Parts 1 & 2 - My log has a message for you & The stars turn and a time presents itself (SPOILERS)

Discussion of each of the 18 parts of Twin Peaks the Return

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Poiuyt
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Re: Parts 1 & 2 - My log has a message for you & The stars turn and a time presents itself (SPOILERS)

Postby Poiuyt » Tue May 01, 2018 10:23 am

mtwentz wrote:
Poiuyt wrote:so i watched the premiere again right after finishing the season... just a couple quick, random thoughts (spoilers!):

cooper and phyllis were seeing each other? i never put two and two together until hastings mentioned that there was "maybe somebody else" or something along those lines, in addition to phyllis' affair with george.

Spoiler:
duncan is a tulpa... jeez, it's almost like cooper went around populating the world with tulpas in preparation for his "escape plan"...

POSSIBLE PLOT HOLE: shouldn't the FBI have found footage of cooper appearing in the glass box?? alongside the footage of the experiment and cooper/weird monk guy?


overall: this story is much more complex than i gave it credit for on the first watch. what an enormous puzzle.


I never remember it being revealed Duncan is a tulpa. Where did you get that?


oh. i guess it's never stated outright. at the very least, cooper's, what, blackmailing him, or holding something over his head?

later in the season,
Spoiler:
his bullet wound from chantal looked so completely fake that i assumed it had to be a tip-off that duncan wasn't human.

same with roger; his "blood echo" mirrors that of phyllis in the premiere, and phyllis was definitely a tulpa, right? ("you mimic human behavior perfectly")
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mtwentz
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Re: Parts 1 & 2 - My log has a message for you & The stars turn and a time presents itself (SPOILERS)

Postby mtwentz » Tue May 01, 2018 12:52 pm

Poiuyt wrote:
mtwentz wrote:
Poiuyt wrote:so i watched the premiere again right after finishing the season... just a couple quick, random thoughts (spoilers!):

cooper and phyllis were seeing each other? i never put two and two together until hastings mentioned that there was "maybe somebody else" or something along those lines, in addition to phyllis' affair with george.

Spoiler:
duncan is a tulpa... jeez, it's almost like cooper went around populating the world with tulpas in preparation for his "escape plan"...

POSSIBLE PLOT HOLE: shouldn't the FBI have found footage of cooper appearing in the glass box?? alongside the footage of the experiment and cooper/weird monk guy?


overall: this story is much more complex than i gave it credit for on the first watch. what an enormous puzzle.


I never remember it being revealed Duncan is a tulpa. Where did you get that?


oh. i guess it's never stated outright. at the very least, cooper's, what, blackmailing him, or holding something over his head?

later in the season,
Spoiler:
his bullet wound from chantal looked so completely fake that i assumed it had to be a tip-off that duncan wasn't human.

same with roger; his "blood echo" mirrors that of phyllis in the premiere, and phyllis was definitely a tulpa, right? ("you mimic human behavior perfectly")


Tulpas get sucked immediately back into the Lodge upon death, like Tulpa Diane.

I think they just ran out of budget on special effects/makeup effects, that's why the assassination of Duncan was a bit cheesy.

As for Phyllis, DoppelCoop is merely stating, in my view, that he was able to manipulate her by his understanding of human nature. In other words, she was predictable in her human frailties.
"Dougie is COOPER? How the Hell is this!?"
Poiuyt
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2017 3:26 am

Re: Parts 1 & 2 - My log has a message for you & The stars turn and a time presents itself (SPOILERS)

Postby Poiuyt » Tue May 01, 2018 2:34 pm

mtwentz wrote:
Poiuyt wrote:
mtwentz wrote:
I never remember it being revealed Duncan is a tulpa. Where did you get that?


oh. i guess it's never stated outright. at the very least, cooper's, what, blackmailing him, or holding something over his head?

later in the season,
Spoiler:
his bullet wound from chantal looked so completely fake that i assumed it had to be a tip-off that duncan wasn't human.

same with roger; his "blood echo" mirrors that of phyllis in the premiere, and phyllis was definitely a tulpa, right? ("you mimic human behavior perfectly")


Tulpas get sucked immediately back into the Lodge upon death, like Tulpa Diane.

I think they just ran out of budget on special effects/makeup effects, that's why the assassination of Duncan was a bit cheesy.

As for Phyllis, DoppelCoop is merely stating, in my view, that he was able to manipulate her by his understanding of human nature. In other words, she was predictable in her human frailties.


Hmm. You're right about the tulpas I suppose. Why have the same "echo" effect when Roger and Phyllis die, though? Lodge inhabitants?
LateReg
Posts: 630
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Re: Parts 1 & 2 - My log has a message for you & The stars turn and a time presents itself (SPOILERS)

Postby LateReg » Wed May 02, 2018 2:23 pm

mtwentz wrote:
Poiuyt wrote:
mtwentz wrote:
I never remember it being revealed Duncan is a tulpa. Where did you get that?


oh. i guess it's never stated outright. at the very least, cooper's, what, blackmailing him, or holding something over his head?

later in the season,
Spoiler:
his bullet wound from chantal looked so completely fake that i assumed it had to be a tip-off that duncan wasn't human.

same with roger; his "blood echo" mirrors that of phyllis in the premiere, and phyllis was definitely a tulpa, right? ("you mimic human behavior perfectly")


Tulpas get sucked immediately back into the Lodge upon death, like Tulpa Diane.

I think they just ran out of budget on special effects/makeup effects, that's why the assassination of Duncan was a bit cheesy.

As for Phyllis, DoppelCoop is merely stating, in my view, that he was able to manipulate her by his understanding of human nature. In other words, she was predictable in her human frailties.


I'd be very surprised if the Duncan effect was that way only because they ran out of money for effects. It just seems like something Lynch liked and fits with the current aesthetic. And yes, it could mean that something is up with that reality. Or not. But regardless, in the past Lynch has painstakingly constructed brain matter for head wounds. I don't think that would have cost much to construct a tangible fake head and blow it up, so it doesn't seem to me a matter of money, but rather a choice between digital or practical effects in the scene, and Lynch chose digital. But like most elements of the show, we'll never know.
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Mr. Reindeer
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Re: Parts 1 & 2 - My log has a message for you & The stars turn and a time presents itself (SPOILERS)

Postby Mr. Reindeer » Wed May 02, 2018 6:11 pm

We know that the show had some absolutely stunning CGI, particulary in Part 8. The nuclear blast and the frog-moth are among the most impressive special effects in DKL’s ouevre, and as incredible as anything on, say, Game of Thrones.

We also know from Pierre Buffin that DKL went out of his way to “dumb down” certain CGI that the studio produced, particularly in regards to the “tulpa deaths,” preferring a more prehistoric/flat look closer to the raw style of his own paintings.

Given all that, it seems pretty obvious to me that the Phyllis and Todd deaths are the way they are due to conscious decisions (the morph was clearly added to Phyllis on purpose). Whether this was due to some deeper plot meaning or just due to DKL’s quirky awesthetic whimsies, we’ll probably never know. But it certainly is interesting that it happens on these two particular characters’ deaths, and I don’t think it’s unreasonable to theorize that something happened to these two after they let Mr. C into their lives, as Todd puts it.

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