Twin Peaks Return: The Profoundly Disappointed Support Group

[wAtChLaR]

No one of us is the arbiter of the objective meaning or value of this material. Which rather defeats the purpose of claiming this is a fascinating sociological study of other people's mass delusion in liking a TV show you don't.

Like it, don't like it, cool. But the constant attempts to recontextualize Lynch's choices or other folks' valid enjoyment of the show as some sort of phenomenon of disorder are really just another way to talk down to people AFAIC.

i will never understand individuals who come to discussion boards to trash someone's art...

[mlsstwrt]

In other words, the possibility to initiate and contribute to international conversation aimed at very specific (and technical) components is so powerful that it inevitably leads to analysis and research of meanings in a way that is unprecedented. Complex products like TP can't be exempt from that, independently of what the artists intentions or the audience tastes are.
GOT is over analyzed, for example. Even a much "simpler" product like TWD has a huge community that does the very things we do on this forum or on the TP reddit.

I'm pretty sure that The Return is made with the full knowledge that viewers will rewatch and obsess over tiny details. Or are we just more alert now? If the pilot was shown for the first time today, would we screenshot and study the artifacts around Pete and Catherine when he goes fishing?

On a slightly related note, alongside all the benefits of the new interactive landscape, there is one thing that's being slowly eroded: Common cultural experiences/symbolism/language/etc. on a larger scale. I'm a bit too young to remember all of these (as well as not being American) but I can only assume that the finale of M*A*S*H, the Frost/Nixon interview, Who shot JR? and so on became part of people's shared experiences. Today, it's all a bit fragmented. Even fans of GOT probably cannot throw out a reference to the show and expect the majority of strangers to "get it".

Totally agree. Shared experiences are being lost. With TV it's too many channels, internet, streaming, etc. Then with music, I've been to a couple of gigs recently and it felt like half the audience was filming the entire thing on their phone. So I was experiencing the gig and they were experiencing filming the gig. Didn't feel like we were sharing much.

Lynch is right about one thing. Things have gotten worse since 1990. Technology gets better, everything else gets worse.

[Rialto]

And Novalis, half of me is tempted to dig into this properly, I feel like it would be fascinating as a study of fandom and the creation of identity (as you can probably tell, my background in semiotics is grounded in Media and Audience studies).

But the other half realises it would entail many re-viewings of The Return, and full immersion in the world of the converted, and I'm not sure I have the temperament

I think I'll give my blood pressure a rest and go back to lurking...

Totally understand. If at any point you change your mind though, just know that you've at least one interested interlocutor that's not going to jump all over what you're saying.

Thanks Novalis, and maybe that's another thread, another day, but I think Yamomoxay is pushing it in a more interesting direction again - is the approach to narrative we've seen here crafted in the expectation of detailed analysis and discussion (and a dedicated Lynch-head audience), or is the ability to go deep creating multiple texts.

Anyhow, poorly worded and inflammatory as my original post was (really got to work on my online voice - it seems to come across more harsh than intended), looking at love of TPTR this way has opened up my understanding of that love a lot more (even if I'm still not feeling it).

To which I'm sure many of you are thinking 'well, duh', but I've been a bit too wrapped up in my disappointment to comprehend others joys in S3

[LateReg]

I guess what's still very important to keep in mind with TPTR is that even back in the day during the original run of seasons 1+2, Lynch was totally being Lynch and wanted to take this vision of his and use it to actually BREAK run-of-the-mill television. Right now in 2016/17, (1) there's no "typical" conservative TV show anymore because many are already doing their own thing (which might be, at least partly, thanks to Twin Peaks) and (2) what we HAVE airing nowadays has changed a huge LOT. Therefore, if one wants to break NEW barriers and bring real ART into the world of TV nowadays, one has to be even MORE extreme/weird/crazy and what some might call "pointless" or lacking the obvious.

At least that'd be my personal interpretation of why this doesn't resonate as much with some.

It will be interesting to see. The original TP shattered the ceiling. I'm not sure if writers/directors see this and think "Yes, this is the future!". To me, this feels like an experiment (and experiments usually have flaws) more than a revolution and breaking of barriers. But just to contradict myself, I could see someone potentially take certain aspects from this show and develop their own ideas. I think more and more people are sophisticated enough to be receptive to slow-paced storytelling. This particular version of it, though, is probably too ambitious. It has far too many minor characters, tries to be too epic, lacks emotional depth and a compelling storyline. Not to mention the blatant trolling from the director. The telling-us-to-be-patient scenes are not bold and genius. It's become predictable and tedious, like with the French girl. As soon as Albert entered the room, you knew what was coming, and that it would take a while. It's one thing knowing you have to be patient to enjoy the full story - we don't need hours and hours of television telling us to wait for it.

Good post. I think, however, whether good or bad, that this is absolutely shattering barriers. Every barrier. Whether anyone chooses to follow it is a different story, but like you said I can see people cherry-picking aspects of it for new series and new moods and new sounds in television. Which, incidentally, is exactly what people did with the original series. No one copied it whole hog. They copied individual elements of it. I expect the same to happen again.

[waferwhitemilk]

I think Lynch is a very lonely and depressed individual and Dougie is basically Lynch. All these people around him who think he's great and suck up to him, but basically need him to do things for their own ends and have no real care for him at all. I again wanna point to the scene where he's on a deadline for his boss and his wife hands him all these papers and he has to do something with it, to come up with stuff, to be productive, to make money, but he just sits there with a totally blank stare not having a clue what to do, looking at those insurance papers which surely are a universal symbol for something super boring, without passion, dead. That to me is the main story, and the whole contrived other story with Gordon Cole is so bad and clunky on purpose just to show how pointless and senseless the whole "return" endeavour really is to Lynch. It's all really very sad and meta and basically a call for help.

[Metamorphia]

I think Lynch is a very lonely and depressed individual and Dougie is basically Lynch. All these people around him who think he's great and suck up to him, but basically need him to do things for their own ends and have no real care for him at all. I again wanna point to the scene where he's on a deadline for his boss and his wife hands him all these papers and he has to do something with it, to come up with stuff, to be productive, to make money, but he just sits there with a totally blank stare not having a clue what to do, looking at those insurance papers which surely are a universal symbol for something super boring, without passion, dead. That to me is the main story, and the whole contrived other story with Gordon Cole is so bad and clunky on purpose just to show how pointless and senseless the whole "return" endeavour really is to Lynch. It's all really very sad and meta and basically a call for help.

Are you ok?

[Twin Peaks Podcast]

Even though episode 12 was my least favorite so far, it was one of my favorite to talk about with my Twin Peaks Podcast cohosts. ANd I've heard from many listeners that they also really enjoyed listening to it after being disappointed in episode 12.

So I offer it to anyone here who wants to commiserate about Twin Peaks with us.

Warning: Don't listen if you love this new season, you'll only get mad.
http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/201 ... -been.html

[wAtChLaR]

Are you ok?

the only thing missing on bulletin boards is a MUTE button

[Mallard]

Warning: Don't listen if you love this new season, you'll only get mad.
http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/201 ... -been.html

Hmm. Sounds like the sort of thing only a doppelgänger would say...

[Guardian]

I think Lynch is a very lonely and depressed individual and Dougie is basically Lynch. All these people around him who think he's great and suck up to him, but basically need him to do things for their own ends and have no real care for him at all. I again wanna point to the scene where he's on a deadline for his boss and his wife hands him all these papers and he has to do something with it, to come up with stuff, to be productive, to make money, but he just sits there with a totally blank stare not having a clue what to do, looking at those insurance papers which surely are a universal symbol for something super boring, without passion, dead. That to me is the main story, and the whole contrived other story with Gordon Cole is so bad and clunky on purpose just to show how pointless and senseless the whole "return" endeavour really is to Lynch. It's all really very sad and meta and basically a call for help.

That the 'Return' is Lynch' call for help. Ha ha!, I laughed out loud when I read that!

But it's interesting to read your analysis of that paperwork deadline scene.

One could perhaps also analyse it as Dougie being Lynch/Frost making up nonsensical scribblings, handing it over to his boss (the viewers) who doesn't at first understand squat, but then suddenly make some sort of sense out of it, and is impressed!
But Dougie doesn't understand why the boss is so impressed of his scribblings, there was no intent of meaning in the first place.

It's strange being in this club of profoundly disappointed, because I find that I often disagree with people in this group of what scenes, stories, performances, and episodes are the worst.

For instance, episode 12 must perhaps be the one which the most people have disliked the most so far.
But I actually got surprised, and even liked it a little (for an S3 episode). It still has all the basic problems that the whole The Return has had.
But I actually think it's the best one so far. Grace' performance must be the best one I've seen this whole season. Made me think that the Return perhaps isn't a parody mockery show after all...
For almost the first time during S3 I actually cared for and got interested in a character. And believed what was being shown.

So, not only am I shocked that The Return turned out being the way it is, but also the diversity of what people enjoy and what they dislike / hate in it.

[LurkerAtTheThreshold]

I think Lynch is a very lonely and depressed individual and Dougie is basically Lynch. All these people around him who think he's great and suck up to him, but basically need him to do things for their own ends and have no real care for him at all. I again wanna point to the scene where he's on a deadline for his boss and his wife hands him all these papers and he has to do something with it, to come up with stuff, to be productive, to make money, but he just sits there with a totally blank stare not having a clue what to do, looking at those insurance papers which surely are a universal symbol for something super boring, without passion, dead. That to me is the main story, and the whole contrived other story with Gordon Cole is so bad and clunky on purpose just to show how pointless and senseless the whole "return" endeavour really is to Lynch. It's all really very sad and meta and basically a call for help.

That the 'Return' is Lynch' call for help. Ha ha!, I laughed out loud when I read that!

But it's interesting to read your analysis of that paperwork deadline scene.

One could perhaps also analyse it as Dougie being Lynch/Frost making up nonsensical scribblings, handing it over to his boss (the viewers) who doesn't at first understand squat, but then suddenly make some sort of sense out of it, and is impressed!
But Dougie doesn't understand why the boss is so impressed of his scribblings, there was no intent of meaning in the first place.

It's strange being in this club of profoundly disappointed, because I find that I often disagree with people in this group of what scenes, stories, performances, and episodes are the worst.

For instance, episode 12 must perhaps be the one which the most people have disliked the most so far.
But I actually got surprised, and even liked it a little (for an S3 episode). It still has all the basic problems that the whole The Return has had.
But I actually think it's the best one so far. Grace' performance must be the best one I've seen this whole season. Made me think that the Return perhaps isn't a parody mockery show after all...
For almost the first time during S3 I actually cared for and got interested in a character. And believed what was being shown.

So, not only am I shocked that The Return turned out being the way it is, but also the diversity of what people enjoy and what they dislike / hate in it.

I'm very much on the same wavelength as you.

Episode 12 was quite enjoyable to me. The Jacoby repetition was absolutely useless, but it's nothing unexpected for the return so I was able to ignore it. Everything else felt like the mpst cohesive plot carrying forward so far.
I feel totally off kilter with everyone mostly.
Couldn't be bothered with episode 8 which was unilaterally praised as the best piece of art in the world. Hated episodes 3 and 4 which people seemed to love.

It's nice to have people who share your POV once in a while. If the next six episodes are of the same calibre as 7, 9, 10, 11 and 12 I may yet leave this series as a satisfied viewer

[Mr. Reindeer]

For instance, episode 12 must perhaps be the one which the most people have disliked the most so far.
But I actually got surprised, and even liked it a little (for an S3 episode). It still has all the basic problems that the whole The Return has had.
But I actually think it's the best one so far. Grace' performance must be the best one I've seen this whole season. Made me think that the Return perhaps isn't a parody mockery show after all...
For almost the first time during S3 I actually cared for and got interested in a character. And believed what was being shown.

So, not only am I shocked that The Return turned out being the way it is, but also the diversity of what people enjoy and what they dislike / hate in it.

I think there's a near-universal consensus that Sarah's scenes (and Grace's incredible performance) are among the highlights of this entire season. Nobody has expressed dislike regarding those scenes (ok, tehnically, I think one poster did this morning). The disappointment with Part 12 stems from other scenes. One great sequence doesn't necessarily salvage an otherwise mediocre hour (a sentiment I imagine many on this thread can relate to).

[yaxomoxay]

Even though episode 12 was my least favorite so far, it was one of my favorite to talk about with my Twin Peaks Podcast cohosts. ANd I've heard from many listeners that they also really enjoyed listening to it after being disappointed in episode 12.

So I offer it to anyone here who wants to commiserate about Twin Peaks with us.

Warning: Don't listen if you love this new season, you'll only get mad.
http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/201 ... -been.html

You guys make me mad every week, yet I keep listening keep up the good job


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Twin Peaks Podcast]

Warning: Don't listen if you love this new season, you'll only get mad.
http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/201 ... -been.html

Hmm. Sounds like the sort of thing only a doppelgänger would say...

Shit, you found me out.

Even though episode 12 was my least favorite so far, it was one of my favorite to talk about with my Twin Peaks Podcast cohosts. ANd I've heard from many listeners that they also really enjoyed listening to it after being disappointed in episode 12.

So I offer it to anyone here who wants to commiserate about Twin Peaks with us.

Warning: Don't listen if you love this new season, you'll only get mad.
http://twinpeakspodcast.blogspot.ca/201 ... -been.html

You guys make me mad every week, yet I keep listening keep up the good job

Well, that's good enough for me I suppose.

[waferwhitemilk]

One could perhaps also analyse it as Dougie being Lynch/Frost making up nonsensical scribblings, handing it over to his boss (the viewers) who doesn't at first understand squat, but then suddenly make some sort of sense out of it, and is impressed! But Dougie doesn't understand why the boss is so impressed of his scribblings, there was no intent of meaning in the first place.

Thanks for your kind reply Guardian! I was thinking along the same lines as you at first vis-a-vis the scribbling scene, seeing it as another trolley joke by Lynch, laughing at his viewers in the knowledge that they would "make sense" and find meaning where none existed. But now i see the scene in a more serious light where it's a representation of Lynch's state of mind while making this reboot, and all the stress it surely must have put on him. Two other things that seem to warrant this way of looking at it: Dougie gets called "Dreamweaver" by a random person walking by, who perhaps stands for all the hardcore TP fans who've been basically badgering him for their TP fix for decades and, by extension, all the people who have enjoyed or been inspired by his creative undertakings in the past. Secundo, the old lady from the casino who leans in and thanks him, calling him mr. Jackpot. Think about it, Lynch must've seemed like a "mr. Jackpot" to a lot of people who he has worked with, whose careers he has helped launch, etc. A remarkable point in that regard is that the lady is basically wearing the same dress as Laura and kisses him in excatly the same manner. Not to take any thing away from Sheryl Lee's awesome performance in FWWM, but without Lynch i don't think we would have ever heard from her. And now the old cast is reunited circling Lynch to reboot their careers, with bills to pay n stuff. That could also explain the widely oscillating levels of quality from scene to scene, Lynch giving every actor what he thinks he or she deserves (just look at Grace vs Sherilyn this last episode for a striking example). I won't go into the meaning of the Jeany-E character too much. Suffice to say you could also see Gordon Cole as a fugue state of Dougie, Lost Highway style, where instead of this stressed out depressed creator with many people depending on him to come up with something grrreeat he becomes an oldschool detective with Chrysta Bell at his side.