Since the final episode of season 3, I've always believed there was plenty of unused footage left over, which could be used in a season 4.Jonah wrote: ↑Thu May 06, 2021 2:10 pm Would Lynch feel the need to do much on location in Washington even if this is more TP? I know he wanted The Return to look and feel like the pilot in parts, but apart from the Palmer house and the diner, weren't all the Great Northern scenes and roadhouse done on sets? Couldn't that easily be replicated again with some second unit stuff from WA? He may not feel the need to reshoot in the diner/could have it recreated on sets, depending on if it's even in it.
Wasn't there something about Kyle, Lynch, Deming and maybe others all being seen at the Salish Lodge or something? Did anything ever come of that?
Season 4? Or is it over after this? Wisteria/Unrecorded Night? Something else? (Speculation thread.)
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- madeleineferguson
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
- NormoftheAndes
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
Even if there were any initial thoughts about looking similar to the pilot, that was clearly turned on its head. The Return just looked nothing like early Twin Peaks.Jonah wrote: ↑Thu May 06, 2021 2:10 pm Would Lynch feel the need to do much on location in Washington even if this is more TP? I know he wanted The Return to look and feel like the pilot in parts, but apart from the Palmer house and the diner, weren't all the Great Northern scenes and roadhouse done on sets? Couldn't that easily be replicated again with some second unit stuff from WA? He may not feel the need to reshoot in the diner/could have it recreated on sets, depending on if it's even in it.
Wasn't there something about Kyle, Lynch, Deming and maybe others all being seen at the Salish Lodge or something? Did anything ever come of that?
Teetotaling and prayer. Their hands touch yours and mine.
Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
I just don't know how that work would legally if the show moved from Showtime to Netflix (or elsewhere) as technically I think the footage would belong to Showtime because they paid for it.madeleineferguson wrote: ↑Thu May 06, 2021 3:09 pmSince the final episode of season 3, I've always believed there was plenty of unused footage left over, which could be used in a season 4.Jonah wrote: ↑Thu May 06, 2021 2:10 pm Would Lynch feel the need to do much on location in Washington even if this is more TP? I know he wanted The Return to look and feel like the pilot in parts, but apart from the Palmer house and the diner, weren't all the Great Northern scenes and roadhouse done on sets? Couldn't that easily be replicated again with some second unit stuff from WA? He may not feel the need to reshoot in the diner/could have it recreated on sets, depending on if it's even in it.
Wasn't there something about Kyle, Lynch, Deming and maybe others all being seen at the Salish Lodge or something? Did anything ever come of that?
- NormoftheAndes
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
Ickles, people have mentioned the possibility of a co-production between Netflix and Showtime. Any footage used like that would have to be licensed. There's so much we likely don't know about. Apparently Lynch made a film in Europe after 2017 that has never been seen. I have no idea what that is but I certainly wouldn't mind more Monica Belucci footage in Paris.
Teetotaling and prayer. Their hands touch yours and mine.
- JackwithOneEye
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
I don't really think Lynch, Deming, Kyle went to WA and filmed in secret in 2019 on Showtime's dime.
and I doubt there's much leftover footage from S3. I think they bled it dry really. maybe a few pieces of coverage from
the top of the stairs at the house, the giant in the redroom, and an Audrey line.
I cant really see them having shot
a whole Richard and Carrie adventure and then hoarding it.
and I doubt there's much leftover footage from S3. I think they bled it dry really. maybe a few pieces of coverage from
the top of the stairs at the house, the giant in the redroom, and an Audrey line.
I cant really see them having shot
a whole Richard and Carrie adventure and then hoarding it.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
Netflix did get involved in El Camino, anything possible I guess.
Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
Yeah but Vince Gilligan can't just raid the vaults for unused b-roll from Breaking Bad shoots and then use those in El Camino.
It's possible the Showtime-TPP contract was different in that Showtime paid a set fee and just had to accept whatever Lynch delivered without any dibs on deleted scenes or unused footage, nor stipulations on where that money goes. But I can't imagine any company exposing themselves to that sort of risk. They stipulated what form the final delIverable took (4K DCP) and when it was to be delivered, and much more besides. I just don't see them saying "here's $50m for 12-18 hours of edited film" without caring about the process itself.
The Knives Out deal with Rian Johnson stipulates a minimum budget, shoot dates, scheduling, some casting, and rights over everything from final distribution to BTS footage. They have to protect themselves from the possibility of Johnson shooting Knives Out II and III on his iPhone while hoarding hours-upon-hours of Arri Alexa rushes from the set for an eventual Knives Out 4 bidding war. That minimum budget related specifically to Knives Out 2 and can't go towards speculatively shooting scenes for use in another entry.
Apart from that, there's absolutely nothing Showtime or CBS can do to prevent Twin Peaks going to Netflix or another network. That choice remains with Lynch and Frost.
It's possible the Showtime-TPP contract was different in that Showtime paid a set fee and just had to accept whatever Lynch delivered without any dibs on deleted scenes or unused footage, nor stipulations on where that money goes. But I can't imagine any company exposing themselves to that sort of risk. They stipulated what form the final delIverable took (4K DCP) and when it was to be delivered, and much more besides. I just don't see them saying "here's $50m for 12-18 hours of edited film" without caring about the process itself.
The Knives Out deal with Rian Johnson stipulates a minimum budget, shoot dates, scheduling, some casting, and rights over everything from final distribution to BTS footage. They have to protect themselves from the possibility of Johnson shooting Knives Out II and III on his iPhone while hoarding hours-upon-hours of Arri Alexa rushes from the set for an eventual Knives Out 4 bidding war. That minimum budget related specifically to Knives Out 2 and can't go towards speculatively shooting scenes for use in another entry.
Apart from that, there's absolutely nothing Showtime or CBS can do to prevent Twin Peaks going to Netflix or another network. That choice remains with Lynch and Frost.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
I dont think unused b roll footage from The Return is worth anything.
some angle from the top of the stairs in the Palmer house ?
CBS/Showtime really has Lynch over a barrel for that ? I dont get it.
it looks to me like a decision was made that the Fireman should be b&w, and not in the lodge.
more I think of it, I think that clip where he says "do you remember" is probably when they were trying to figure out a work-around for MJA,
and they wound up deciding having the tree say "do you remember your doppelganger"
it wouldnt cost a fortune to have Carel Struyken come in and do the scene again anyway. I dunno. I dont get it.
some angle from the top of the stairs in the Palmer house ?
CBS/Showtime really has Lynch over a barrel for that ? I dont get it.
it looks to me like a decision was made that the Fireman should be b&w, and not in the lodge.
more I think of it, I think that clip where he says "do you remember" is probably when they were trying to figure out a work-around for MJA,
and they wound up deciding having the tree say "do you remember your doppelganger"
it wouldnt cost a fortune to have Carel Struyken come in and do the scene again anyway. I dunno. I dont get it.
Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
For me, it's less CBS leveraging it against Lynch and more Lynch wouldn't do something so unprofessional. I know a lot of his works are cowboy productions but that's mostly out of necessity.
There are so many horror stories of right issues for stuff far more innocuous. Some of them even involve the Twin Peaks IP but there are examples far more egregious elsewhere.
As I said earlier, CBS will find it's in their best interests to let Lynch use archive footage which they own distribution for. But that wouldn't, I feel, extend to something so egregious as Lynch just whipping out a box of footage and declaring them the result of x amount of shooting days during The Return.
Again, it's possible Showtime actually agreed to pay a lump sum for a final delIverable without claiming ownership of production yields nor exclusivity of production resources. And therefore this would all be above water and legit (if it happened).
But if they did then Lynch should he applauded for his negotiation skills because he truly held them over a barrel back in 2015.
There are so many horror stories of right issues for stuff far more innocuous. Some of them even involve the Twin Peaks IP but there are examples far more egregious elsewhere.
As I said earlier, CBS will find it's in their best interests to let Lynch use archive footage which they own distribution for. But that wouldn't, I feel, extend to something so egregious as Lynch just whipping out a box of footage and declaring them the result of x amount of shooting days during The Return.
Again, it's possible Showtime actually agreed to pay a lump sum for a final delIverable without claiming ownership of production yields nor exclusivity of production resources. And therefore this would all be above water and legit (if it happened).
But if they did then Lynch should he applauded for his negotiation skills because he truly held them over a barrel back in 2015.
Last edited by Histeria on Thu May 06, 2021 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- David Lich
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
Mr. Reindeer wrote: ↑Thu May 06, 2021 1:01 pm I believe what the Fireman says in the Red Room is, “Do you remember?”
indeed!
https://picosgemelos.tumblr.com/post/17 ... u-remember
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
yeah, which is close to the tree saying 'Do you remember your Doppelganger'.
they had to think up a solution to MJA not coming back.
I really doubt this a gold mine you can make a whole episode out of.
every movie/tv show has some waste and overage.
hell do I care if CBS wasted money on a day of shooting that didnt get used.
I doubt Nevins is panhandling on the street cause of the loss.
they had to think up a solution to MJA not coming back.
I really doubt this a gold mine you can make a whole episode out of.
every movie/tv show has some waste and overage.
hell do I care if CBS wasted money on a day of shooting that didnt get used.
I doubt Nevins is panhandling on the street cause of the loss.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
I know you’re speaking hyperbolically, and I think we’re on the same page on this. But just to be clear, I doubt there were more than a few lines that went unused. I’m not even sure a full scene was cut. TR seems to be one of the tightest productions imaginable in terms of using mostly everything.JackwithOneEye wrote: ↑Thu May 06, 2021 4:17 pm
hell do I care if CBS wasted money on a day of shooting that didnt get used.
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Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
I agree with you 100% Reindeer.
I think these scraps are not much. it's an 18 hour show. I don't think there's much leftover.
and If he needed to license an outtake from CBS, David Lynch is not a student, he can get the money. even in his smaller scale projects, Nina Simone's Sinnerman was in Inland Empire, Kylie Minogue's Locomotion.
This Mortal Coil he couldn't license in BV, and turned out to be blessing, we got Julee Cruise instead.
I think these scraps are not much. it's an 18 hour show. I don't think there's much leftover.
and If he needed to license an outtake from CBS, David Lynch is not a student, he can get the money. even in his smaller scale projects, Nina Simone's Sinnerman was in Inland Empire, Kylie Minogue's Locomotion.
This Mortal Coil he couldn't license in BV, and turned out to be blessing, we got Julee Cruise instead.
Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
To avoid doubt, I was commenting on the unlikely scenario that there's a hidden stash of stuff recorded while shooting The Return that's ready to be put into a new entry.
I agree with both of you in that there isn't actually much left to include regardless of whether it would be tortious to do so.
The discussion pivoted towards outtakes and offcuts but my original point is that the whole thing isn't really feasible in the first place.
I agree with both of you in that there isn't actually much left to include regardless of whether it would be tortious to do so.
The discussion pivoted towards outtakes and offcuts but my original point is that the whole thing isn't really feasible in the first place.
Re: Season 4? Or is it over after this?
Little Eva will be spinning in her grave!JackwithOneEye wrote: ↑Thu May 06, 2021 4:38 pm I agree with you 100% Reindeer.
I think these scraps are not much. it's an 18 hour show. I don't think there's much leftover.
and If he needed to license an outtake from CBS, David Lynch is not a student, he can get the money. even in his smaller scale projects, Nina Simone's Sinnerman was in Inland Empire, Kylie Minogue's Locomotion.
This Mortal Coil he couldn't license in BV, and turned out to be blessing, we got Julee Cruise instead.