, Season 2 was not available and there weren’t even plans of releasing it. I had missed the series when it aired because I thought it was simply another nighttime soap which were popular at this point. My ignorance was about to be rewarded. We flipped on the tape and it was as if my skull was peeled back and my thoughts and interests were being read by Lynch and Frost. I’d never felt this way. Star Wars has similar impact as a child but it didn’t come close to my thoughts and interests as an adult. I was emotional and connected to this program. Each image seemed to be the skewed way I had presently been viewing the world. The stoplight was the nail in the coffin of my childhood. I was now an adult watching something that fell not short of my own fantasies becoming images on my friend’s tv screen. I was sold. I also realized that there was an audience for the types of things I wanted to create and create I did. I wrote story upon story of things that would fit right in to Lynch and Frost’s worlds. All my own fictions. Not a bit of Fan Fiction. Jamie and I cranked out stories that could be movies, plays, audio recording, television shows, etc. We’ve not quite had our break yet but we haven’t given up hope and this is all because of Twin Peaks.
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Deep Thought
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Deep Thought » Fri Feb 02, 2018 9:55 am

darthbozia wrote: . . . I LOVE it!!! . . .


Maybe, just maybe, this is in the wrong thread. :lol:
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mtwentz
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby mtwentz » Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:22 pm

Mr. Reindeer wrote:What I like about Bell’s performance is that, while her physicality is a pinup-girl/Marilyn Monroe version of an FBI agent, her demeanor is earnest, girlishly enthusiastic, and proper in a way that befits the TP Cooper-fitered vision of the FBI. Yes, she’s a little awkward, simultaneously goofy and stiff...but I know people in my life who behave similarly. Is the performance largely the result of Bell’s inexperience? Probably. Is it also exactly what DKL wanted? I think so. In any event, I do find it really endearing, and much prefer it to Annie Wersching’s sardonic take.


I must admit, Chrysta Bell rubbed me the wrong way when I was streamcasting the red carpet premiere. And I really, really did not like her the first couple of episodes, especially that part about wearing the wire.

But Tammy grew on me over the course of the series and I think Chrysta did a good job.
"Dougie is COOPER? How the Hell is this!?"
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Rami Airola » Sat Feb 03, 2018 7:56 am

I've had a bit of a change of heart here.

At first I was disappointed by The Secret History.

Then I was disappointed by the new season (even though I liked and even loved many things in it).

Then I heard rumors and read some spoilers of The Final Dossier, and was even more disappointed.

I thought I had lost most of my over 25 years long interest in Twin Peaks. My old enthusiasm just wasn't there anymore.

Now I took a chance with The Final Dossier and, my god, out of all things THAT got me back in, I think.
I thoroughly enjoyed the last third of the book and actually started to feel the old enthusiasm creeping back in!

EDIT:
Maybe this was all about expectations, after all.
I anticipated The Secret History and the third season so much that they disappointed me, but now as my expectations were lower than low with The Final Dossier it ended up surprising me very positively (the book has its issues though, but damn it, the last third of the book just managed to hook me in - and maybe even better than the actual third season managed to do!)
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Audrey Horne
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Audrey Horne » Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:27 am

All this positivity is ruining my ruinment (a word?) of the third season.
God, I love this music. Isn't it too dreamy?
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Aqwell » Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:38 pm

Audrey Horne wrote:All this positivity is ruining my ruinment (a word?) of the third season.
The thread has been invaded by happy shiny people, that's a fact. Resistance is futile. Oops, wrong show... Fortunatly my ruinment is intact. Yesterday I rewatched some scenes, because I'm a bit masochistic. Bad Coop's ones are ok (even the laughable deadly facial massage is kinda fun), for the rest... ouch. What did I hate the most ? Good question, thank you for (not) asking. Except for the overall nonsense I will say Laura Dern. Her character is unpleasant, useless and looks like an old call girl, yikes. Sherilyn Fenn's acting is quite bad too, but she's got less screen time than the other hag, thank god. :mrgreen:
Last edited by Aqwell on Sun Feb 04, 2018 9:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
AnotherBlueRoseCase
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby AnotherBlueRoseCase » Sun Feb 04, 2018 7:04 am

NormoftheAndes wrote:
More responses:

"To me, it kind of reads like a pompous writer trying to sound collegiate. People are more than entitled to dislike the show and have a negative opinion, but this specifically comes off pretentious and a bit shallow. Good vocabulary doesn't always indicate intelligent critical thinking. I personally disagree with their point, but it doesn't necessarily devaluate it either."

"Yes, because David Lynch, the most famous and revered arthouse director of all time, save for perhaps Fellini and Kubrick, is in serious need of having art properly defined by a grumpy paralegal with an internet connection and $60,000 worth of art school debt."

"yikes, you can practically see every single party the writer was never invited to with each thesaurus-sourced word"

"Anti enlightenment and anti renaissance ?
Well, that's the definition of romanticism, no?"

"Is Twin Peaks really supposed to be postmodern?"

"Ignore the trolls, especially the ones who have fancy words yet have no salient point."

"r/iamverysmart"

I noticed the post in the fb group TWIN PEAKS: THE RETURN. :)


These responses are quoted as if they're some kind of devastating defeat for Gabriel, when all they do is illustrate yet again the fact that on average defences of the show, um, haven't been all that impressive. But of course NormoftheAndes edited out the real heavyweights:

A is A says, to me, that the author of the mini-screed is an adherent of the desperately flawed philosophy of Ayn Rand.

I'd say a midnight sneak visit from Buella and Otis is in order. They'll bring the salt.
What's his address?

Very snobbish and written with pomp.
I don’t give a flying fook what anyone else thinks really but this person tried to get as many big buzz words in as possible making it almost unreadable. Im a simple woman, I know what I enjoy, twin peaks is part of me and nothing or nobody will change that, I enjoyed the return but I will need to rewatch and digest it at least 100 more times yet x

Twin Peaks is my candle and it burns bright...lighting my way. This 'piece' doesn't really say anything coherent amidst the long words...as Diane would say...Fuck you!!!...as my mum would say...if you've got nothing nice to say....don't say it...seems like a pointless criticism. I'm all for a debate. Load of old shite...

Randian bollocks

A equals A. So the fuck what?

----------------------------------------------------

LateReg (an actual heavyweight):

(I've even had civil conversations with AnotherBlueRoseCase and he's complimented me on them!)


'even'? :D In our many exchanges I can't remember anything like lack of civility. Profound mistakenness on your part, of course, :wink: but we pretty much kept the head.
Lynch on Trump, mid-2018: "He could go down as one of the greatest presidents in history."
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mtwentz
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby mtwentz » Sun Feb 04, 2018 9:16 am

Aqwell wrote:
Audrey Horne wrote:All this positivity is ruining my ruinment (a word?) of the third season.
The thread has been invaded by happy shiny people, that's a fact. Resistance is futile. Oops, wrong show... Fortunatly my ruinment is intact. Yesterday I rewatched some scenes, because I'm a bit masochistic. Bad Coop's ones are ok (even the laughable deadly facial massage is kinda fun), for the rest... ouch. What did I hate the most ? Good question, thank you for (not) asking. Except for the overall nonsense I will say Laura Dern. Her character is unpleasant, useless and looks like an old call girl, yikes. Sherilyn Fenn's acting is quite bad too, but she's got less screen time than the other hag, thank god. :mrgreen:


I consider the Laura Dern/Tulpa Diane one of the great payoffs in all of of Twin Peaks-dom. Yeah, she seemed to hit one note over and over for several episodes, but that final scene with Gordon, Albert and Tammy right before she tries to shoot them was just fantastic in my opinion. And it got even better when she told the one-armed man , 'Fuck you', knowing she is about to be destroyed.

It reminds me of the kind of spunk and defiance of Mimi Rogers' character at the ending of The Rapture- man/woman's ability to stick the middle finger right in the face of his or her creator. Very few filmmakers are brave enough to venture in that territory- Lynch was able to do so in this case while maintaining deniability that it was a metaphor for how Christian fundamentalists try to box us into a virtual prison of 'God's rules', and how we always have the right to give the middle finger to anyone who tries to chain us with religious dogma.
"Dougie is COOPER? How the Hell is this!?"
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NormoftheAndes
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby NormoftheAndes » Sun Feb 04, 2018 9:21 am

AnotherBlueRoseCase wrote:
NormoftheAndes wrote:
More responses:

"To me, it kind of reads like a pompous writer trying to sound collegiate. People are more than entitled to dislike the show and have a negative opinion, but this specifically comes off pretentious and a bit shallow. Good vocabulary doesn't always indicate intelligent critical thinking. I personally disagree with their point, but it doesn't necessarily devaluate it either."

"Yes, because David Lynch, the most famous and revered arthouse director of all time, save for perhaps Fellini and Kubrick, is in serious need of having art properly defined by a grumpy paralegal with an internet connection and $60,000 worth of art school debt."

"yikes, you can practically see every single party the writer was never invited to with each thesaurus-sourced word"

"Anti enlightenment and anti renaissance ?
Well, that's the definition of romanticism, no?"

"Is Twin Peaks really supposed to be postmodern?"

"Ignore the trolls, especially the ones who have fancy words yet have no salient point."

"r/iamverysmart"

I noticed the post in the fb group TWIN PEAKS: THE RETURN. :)


These responses are quoted as if they're some kind of devastating defeat for Gabriel, when all they do is illustrate yet again the fact that on average defences of the show, um, haven't been all that impressive. But of course NormoftheAndes edited out the real heavyweights:

A is A says, to me, that the author of the mini-screed is an adherent of the desperately flawed philosophy of Ayn Rand.

I'd say a midnight sneak visit from Buella and Otis is in order. They'll bring the salt.
What's his address?

Very snobbish and written with pomp.
I don’t give a flying fook what anyone else thinks really but this person tried to get as many big buzz words in as possible making it almost unreadable. Im a simple woman, I know what I enjoy, twin peaks is part of me and nothing or nobody will change that, I enjoyed the return but I will need to rewatch and digest it at least 100 more times yet x

Twin Peaks is my candle and it burns bright...lighting my way. This 'piece' doesn't really say anything coherent amidst the long words...as Diane would say...Fuck you!!!...as my mum would say...if you've got nothing nice to say....don't say it...seems like a pointless criticism. I'm all for a debate. Load of old shite...

Randian bollocks

A equals A. So the fuck what?


They were not supposed to be a defeat of any kind to Gabriel, just a response. When there is such strong reaction to season 3 its bound to be responded to, right?
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Aqwell
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Aqwell » Sun Feb 04, 2018 1:04 pm

NormoftheAndes wrote:They were not supposed to be a defeat of any kind to Gabriel, just a response. When there is such strong reaction to season 3 its bound to be responded to, right?
Then why don't you use your own words if I may ask? Using those of others, mean comments from social media on top of that, maybe not the most glorious move. :(
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NormoftheAndes
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby NormoftheAndes » Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:29 pm

Aqwell wrote:
NormoftheAndes wrote:They were not supposed to be a defeat of any kind to Gabriel, just a response. When there is such strong reaction to season 3 its bound to be responded to, right?
Then why don't you use your own words if I may ask? Using those of others, mean comments from social media on top of that, maybe not the most glorious move. :(


The original post was mean so I'm sure they can take reactions from others who think their choice of words is laughable! If people are going to be wholly disrespectful or negative towards Twin Peaks they should be quite able to overcome any viewpoints that come along in response.

Even if I really didn't like season 3, I wouldn't make an avatar saying 'the TURD season' as I have too much respect for Lynch, Frost and co.
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Audrey Horne
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby Audrey Horne » Sun Feb 04, 2018 7:13 pm

Really? Hags? Really? I’m not going to go into everything wrong with that statement.... really?!

I thought everyone looked and did great (except one, but think they were just miscast and the character wasn’t needed.) My beef will always be the story structure. Again the analogy that it had all the best ingredients but the main course was mangled. Oh, and that they needed Engels on script duty.
God, I love this music. Isn't it too dreamy?
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Re: Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group (SPOILERS)

Postby IcedOver » Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:01 pm

Aqwell wrote:What did I hate the most ? Good question, thank you for (not) asking. Except for the overall nonsense I will say Laura Dern. Her character is unpleasant, useless and looks like an old call girl, yikes. Sherilyn Fenn's acting is quite bad too, but she's got less screen time than the other hag, thank god. :mrgreen:

I agree about Dern, not as the worst thing in the show but as almost unwatchable. It was less a bad performance than a horribly conceived and written (and costumed) character. Imagine if they had allowed her to look and behave in an attractive way (or cast an actress who currently looks more attractive), how much more heft the relationship between her and Coop would have had. It would have been easier to imagine him holding something for her. I still haven't re-watched the final two in full, where their characters come together, but having the relationship between Coop and Diane, a character we've never met, be so important, it doesn't work for me her being so unpleasant, tulpa or whatever. A lesser known actress should have been cast. Alternatively, how about Dern and Watts swapping roles? Useless speculation, though.

As for Fenn, I disagree. I think he used her faded looks very well, to illustrate the passage of time as she fell back into her old dance, same as several characters are "not who they used to be" (to paraphrase the NIN song "Came Back Haunted" for which Lynch did the video). Her shrewish behavior fit into the "fuck you" to the audience in terms of the relation to the original series. I liked her scenes for the most part, and thought she was good in them.
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